Do You Know Why You Don't Believe?

[Super Universe]

Access to our own minds, and knowledge of what we think and why.

I can't comprehend a way to access your mind, your knowledge and what you think and why?

What do you think I've been doing for sixty pages now?

 

[Autodidact]

Direct experience is not the same thing as reasonable evidence? So if you directly experience something it's still not considered reasonable evidence in your mind? Hehe, and someone said I'm the one with the closed mind??? What's it take for you people?

Direct experience is evidence, but not all evidence is direct experience. As I said several pages ago, I have not directly experience Antarctica, but am pretty confident it exists.

What evidence do you have that Alaska exists? None, but you believe in it, don't you?

Why do you keep saying none when there is so much? People keep saying this over and over. There's testimony, pictures, Google earth, the Encyclopedia, my opportunity to travel there myself, my ability to call people there and ask them where they are...all of these are evidence, although they are not direct experience. None of them are available re: God. You yourself showed me a picture of nothing and tried to pass it off as God.

Antarctica? How about Pluto? The planets the scientists have supposedly found around far away stars? You sure believe in a lot of things with some pretty shady evidence.

Why do you say it's shady?

It's okay, I know the real reason you won't believe.

And I know what you did last night.

I didn't say I don't believe in your frogs. It explains a lot.

Oh, now I see. You believe in anything and everything, even with no evidence whatsoever, and no matter how ridiculous. Cool. btw, I have a bridge to sell you.

 

[Nanda]

What do you think I've been doing for sixty pages now?

Telling people what they believe, then ignoring them when they tell you you're wrong.

 

[Super Universe]

Why do you keep saying none when there is so much? People keep saying this over and over. There's testimony, pictures, Google earth, the Encyclopedia, my opportunity to travel there myself, my ability to call people there and ask them where they are...all of these are evidence, although they are not direct experience. None of them are available re: God. You yourself showed me a picture of nothing and tried to pass it off as God.

Why do you say it's shady?
And I know what you did last night.

Oh, now I see. You believe in anything and everything, even with no evidence whatsoever, and no matter how ridiculous. Cool. btw, I have a bridge to sell you.

Evidence in support of Alaska on Google:
181,000,000 hits.

Evidence in support of God on Google:
442,000,000 hits.

I'm sure you can find more testimony about God as well. And more in the encyclopedia. As for pictures, every picture ever taken is of God. Every thing you've ever seen is God.

Why do I say that believing in pluto is shady? Because you are trusting complete strangers and have no direct experience with it.

I know what you did last night? Do you really think you're that high on my list? Off the top of my head I can probably think of a hundred more interesting people I'd like to connect with.

You have a bridge to sell me? I have my own. It's an amazing thing.

 

[Super Universe]

Telling people what they believe, then ignoring them when they tell you you're wrong.

Prove it...

 

[UnTheist]

Prove it...

Look in this thread...:areyoucra

 

[Aasimar]

Evidence in support of Alaska on Google:
181,000,000 hits.

Evidence in support of God on Google:
442,000,000 hits.

I'm sure you can find more testimony about God as well. And more in the encyclopedia. As for pictures, every picture ever taken is of God. Every thing you've ever seen is God.

Why do I say that believing in pluto is shady? Because you are trusting complete strangers and have no direct experience with it.

I know what you did last night? Do you really think you're that high on my list? Off the top of my head I can probably think of a hundred more interesting people I'd like to connect with.

You have a bridge to sell me? I have my own. It's an amazing thing.

Evidence in support of fairies Google: 352,000 Oh snap, fairies are more real then alaska!

 

[Autodidact]

Results 1 - 10 of about 13,900,000 for atheism

Results 1 - 10 of about 573,000 for urantia.

More evidence for atheism than urantia, apparently.

Hint= a Google hit does not equal evidence.
Super: merely saying something does NOT make it so. Saying that everything is God does not make it so. But, if so, if everything is God, then what do we need the word "God" for? We could just say "everything."

I also have some money I need to move from Nigeria. There's a reward in it for you. How do you decide whether to believe me?

My point, Super, is that unless you have magic mind-reading powers, you do NOT know what I think, and it is offensive in the extreme to assert that you do. I happen to know that you secretly know there is no God, but are too ashamed to admit it. Is that a helpful contribution to the conversation?

Then again, you've already admitted you don't think the same rules apply to you as to anyone else.

 

[Super Universe]

More evidence for atheism than urantia, apparently.

Hint= a Google hit does not equal evidence.
Super: merely saying something does NOT make it so. Saying that everything is God does not make it so. But, if so, if everything is God, then what do we need the word "God" for? We could just say "everything."

I also have some money I need to move from Nigeria. There's a reward in it for you. How do you decide whether to believe me?

My point, Super, is that unless you have magic mind-reading powers, you do NOT know what I think, and it is offensive in the extreme to assert that you do. I happen to know that you secretly know there is no God, but are too ashamed to admit it. Is that a helpful contribution to the conversation?

Then again, you've already admitted you don't think the same rules apply to you as to anyone else.

Who said atheism didn't exist?

Saying something does not make it so? Especially when you have no supporting evidence and shout "but I need pictures".

Why wouldn't I believe you? But maybe try someone who needs a reward, I'm set.

I do not know what you think? I can tell by your posts that you have limited your own view to an incredible degree. That actually makes it easier for me. I do know what you think, sometimes you think about your children's education, sometimes you worry about money, you think about adult relationships, you wonder about the vehicle, you worry about the war, you worry about things around the house, you think about extended family and friends, you wonder about what to get someone...

You happen to know something about me? Hehe... you haven't got a clue...

 

[yossarian22]

I can tell by your posts that you have limited your own view to an incredible degree.

This is the most hypocritical thing I have read yet.

 

[Nanda]

Prove it...

No thanks. I don't care if you believe it or not.

 

[YmirGF]

No thanks. I don't care if you believe it or not.

Hehe.

I thought I would mention that I did do what you call a "remote viewing" of the being that is you the other morning and I was perplexed by what I saw. What I beheld was a mass of warring ideas which are set of ideas that ultimtely do not coexist well with one another. Unhappily, I cannot tell you more directly about the experience without breaking several RF rules. The event began at 10:37 am and conluded at precisely 10:54 am PDST last Friday.

You are welcome to PM me for a fuller account, but I doubt very much you would want me to say much more on this "investigative technique" in public. BTW: I hope you are able to get that nasty stain off the floor although you might have to go down to bare wood to do so.

 

[s2a]

What is the reason you don't believe in God?

It's reason that allows/permits disbelief of any specified claim. Any/all "gods" exist if there is but one claimant that insists that their alleged god(s) are "real". Do you "believe in" Zeus, Apollo, or Athena? Perhaps you "believe in" the claimed divinity of Demeter,Bhrama, Anuke or Baal? Maybe Enki, Ninhursag, or Ki, instead?

No?

What then is the reason you don't believe in those gods?

What reason do you employ that allows you to conclusively doubt insistent claims of fairies, or flying unicorns (or spaghetti monsters traveling aloft in the sky)?

Or the reason you're not absolutely positively sure God exists?

"Absolutely, positively"? Reason both allows and presumes prevailing doubt as a standard of acceptable measure in ascertaining (deducing) the most prevailing and predominantly evidentiary conclusions.

The "reason" I don't believe in your god is because I doubt the legitimacy (or earnestly-lent "testimony") of the claim of it's/His existence. There is more "evidence" supporting a faith-based assertion/claim of Thor as a "god"...than other contemporary faith-based claims of either singular or multiple existent "gods". I can see lightning; I can hear thunder. Should I doubt the correlations of such cause/effect "explanations", or should I simply proclaim and insist that "Thor LIVES"?

I'd guess the number one reason is because people see bad things happening all around them and can't understand why God would allow it to happen.

Poor speculation on your part, predicated upon ingrained prejudice and ignorance on your part...I would guess...

My own perspective readily accepts the notion that the cosmos neither rewards nor punishes human existence...it only renders what humans may perceive/categorize as being inevitable consequences (as being estimably "good" or "bad") amongst sentient species like ourselves.

As to any suppositions regarding "divine intervention", it seems supportively clear that whatever faith-based or claimed "gods" may (or may not) "exist" ...NONE are particularly eager to even partially mirror the uncommitted capacities afford within human compassion and empathy within the human condition on a whole. It often (enough) seems that all claimed gods refuse to intercede in allying starvation, child abuse, ignorance, slavery, or mindless war. Yet humans act daily to actively protect and defend the helpless, the weak, the destitute, the aged, and the homeless/hopeless.

Human dignity and the afforded opportunity of existence seem to be in the veritable hands of humankind...for better or worse. But akin to many claimed "gods", our species remains primarily focused upon self...or "personal salvation" (or "rewards") as offered by such claimed deities. "Just believe, and then...receive?".

How would you rate the other reasons not to believe?

I would rate them as compelling beyond any extraordinary reasonable doubt.

Now the key question, where would you rate your own ego as a reason and do you realize it's the main reason?

My "ego" encompasses the notion and realization that my personal existence is a phenomena that is both unique and fleeting. I am but one of appx. 6 billion other sentient individuals on this one blue marble of a planet. This planet is but one of many that orbits it's local star, within a rather remote suburb of one spiral galaxy containing nearly 100 billion other stars, amongst as many as 100 billion other galaxies (each with it's own billions of stars, and perhaps trillions of planets within). htere are (probably) more stars in the entirety of the cosmos than there are grains of sand washing ashore upon every beach front of every continent upon this tiny and remote blue marble...

Now...where does any sense of a "personal ego" enter into this broadest of perspectives/realizations? 'Unbelievers" can readily accept the implications associated with an encompassing and impossibly vast cosmos.

Believers predominantly claim that their particular god(s) indulge a personal, "one-one-one" relationship with each and every faithful adherent. It's not just a claim of an existent deity...it's also an insistent claim that...a "god" cares about ME...ME! Of the entirety of everything that exists within the entirety of the cosmos, MY God cares about ME...like a best friend.

"Hey EVERYONE! I'm 'best friends' with GOD! God loves me. ME! Even when I'm an idiot, or insensitive, or self-righteous in my convictions, or ill-informed, or self-serving in my perspectives/conclusions...MY god IS God, and HE LOVES ME!"

OK.

Now, let's introduce comparative/contemplative measures of ego betwixt religiously faith-based believers, and the claims/doubts expressed by "unbelievers" regarding any "absolute certainties" attached to any claimed deities.

Does it require a greater measure of personal ego to "believe" (by faith)--or otherwise "assume"--that you are "special" within the constricted gaze of a particularly claimed/named deity; or does this require an even greater "testament" of particularly personal ego to accept that we are all but absurdly coalesced starstuff, and remain/exist as but a fleeting flicker of an infinitesimal moment in time, In a remote outpost of existent life and consciousness that is unremarkable in any comparable measure?

Let's compare such requisite amounts of human ego, shall we?

 

[Super Universe]

Hehe.

I thought I would mention that I did do what you call a "remote viewing" of the being that is you the other morning and I was perplexed by what I saw. What I beheld was a mass of warring ideas which are set of ideas that ultimtely do not coexist well with one another. Unhappily, I cannot tell you more directly about the experience without breaking several RF rules. The event began at 10:37 am and conluded at precisely 10:54 am PDST last Friday.

You are welcome to PM me for a fuller account, but I doubt very much you would want me to say much more on this "investigative technique" in public. BTW: I hope you are able to get that nasty stain off the floor although you might have to go down to bare wood to do so.

LOL!

No warring ideas. They fit together quite nicely.

Oh, and, no wood floors either...

Maybe you need to try again?

 

[Super Universe]

It's reason that allows/permits disbelief of any specified claim. Any/all "gods" exist if there is but one claimant that insists that their alleged god(s) are "real". Do you "believe in" Zeus, Apollo, or Athena? Perhaps you "believe in" the claimed divinity of Demeter,Bhrama, Anuke or Baal? Maybe Enki, Ninhursag, or Ki, instead?

No?

What then is the reason you don't believe in those gods?

What reason do you employ that allows you to conclusively doubt insistent claims of fairies, or flying unicorns (or spaghetti monsters traveling aloft in the sky)?

"Absolutely, positively"? Reason both allows and presumes prevailing doubt as a standard of acceptable measure in ascertaining (deducing) the most prevailing and predominantly evidentiary conclusions.

The "reason" I don't believe in your god is because I doubt the legitimacy (or earnestly-lent "testimony") of the claim of it's/His existence. There is more "evidence" supporting a faith-based assertion/claim of Thor as a "god"...than other contemporary faith-based claims of either singular or multiple existent "gods". I can see lightning; I can hear thunder. Should I doubt the correlations of such cause/effect "explanations", or should I simply proclaim and insist that "Thor LIVES"?

Poor speculation on your part, predicated upon ingrained prejudice and ignorance on your part...I would guess...

My own perspective readily accepts the notion that the cosmos neither rewards nor punishes human existence...it only renders what humans may perceive/categorize as being inevitable consequences (as being estimably "good" or "bad") amongst sentient species like ourselves.

As to any suppositions regarding "divine intervention", it seems supportively clear that whatever faith-based or claimed "gods" may (or may not) "exist" ...NONE are particularly eager to even partially mirror the uncommitted capacities afford within human compassion and empathy within the human condition on a whole. It often (enough) seems that all claimed gods refuse to intercede in allying starvation, child abuse, ignorance, slavery, or mindless war. Yet humans act daily to actively protect and defend the helpless, the weak, the destitute, the aged, and the homeless/hopeless.

Human dignity and the afforded opportunity of existence seem to be in the veritable hands of humankind...for better or worse. But akin to many claimed "gods", our species remains primarily focused upon self...or "personal salvation" (or "rewards") as offered by such claimed deities. "Just believe, and then...receive?".

I would rate them as compelling beyond any extraordinary reasonable doubt.

My "ego" encompasses the notion and realization that my personal existence is a phenomena that is both unique and fleeting. I am but one of appx. 6 billion other sentient individuals on this one blue marble of a planet. This planet is but one of many that orbits it's local star, within a rather remote suburb of one spiral galaxy containing nearly 100 billion other stars, amongst as many as 100 billion other galaxies (each with it's own billions of stars, and perhaps trillions of planets within). htere are (probably) more stars in the entirety of the cosmos than there are grains of sand washing ashore upon every beach front of every continent upon this tiny and remote blue marble...

Now...where does any sense of a "personal ego" enter into this broadest of perspectives/realizations? 'Unbelievers" can readily accept the implications associated with an encompassing and impossibly vast cosmos.

Believers predominantly claim that their particular god(s) indulge a personal, "one-one-one" relationship with each and every faithful adherent. It's not just a claim of an existent deity...it's also an insistent claim that...a "god" cares about ME...ME! Of the entirety of everything that exists within the entirety of the cosmos, MY God cares about ME...like a best friend.

"Hey EVERYONE! I'm 'best friends' with GOD! God loves me. ME! Even when I'm an idiot, or insensitive, or self-righteous in my convictions, or ill-informed, or self-serving in my perspectives/conclusions...MY god IS God, and HE LOVES ME!"

OK.

Now, let's introduce comparative/contemplative measures of ego betwixt religiously faith-based believers, and the claims/doubts expressed by "unbelievers" regarding any "absolute certainties" attached to any claimed deities.

Does it require a greater measure of personal ego to "believe" (by faith)--or otherwise "assume"--that you are "special" within the constricted gaze of a particularly claimed/named deity; or does this require an even greater "testament" of particularly personal ego to accept that we are all but absurdly coalesced starstuff, and remain/exist as but a fleeting flicker of an infinitesimal moment in time, In a remote outpost of existent life and consciousness that is unremarkable in any comparable measure?

Let's compare such requisite amounts of human ego, shall we?

Reason does not allow/permit disbelief, free will does. Your reason is a cemented thought process that gives a person grounding, a foundation that you can lean on and always trust that it will be there and be exactly as you expect it to be. Your ego says that since you don't understand God there is no reason for you to believe in Him since He can't be counted on to be as you expect.

Do I believe in Zeus? Of course, His modern name is God. Do I believe in Apollo? Yes, His modern name is God. Do I believe in Athena? Of course, she is the mythological goddess of wisdom. You seem to really be stuck on the different names for the Creator? If you go to Germany the name for water is 'wasser', if you go to Mexico it's 'agua', but the water is still the same water. Call it what you want, the name does not change what it is. Or, does your ego tell you not to believe in water as well?

I have heard no claim of fairies or flying unicorns, oh and, Thor is not dead. They just changed the name.

"NONE are particularly eager to even partially mirror the uncommitted capacities afford within human compassion and empathy within the human condition on a whole." Wow! Nice complexity! I see, your ego is quite upset that God and the universe aren't all about you, well, tough... I guess you're ego is just going to have to be upset forever then because it's never going to be about you. Ever...

God will not interefere in the affairs of biologics. That would violate the whole purpose of the earth and this universe. I'm sorry, it's just not about your ego and it's never going to be. Uh, why doesn't your ego stop starvation, child abuse, ignorance, slavery, and mindless war? Humans act to protect and defend others? Sure, some do, but most ignore it. It's your world, fix it yourself!

Where does your sense of personal ego enter into your supposed "broad" perspective? It's in every word you typed.

Believer's claim that God is personal? Quite the jealous rant there. Hmm, now why would you be so jealous of those who feel that they have a personal relationship with God?

Ego works in many ways to support itself. It will take whatever personality elements it has and use them for gain. There are some televangelists who are quite full of themselves. But this thread is about you. I asked "Why don't YOU believe?" and the answer I got was: "There are just too many names for God"

We are absurdly coalexced starstuff? There's nothing absurd about it. We're an amazing creation. A blend of many forms of energy. The stars are jealous of us.

 

[gnomon]

Do I believe in Zeus? Of course, His modern name is God. Do I believe in Apollo? Yes, His modern name is God. Do I believe in Athena? Of course, she is the mythological goddess of wisdom. You seem to really be stuck on the different names for the Creator? If you go to Germany the name for water is 'wasser', if you go to Mexico it's 'agua', but the water is still the same water. Call it what you want, the name does not change what it is. Or, does your ego tell you not believe in water as well?

This has got to be the dumbest thing I've read on this forum since the demise of the Jew vs. Palestinian threads.

edit: Anyway.

11/7-Pick up eggs, milk and bread. Some shampoo and drop off the mail.

 

[YmirGF]

LOL!

No warring ideas. They fit together quite nicely.

Oh, and, no wood floors either...

Maybe you need to try again?

Oh no, there is no room for error, Super_Universe. I am never wrong because there is no possibility that I am seeing your "situation" incorrectly, so you must be mistaken. Um... where did I say your floors are made of wood?

Do I have to do everything here? :areyoucra I am not coming over and fixing your floor, so you must deal with it yourself. Here I am just trying to be helpful and encourage you to do something and this is the thanks I get. No doubt you are going to insist that there is no stain on your floor. Sheesh... some people's kids.

 

[Papersock]

I'm a bit confused about something. How is not believing in god caused by my ego wanting god and the universe to be all about me?

If god does not exist, then I just happen to be here due to natural and mostly random forces and I make absolutely no difference to the universe.

If god exists, then he created the world and the whole universe for us to exist in it.

Which is more egotistical?

 

[Storm]

I'm a bit confused about something. How is not believing in god caused by my ego wanting god and the universe to be all about me?

If god does not exist, then I just happen to be here due to natural and mostly random forces and I make absolutely no difference to the universe.

If god exists, then he created the world and the whole universe for us to exist in it.

Which is more egotistical?

Alas, the system will not let me frubal you again.

 

[Nanda]

Alas, the system will not let me frubal you again.

I shall do it for you! Because that was definately deserving of frubals, Papersock.