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Does Christmas have anything to do with Christ?

Does Xmas (Christmas) have anything to do with Christ?


  • Total voters
    165
  • Poll closed .

URAVIP2ME

Veteran Member
I have never in my life seen a birthday that even implies the birthday person is even equal to, let alone higher than, god.
So your claim of idolatry, though I suspect does happen, is not the rule you want everyone to think it is.
This is nothing but wishful thinking on your part.
You cannot prove this claim any more than your claim be can be shown to be bull ****.

The focus, or center of attention, on a birthday is on the creation - Romans 1:25
Augustus Neander wrote in ' The History of the Christian Religion and Church, During the Three First Centuries ' that the notion of a birthday festival was far from the ideas of the Christians in this period in general.

The Imperial Bible-Dictionary mentioned the Hebrews looked on the celebration of birthdays as part of idolatrous worship......

Lighted candles meant protection for the birthday celebrant to be kept free from demons which the lit candles on cakes started with the Greeks Not Scripture. Cakes as round as the moon with lit candles were placed on the altar of Artemis.

Also, see the book The Lore of Birthdays for more information.

Years ago I recall a person saying, ' Oh No it is _______birthday and I HAVE to buy her something.' That made me think how many birthday gifts are forced giving gifts given out of custom and Not really heartfelt because of really wanting to.
 
The Christ wasn't born in December.

Here are some pictures of Jerusalem during december.Jesus was not born in december and his parents did not travel in the snow.

RTX16F9K.jpg


Jlemsnow-e1386923379684.jpg
 

McBell

Unbound
Idolatry? I have not ever said it was idolatry. I said it was giving glory to that one. God said glory only belongs to Him. Please don't twist my words to fit your emotional argument. One tainted by religion. It's religion that is in opposition to God, not me. I am his worthless humble servant and minister. I do His will and always have. I don't do any more, or any less. It is my job to find honest hearted ones to plant the seed in. God makes it grow. If it doesn't grow, I usually don't know about it. If it does, often I do know. I am not here to argue, prove, or debate.
The post the above quoted is in reply to is my reply to Bible Student....
 

McBell

Unbound
The focus, or center of attention, on a birthday is on the creation - Romans 1:25
Augustus Neander wrote in ' The History of the Christian Religion and Church, During the Three First Centuries ' that the notion of a birthday festival was far from the ideas of the Christians in this period in general.

The Imperial Bible-Dictionary mentioned the Hebrews looked on the celebration of birthdays as part of idolatrous worship......

Lighted candles meant protection for the birthday celebrant to be kept free from demons which the lit candles on cakes started with the Greeks Not Scripture. Cakes as round as the moon with lit candles were placed on the altar of Artemis.

Also, see the book The Lore of Birthdays for more information.

Years ago I recall a person saying, ' Oh No it is _______birthday and I HAVE to buy her something.' That made me think how many birthday gifts are forced giving gifts given out of custom and Not really heartfelt because of really wanting to.
So basically your argument is that because a round cake with candles on it was once used in a ceremony long ago which 99% of the world knows nothing about in worship of Artemis, that somehow birthdays today equate to the same type of worship?
 

MikeSavage

Active Member
So basically your argument is that because a round cake with candles on it was once used in a ceremony long ago which 99% of the world knows nothing about in worship of Artemis, that somehow birthdays today equate to the same type of worship?
Actually, I am making no argument. I am following God's viewpoint on it, as I do on ALL things in my life, as He commanded. Giving glory to anyone else but God displeases Him. Birthday celebrations are a pagan tradition. The only two mentioned in the Bible resulted in deaths. Jesus said to ignore a birthdate, but to commemorate the death annually. And Christmas has NOTHING to do with Jesus or his birth, as he was born in the fall. It is the word of God you argue with, not with me. Take it up with God, our creator and sovereign.
 

sincerly

Well-Known Member
savagewind said:
You (Mike) and some others coming at the same time have come to do much talking and no listening. It is not what Foum is for

Why listen to a petulent person who DEMANDS that I provide something to her, and who totally ignores the scriptures? She has NO intention of releasing herself from the bonds of the lies of false religion, and actually going to God's word for answers. Nothing there to listen TO.

Mike, the claims you have made were without the support of Scriptures--just your claims. You were asked to produce such(No demand). The petulance came in the form of your insistence of one should search the scriptures--it wasn't your place to supply the "proof" of your statements.
Therefore, the projection of your answer to SW indicates it is you who "has no intention of releasing yourself from the bonds of false religion"
What you claim is truth isn't there or you would supply the supporting Scriptural proof.
These forums are for debate and that includes one's back-up sources for their conclusions.
What has been given has been shown to be erroneous.
Those "pagans" were to be witnessed to and be a part of the "household of GOD."
Birthdays was acknowledged by the Jews as is attested to by the ages recorded in the Scriptures.
Silence of the scriptures concerning a topic doesn't mean that it wasn't practiced or true.
One would better be in compliance to that which is known---NOT inferred or speculated as true.
Therefore, show the scripture which definitely state birthday observances or not to be done.---I find no such scripture.
 

sincerly

Well-Known Member
sincerly said:
MikeSavage said:
I am not here to "prove it". I am here to find honest hearted ones, and you don't seem to be one of them. My homework? I think you mean your homework.

Mike, You claim to be a minister of the Bible, but your answer is anything but a true witness for Jesus Christ and GOD the father.
Jesus and the Prophets/Apostles gave their sources for their teachings.
What you are claiming to be truths of GOD are not found to be factual.
Jesus DID NOT forbid the the "doing of birthdays." That is a false reading of the account of that which is given.
In all my years, I have not seen or heard of anyone "worshiping a decorated tree". Such was worshiped in the OT passage as was previously mentioned, but the one has nothing to do with the other.
Trees are not "unclean" until one makes a idol of them.

Mestemia, 1Thess.5:21 admonishes one to: "Prove all things: hold fast that which is good."
Click to expand...


Correct,Jesus never came out and said do not do birthdays.
God on the other hand did forbid idolatry,and that is exactly what birthdays are.It is putting ones self in a place of glory.On a pedestal if you will.

Right! and since no one knows for sure the actual day and month of Jesus Christ's Birth, there is no law against assuming and celebrating a specified month and day for the event. It is not regarded as a Holy day by all or most of those who acknowledge that Jesus Christ was born.
Human being who believe in the Creator GOD and Jesus as HIS SON know that human Beings are NOT GOD to be worshiped.
It is a stretch of one's "beliefs" to even think the celebration of one's day of physical/spiritual birth takes away from any GLORY or Homage which is due to the Creator GOD. It is GOD who gives to one those "birthdays."

...practice that Gods true followers never participated in and still do not do today.You will never find one account of any of Gods true followers participating in birthdays.Only pagans did.
Like in Genesis 40:20-22.

Pharaoh hung his chief baker on his birthday at his feast.He was a pagan king.

In Mark 6: 21-28,King Herod throws a huge b-day fest and beheads John the baptist. and has his head displayed at the party.He was also a pagan king.

Both of these two men were pagans and not followers of God.

Jesus ,his parents nor his disciples ever celebrated Jesus birthdays or their own.

Jesus made his good name known when he died for our sins.Look at what the holy scriptures says about a good name and death.

Ecclesiastes 7:1 A good name is better than fine perfume,
and the day of death better than the day of birth.

None of the above is a denouncement of personal Birthdays nor the celebration of Jesus Christ's (assumed/supplied birthday.)
What you have concluded isn't what the Scriptures indicated or in context meant. That is man's machinations of an over active mind trying to fit Scriptures to one's beliefs.

Bible S, Eccl.7:1 is a contrasting of two different ideas not "Name" and "death" as you suppose.
 

McBell

Unbound
Actually, I am making no argument. I am following God's viewpoint on it, as I do on ALL things in my life, as He commanded. Giving glory to anyone else but God displeases Him. Birthday celebrations are a pagan tradition. The only two mentioned in the Bible resulted in deaths. Jesus said to ignore a birthdate, but to commemorate the death annually. And Christmas has NOTHING to do with Jesus or his birth, as he was born in the fall. It is the word of God you argue with, not with me. Take it up with God, our creator and sovereign.
Though I am pretty sure I have already told you as much...
Until such time as you present the verse(s) where Jesus said to ignore birthdays, your bold empty claims will be dismissed as meaningless drivel.
 

MikeSavage

Active Member
Mike, the claims you have made were without the support of Scriptures--just your claims. You were asked to produce such(No demand). The petulance came in the form of your insistence of one should search the scriptures--it wasn't your place to supply the "proof" of your statements.
Therefore, the projection of your answer to SW indicates it is you who "has no intention of releasing yourself from the bonds of false religion"
What you claim is truth isn't there or you would supply the supporting Scriptural proof.
These forums are for debate and that includes one's back-up sources for their conclusions.
What has been given has been shown to be erroneous.
Those "pagans" were to be witnessed to and be a part of the "household of GOD."
Birthdays was acknowledged by the Jews as is attested to by the ages recorded in the Scriptures.
Silence of the scriptures concerning a topic doesn't mean that it wasn't practiced or true.
One would better be in compliance to that which is known---NOT inferred or speculated as true.
Therefore, show the scripture which definitely state birthday observances or not to be done.---I find no such scripture.
Your assertions are insane. I am not, and have not been, part of ANY religion, therefore, you claim things with NO evidence to base your claims on. That makes you dishonest.
 

SniggleFritz

Praising God.
Nowhere in the New Testament Jesus let instructions to celebrate His birthday.
We don't even know exactly when He was born. It could be early spring or early Autumn.

At the last Supper, when He shared the bread and the w ine, He told His disciples to do this every time they met in His name. Real Christians/Believers do this. Who are the real believers? I 'll try to tell you in a few lines; Christianity today has nothing to do with the teaching of Christ. To be a real Christian you have to repent and accept Jesus' sacrifice on the cross, then be baptized in water, thus burrying the self and rising from the water you are a new person ( spiritually this is the resurrection of Jesus) we become new persons, who are determined to live as Jesus did when he was in this world. Please see John's Gospel chapter 3 how Jesus explains this. A real Christian reads his Bible, studies the Bible, and keeps the Word. One has to have great faith in God, and start to read the New Testament and theOld Testament, too, and live according to the Bible. These are the real Christians . If you do not read the Bible , you will never understand the Sacrifice of Jesus on the Cross. I hope this will help some of you. Bless you all
I loved this. You've restored my faith that there are true followers "out there." God bless you and keep you all your days. :)
 

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Actually, I am making no argument. I am following God's viewpoint on it, as I do on ALL things in my life, as He commanded. Giving glory to anyone else but God displeases Him. Birthday celebrations are a pagan tradition. The only two mentioned in the Bible resulted in deaths. Jesus said to ignore a birthdate, but to commemorate the death annually. And Christmas has NOTHING to do with Jesus or his birth, as he was born in the fall. It is the word of God you argue with, not with me. Take it up with God, our creator and sovereign.
It is your opinion of God's viewpoint. You do understand, do you not, that God does not implant God's own viewpoint in people's brains? Knowing what God likes and does not like is guesswork. I know you have read God says beware of the teachings of the Pharisees and Sadducees. Why are they wrong?
 

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Your assertions are insane. I am not, and have not been, part of ANY religion, therefore, you claim things with NO evidence to base your claims on. That makes you dishonest.
MikeSavage is not a Jehovah's Witness???? Amazing. They say being taught by the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses is the only way a person can be saved but here you are knowing just like they know.
 

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Romans 7 So welcome* one another, just as the Christ also welcomed you, with glory to God in view....9 and that the nations might glorify God for his mercy. Just as it is written: “That is why I will openly acknowledge you among the nations, and to your name I will sing praises.”10 And again he says: “Be glad, you nations, with his people.”11 And again: “Praise Jehovah, all you nations, and let all the peoples praise him.”

*or accept

What I am hearing on this forum is GOD does not accept people who are involved with things of "pagan origin". Then why is God telling the holy ones to accept people of the nations into the praise of God but God won't accept them? You might say God will accept them when they change. But if they change for you then they won't be people of the nations.
 

MikeSavage

Active Member
Romans 7 So welcome* one another, just as the Christ also welcomed you, with glory to God in view....9 and that the nations might glorify God for his mercy. Just as it is written: “That is why I will openly acknowledge you among the nations, and to your name I will sing praises.”10 And again he says: “Be glad, you nations, with his people.”11 And again: “Praise Jehovah, all you nations, and let all the peoples praise him.”

*or accept

What I am hearing on this forum is GOD does not accept people who are involved with things of "pagan origin". Then why is God telling the holy ones to accept people of the nations into the praise of God but God won't accept them? You might say God will accept them when they change. But if they change for you then they won't be people of the nations.
Incorrect. God accepts all who submit to His will. Submitting to His will doesn't change where they are from. That's absurd to say it does.
 

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Incorrect. God accepts all who submit to His will. Submitting to His will doesn't change where they are from. That's absurd to say it does.
That is incorrect.
Romans 3:29
Or is God the God of Jews only? Is he not the God of Gentiles too? Yes, of Gentiles too,
James 2:1
My brothers and sisters, believers in our glorious Lord Jesus Christ must not show favoritism.
James 2:9
But if you show favoritism, you sin and are convicted by the law as lawbreakers.
1 Peter 1:17
Since you call on a Father who judges each person's work impartially, live out your time as foreigners here in reverent fear.
Acts 10:34
Then Peter began to speak: "I now realize how true it is that God does not show favoritism 35 but accepts from every nation the one who fears him and does what is right.

YOU say God is God only to them who live like YOU say they should live. Please read Acts 10:35. Why didn't the writer finish it with 'in everything he does'? Like this:
Then Peter began to speak: "I now realize how true it is that God does not show favoritism but accepts from every nation the one who fears him and does what is right in everything he does and doesn't do.
 

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
If God accepts only righteous people for salvation then what did the world need Jesus for? To teach righteousness? Really? Get yourself a red letter Bible please.
 

Ernest

New Member
An idea from another thread, does Xmas have anything to do with Christ?

Just vote and comment if you want.
"You see what you want to see and you hear what you want to hear." From the Rockman in The Point br Harry Nilsson. For those who who think it does.....it does.......is it for you or me to discern the veracity of their religious outlook?
Personally, I enjoy the company of my friends and relatives celebrating something they love.
Btw,I enjoy Festivus.......for the rest of us.
 

CMA Energy

Research Investigator CMA
Buddy, the topic is CHRISTMAS, not homosexuality. What on earth is immoral about getting the family together for a feast?
As to morality, only those whose morality is dictated by deitieis seem to think that homosexuality is immoral - and, then only because they imagine their god tells them so. Personally I see religiously inspired homophobia as immoral. WHAT? Why would I watch my kid having sex?

If homophobia comes from Christ, then that is not a morality I can admire.

My last comment re this A. H observance's
All those ORNAMENTS AND I SAY IT AGAIN ornaments put on the tree
Are and always has been a representative of sex organs
Why would anyone in their right mind want anything that allows ungodliness for homosexuals to elaborate their practices
I'm finished with any discussion of foolishness of Xmas the worst observance day of the year.
Fools feed on foolishness and always follow those who lead people astray
Those leaders of society (fact) are all under a cloud that spreads deception that has filtered down from the most ungodly leader of society.
And he is the holder of the office where that ungodly leader shows himself as being godly, and has deceived the whole world to suck up to and go salami salami baloney eventually wanting to control all of society under him
They want control of society for their own ego, they do not want the god created this world to control of the world.
That is where you are going to end up and you will be keeping their values ending up as their slave. A society of slaves and no freedom of choice where to live and play etc.
Don't believe me
Just go to rerum novarum and read all of it to find out how they will take control of society and will do with your life and will distribute the wealth that those who have and will give to those who don't work
Question before I say good bye
They will do this to you
You go away from your house shopping and you come back and find someone else living in your house
You go to the police and they will tell you nothing we can do
They have need and therefore they are entitled to it. That is found in that reading of re rum novarum,
And you because you own the house have to pay their bills
Go ahead and keep this pagan holiday observance and you will find all of those involved will see the beast power come to do that 666. Is that what you want for your children and your life?
Allow only a small part of this practice to enter into the lives of yourself your children and just wait and see what happens when the military, police all back this man of sin, that you supported.

RERUM NOVARUM IS ONLY PART OF WHAT THEY WILL IMPLEMENT FOR THOSE WHO ARE NOT AWARE OF THIS
Keep up your practice and enjoy your future life with 666 the beast. God says to come out of her!
If you don't know where all this is or has been going
Here's your answers
Beast no, 666 relates to the PAPACY, practices and it's future leadership.

Leaders controlled under him and not in order that have already infiltrated all leadership of society and not in order of authority
Some of these leaders of society;
Jesuits, Illuminati, Mason's knits of Columbus, GOVERNMENTS and their organizations, (Just check and see who of the leaders are 33 degree masons) You won't believe it.
Now if you still don't believe me go to Doctor Walter Veiths you tube videos and look up total onslaught and there is many well investigated research done on this subject
Then go to beyond today tv and go to archives and watch the video re Xmas or what you can find on the subject of Easter and Xmas
Both are pagan in origin and an extreme offence to God
Do you or anyone else want to get up out of bed one day on the wrong side of GOD?
Be my guest as I I've given you more then enough where to go and learn the truth.
 
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