Do You Believe in Eternal Hell

[AmbiguousGuy]

So what's the difference between Jehovah and Sam Harris?

Sam Harris is torturing you???? Or threatening to torture you?

Yikes, no wonder you have such an attitude about him.

(I don't see how he's going to keep it up eternally, though. As an atheist, he can't chase you into the Beyond.)

 

[Debater Slayer]

Everyone is born a sinner. In other words their human DNA is tainted with angelic DNA from the days of the fallen watchers.

Once a sinner has faith in Jesus Christ, their DNA transforms and their name is written into the Book of Life, hence they are Born Again.

What gets me is that many people hate Jesus yet vote for satanists that are now going to make world war 3 happen thus proving that the Bible is true to all atheists. Surely many atheist politicians/voters would have dismantled all weapons by now.

Everyone who doesn't want Jesus will be tortured. Its their choice.

So, you are perfectly fine making assumptions about other people's intentions because of what ancient authors said centuries ago. That just makes the kind of fire-and-brimstone torture you described sound even more contemptible to me.

As for "World War 3," the irony is that conservative parties like the GOP, which contain members who seek to impose religious laws on other people, are the ones that tend to be the most interventionist and pro-war out of all the other parties. George W. Bush isn't an atheist, Mitt Romney isn't an atheist, and Ann Coulter is certainly not an atheist, and those are just the tip of the iceberg. Yet we have people who claim that it's the "atheists" who will start a third world war and other similar tribalistic nonsense.

By the way, it's not that I "don't want Jesus"; it's that I find the Bible not to have much worth as an authority on ethical or metaphysical claims. If rejecting what I think are demonstrably inaccurate claims made by ancient authors warrants torture according to your beliefs, then I don't think whatever heaven is promised by those same beliefs is a desirable place either. A place where I would spend eternity with people who are okay with the torture of "7 billion people" (as you put it in your own words) doesn't sound much better to me than some third-world country where the whole population supports an egomaniacal dictator.

 

[Jainarayan]

Everyone is born a sinner. In other words their human DNA is tainted with angelic DNA from the days of the fallen watchers.

Once a sinner has faith in Jesus Christ, their DNA transforms and their name is written into the Book of Life, hence they are Born Again.

This is found exactly where, in the bible?

Everyone who doesn't want Jesus will be tortured. Its their choice.

And the billions of people who've ever lived, and possible countless beings on other worlds who have never heard of Jesus, are going to be tortured?

 

[AmbiguousGuy]

This is found exactly where, in the bible?

I think he said he's learned all this stuff from dreams. He should probably write a new book of Revelation, although it's really hard to get anything into the Christian canon these days.

 

[InChrist]

I believe this life is the time for each person to determine whether to give their life to God or choose to be separated from their Creator forever. And as it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment (Hebrews 9:27).

My perspective from the biblical scriptures is that separation from God who is the only source of life, beauty and goodness will be an eternal hell created not by God torturing anyone, but by one's own self-torment.

 

[CynthiaCypher]

This is found exactly where, in the bible?

It's not found in any Bible I've read.

 

[Jainarayan]

[/I] My perspective from the biblical scriptures is that separation from God who is the only source of life, beauty and goodness will be an eternal hell created not by God torturing anyone, but by one's own self-torment.[/COLOR]

That's the Eastern Orthodox Church's view on it also... hell is eternal separation from God, not physical torture.

 

[CynthiaCypher]

As for "World War 3," the irony is that conservative parties like the GOP, which contain members who seek to impose religious laws on other people, are the ones that tend to be the most interventionist and pro-war out of all the other parties. George W. Bush isn't an atheist, Mitt Romney isn't an atheist, and Ann Coulter is certainly not an atheist, and those are just the tip of the iceberg. Yet we have people who claim that it's the "atheists" who will start a third world war and other similar tribalistic nonsense.

I think he is probably referring to President Obama as our elected satanist and to liberals in general when he speaks about atheists

 

[Debater Slayer]

I think he is probably referring to President Obama as our elected satanist and to liberals in general when he speaks about atheists

Then my post still applies. Conservative parties in general seem warmongering and hostile to certain countries (or even regions); whatever Obama does or has done doesn't change that.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Everyone is born a sinner. In other words their human DNA is tainted with angelic DNA from the days of the fallen watchers.

Once a sinner has faith in Jesus Christ, their DNA transforms and their name is written into the Book of Life, hence they are Born Again.

And I'm sure you have evidence of your DNA claims?

What gets me is that many people hate Jesus yet vote for satanists that are now going to make world war 3 happen thus proving that the Bible is true to all atheists. Surely many atheist politicians/voters would have dismantled all weapons by now.

What do Satanists have to do with anything? No, the people in power are far from Satanists and you're simply smearing and lying about a very small misunderstood minority of people by making such claims.

 

[InChrist]

That's the Eastern Orthodox Church's view on it also...

That's interesting.

hell is eternal separation from God, not physical torture.

[/quote]

I believe the scriptures reveal that all will be resurrected, some to eternal life and some to eternal death or separation. Since I believe that the spiritual is more "real' than this physical life then I also think that such separation from God will be torment worse than any suffering of this physical life and an eternal state which would best be avoided.

 

[Jainarayan]

And to make it worse, it's a separation that one chooses, knowing for all eternity that you "blew it".

 

[Debater Slayer]

I believe the scriptures reveal that all will be resurrected, some to eternal life and some to eternal death or separation. Since I believe that the spiritual is more "real' than this physical life then I also think that such separation from God will be torment worse than any suffering of this physical life and an eternal state which would best be avoided.

Even worse than the torture that was used in Nazi concentration camps?

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Distinctions are as follows:
1) Sheol (hell) has the mud pits filled with sinners and maggots that cause so much pain that the sinners cannot even neutralize the pain by self torturing their bodies.

2) Hades is desolation. The sky is black. The land is just dust. The Tree of Death is a smallish tree (15ft high) burnt black, no leaves. When sinners appear there they get about 51 seconds to survive whilst their flesh and bone literally wilts and disintegrates becoming nothing more than the dust at their feet.

3) The Lake of Fire only had sounds of the wind and fire because all sinners only consisted of bones. Even though their jaws were wide open, their screams could not be heard because they had no fleshy lungs.

4) Tartarus or the prison for the fallen angels is horrific. Its a place where the words fear, despair and misery take real form and literally crush a sinner's body into the razor sharp skin flake dust.

Tartarus is a specific unique location because not every mortal is a angel hybrid. They have their own final destination if they don't repent in time.

Wow, this is really sick. That's worse than any torture in any horror movie or done by any serial killer. So your god is worse than the worst serial killer? And you say you got this stuff from "visions"? Yeah, it's probably not a good idea to put much stock in nightmares and promote them as religious truth.

 

[InChrist]

Even worse than the torture that was used in Nazi concentration camps?

As terrible and horrendous as the Nazi torture was in the concentration camps, I think the eternal separation, aloneness, and self torment will be worse.

 

[Debater Slayer]

As terrible and horrendous as the Nazi torture was in the concentration camps, I think the eternal separation, aloneness, and self torment will be worse.

Then what was the point of Christ's sacrifice if so many people will still go through torment that is infinitely (by definition, since it is supposedly eternal) worse than anything the Nazis did? And it really does sound rather spiteful and endlessly malevolent to put the billions of non-Christians through that, don't you think? What kind of diabolical entity would intentionally do that when it wouldn't even benefit from it?

 

[Rapha]

Wow, this is really sick. That's worse than any torture in any horror movie or done by any serial killer. So your god is worse than the worst serial killer? And you say you got this stuff from "visions"? Yeah, it's probably not a good idea to put much stock in nightmares and promote them as religious truth.

No, Lucifer, the ultimate back-stabber is only to happy to torture everyone who turns away from our Lord.

The shocking thing is, is that my vision of Tartarus was posted on the internet. A few days later i was contacted by a repented fallen watcher who verified it as their prison.

i would much rather get a vision of my final destination whilst still in mortal form and be able to repent than to end up 'down there' for the rest of eternity.

The vision actually proves that everyone can be forgiven. This includes humans and human/angel hybrids.

Now sinful demons who are possessing human host bodies right now will respond to this fact in anger.

 

[Jainarayan]

No, Lucifer, the ultimate back-stabber is only to happy to torture everyone who turns away from our Lord.

God permits this? This is no better than if I stand idly by while a person on the street is mugged, raped or murdered. To not intervene is to be complicit and give consent.

The shocking thing is, is that my vision of Tartarus was posted on the internet.

I'm not touching that one. :run:

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

No, Lucifer, the ultimate back-stabber is only to happy to torture everyone who turns away from our Lord.

The shocking thing is, is that my vision of Tartarus was posted on the internet. A few days later i was contacted by a repented fallen watcher who verified it as their prison.

i would much rather get a vision of my final destination whilst still in mortal form and be able to repent than to end up 'down there' for the rest of eternity.

The vision actually proves that everyone can be forgiven. This includes humans and human/angel hybrids.

Now sinful demons who are possessing human host bodies right now will respond to this fact in anger.

Yeah, because only a "sinful demon" would find such chillingly horrific and psychopathic fantasies anger-inducing. If so, then the "demons" have better ethics than your god, which allows and sentences people to such horrors.

 

[Rapha]

God permits this? This is no better than if I stand idly by while a person on the street is mugged, raped or murdered. To not intervene is to be complicit and give consent.

Every Christian is automatically protected by the Spirit of the Lord and will hence not be raped, mugged or murdered.

Everyone else will not have the same protection until they repent.