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Do you trust God?

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Oh no, you don't get out of it that easily!
You claim that "god is all good".
Now you admit that he causes millions of unnecessary deaths and untold suffering, but you can't explain it.
So presumably you no longer claim that god is "all good"?
I do not claim that, I believe it.
Who am I to judge whether God is all-good? Nobody.

I did not say that God causes millions of unnecessary deaths and untold suffering, that is another straw man. God allows deaths and suffering because that is the nature of the material world. If God is responsible for anything it is that He created the material world in which there is untold suffering, leaving some people to suffer so much more than others. I don't like that but I know it is not my place to judge God. That is the difference between me and some atheists.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
Sure you have, I've pointed that out to you as well.
Show me where I ever said that or retract the claim.
Did it ever occur to you that you misunderstood what I meant by what I wrote?
Does that ever occur to anyone who insists they know what other people said?
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
I have concluded that you are in CLD (Circular Logic Denial) :p
That is all atheists have in their bag of tricks, circular reasoning, :rolleyes: but sadly they do not even understand the fallacy.
Conclude whatever you want but just remember this:

Are all circular arguments invalid?

No. The circularity does not reduce the validity of these arguments in any way. That is, there is nothing inherently wrong with circular argument, although this does not mean that all circular arguments are valid and/or sound. It should be more clear now that this line of reasoning is perfectly valid.Aug 18, 2017
Circular arguments are perfectly valid - THE SKEPTICAL SCIENTIST Why is circular reasoning bad?

Circular reasoning (Latin: circulus in probando, "circle in proving"; also known as circular logic) is a logical fallacy in which the reasoner begins with what they are trying to end with.[1] The components of a circular argument are often logically valid because if the premises are true, the conclusion must be true. Circular reasoning - Wikipedia

So here is a perfectly valid circular argument:

If the premise Baha’u’llah was a Messenger of God is true, then the conclusion God exists must be true

Of course since I can never prove that Baha'u'llah was a Messenger of God is true I would never present such a logical argument.

Nevertheless, if Baha’u’llah was a Messenger of God is true, then God exists must be true.
 

EtuMalku

Abn Iblis ابن إبليس
That is all atheists have in their bag of tricks, circular reasoning, :rolleyes: but sadly they do not even understand the fallacy.
Conclude whatever you want but just remember this:

Are all circular arguments invalid?

No. The circularity does not reduce the validity of these arguments in any way. That is, there is nothing inherently wrong with circular argument, although this does not mean that all circular arguments are valid and/or sound. It should be more clear now that this line of reasoning is perfectly valid.Aug 18, 2017
Circular arguments are perfectly valid - THE SKEPTICAL SCIENTIST Why is circular reasoning bad?

Circular reasoning (Latin: circulus in probando, "circle in proving"; also known as circular logic) is a logical fallacy in which the reasoner begins with what they are trying to end with.[1] The components of a circular argument are often logically valid because if the premises are true, the conclusion must be true. Circular reasoning - Wikipedia

So here is a perfectly valid circular argument:

If the premise Baha’u’llah was a Messenger of God is true, then the conclusion God exists must be true

Of course since I can never prove that Baha'u'llah was a Messenger of God is true I would never present such a logical argument.

Nevertheless, if Baha’u’llah was a Messenger of God is true, then God exists must be true.
Who said I was an atheist? LOL . . .
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
It shows a huge lack in a personal investigation of truth. If you don't care, that's fine for you. But in your "teaching" or whatever you call the things you're doing, you make claims. If you claim Jesus did not physically rise from the dead, how do you support that belief? It all comes down to... your Baha'i beliefs told you so. But if you are going to say such things, you're going to have to have some knowledge of the Bible and the NT. But you don't care. Because it's been "abrogated". Great. I spent several minutes writing a song for you, and you don't care about that either. I'm so hurt.
No, it does not show a huge lack in a personal investigation of truth because I am in no way obligated to investigate every religion that ever existed. That is your gig and your choice.

"If you claim Jesus did not physically rise from the dead, how do you support that belief? It all comes down to... your Baha'i beliefs told you so."

I do not have to support my beliefs. How would it help me to know the NT in order to know that Jesus did not rise from the dead? I don't believe in what is obviously fictitious, what goes against science. I would never believe that Jesus rose even if I had never been a Baha'i.

And I spent more than several minutes formatting the post from the Riggs book only to have it thrown back in my face. :(
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
And why would you believe that without reading it for yourself. I posted a whole bunch of "lamb" verses for you. Do they sound like they are describing The Bab? Oh, and when does investigation of truth ends?
A much better question is why I would be able to interpret Revelation better than Riggs did.
All I could ever have would be a personal opinion.

Sorry, I have not had time to read the verses but it would not matter. How do you think you are going to prove or disprove Baha'u''lah was who He claimed to be with those verses? That is not investigation of truth. Investigation of truth is looking at Baha'u'llah's claims and what evidence there is to back up those claims, not at what you hope will provide proof from the Bible. I cannot make you see this so you will probably waste the rest of your life like this. It is your choice.
 

CG Didymus

Veteran Member
And who was the previous dispensation named after?

Muhammad.
What happened to The Bab? But in every new dispensation are the old laws from the previous dispensation abrogated?

And, other than leaving the world in a mess, what was his purpose?


God did not leave the world in a mess, humans have made all the messes.
And God wanted it that way? And, because of free will can't do anything about it? He sends messenger after messenger to clean up the "spiritual" mess and it just gets worse. One more religion that thinks it's right.
 

CG Didymus

Veteran Member
If the premise Baha’u’llah was a Messenger of God is true, then the conclusion God exists must be true

Of course since I can never prove that Baha'u'llah was a Messenger of God is true I would never present such a logical argument.

Nevertheless, if Baha’u’llah was a Messenger of God is true, then God exists must be true.
I've got an "if" for you. If the tomb was empty. And his disciples said they saw Jesus alive Did he rise from the dead?

Some people might say, "Obviously, no because they were liars." Baha'is say, "No, because the story was metaphorical." Both accomplish the same thing. The NT story isn't true. But which answer makes the most sense? Gospel writers based their stories on the legends and traditions about Jesus. Were they really liars? Or just "story-tellers" that embellished the truth?

That's much easier for me to believe than the Baha'i "metaphorical" explanation. That all four gospel writers told a fictional account of Jesus rising from the dead. And the purpose of it was the deep metaphorical, spiritual meanings. Yeah, I don't think so.
 

rational experiences

Veteran Member
Ask a human question for a human...do you trust God?

What God or what is God said by a human?

O the planet first

Why?

As O its body owned the spirit that released into a heavens.

Told by a human. I will name it a creator. O God. O image. Circular held mass. Pressure owned mass. Pressure of O mass changed creator released spirit.

God O the creator.

Then he said the plan is a planet.

Oh so ET is part of O earth ?

Yes. .... where?

The ground extra irradiating.

Extra in the terrestrial. H terrestrial.

Reason for saying so.

ET. arh.

Ear. TH.

TH O TH where numbers came from.

O like a spiral said the human scientist the O the planet formed.

Owning numbers as mass.

No numbers existed as number nor did human science be spoken by the theist of numbers.

As mass is natural just as mass. Any type is first.

So any type of anything in a mass I said was God. A human said it. Owned by the God and not a human.

For any human who lies coerced otherwise you are lying and coercing. What Sophia Phi science terms was detailed as lying and coercing.

M ARY words diction ARY contradicted by human mother and baby son O cell owner what you believed.

Hierarchy human life continuance was the human mother's body.

Mary contradicted Sophia.

Mary said science the occult had murdered attacked the baby man's life by satanisms.
 

rational experiences

Veteran Member
I've got an "if" for you. If the tomb was empty. And his disciples said they saw Jesus alive Did he rise from the dead?

Some people might say, "Obviously, no because they were liars." Baha'is say, "No, because the story was metaphorical." Both accomplish the same thing. The NT story isn't true. But which answer makes the most sense? Gospel writers based their stories on the legends and traditions about Jesus. Were they really liars? Or just "story-tellers" that embellished the truth?

That's much easier for me to believe than the Baha'i "metaphorical" explanation. That all four gospel writers told a fictional account of Jesus rising from the dead. And the purpose of it was the deep metaphorical, spiritual meanings. Yeah, I don't think so.
Gases are in the heavens .

CH that arose out of molten volcanic origin. Erection law ∆. Fake immaculate sex. Spirit gas.

Man in science makes chemicals first or used chemicals. Which he took out of the ground and converts them.

Not a gas first. A chemical.

Sets earth stone alight entombed stone deceased dead body to bring it back from its death cold and non burning.

Ground erupted in a reactive irradiation so chemicals were put back atop ground as human sciences direct inheritance of causes.

Caused it himself. Why barren ground occurred bare naked earth as no nature garden existed anymore...as it died burnt sacrificed due to chemicals layered upon the ground in Egyptian Jewish communities.

Thesis what you give out...change on purpose you got back caused and inherited as it's owned natural beginnings. God O earths THE God of science.
 

Trailblazer

Veteran Member
What happened to The Bab? But in every new dispensation are the old laws from the previous dispensation abrogated?
The Bab's laws were abrogated by Baha'u'llah, but the Bab and Baha'u'llah were Twin Manifestations and both in the same dispensation, the Dispensation of Baha'u'llah, also called the Baha'i Cycle or the Cycle of fulfillment.
And God wanted it that way? And, because of free will can't do anything about it? He sends messenger after messenger to clean up the "spiritual" mess and it just gets worse. One more religion that thinks it's right.
But it will be better from now on. You live too much in the past. At least live in the present.
 
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