I want to be the zillionth to say it.
Yes. Hence the name.
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Does Christmas have anything to do with Christ?
- Thread starter Desert Snake
- Start date
NulliuSINverba
Active Member
Oh really? Excuse me for interpreting your remarks as totally dismissive. It must have been when you bothered to distinguish it as "The Hebrew scripture." In truth, it's also a Christian scripture, correct?
Please explain how one can carve without cutting. Thanks.
We'll then be free to move on to the translations that neglect to use the word "carve."
So it serves no religious purpose whatsoever?
It means that you've failed to provide a citation from the Bible that advises humans to decorate trees to honor the birth of Jesus.
Allow me to remind you of your own words:
"To make it about a Christmas tree is called twisting scripture." ~ savagewind
If it's "twisting scripture" to suggest that Christmas trees aren't supported by the Bible, then it follows (unless you can document otherwise) that it's also "twisting scripture" to suggest that they somehow are supported by the Bible.
Also, allow me to cite the very next verse in Titus:
"You, however, must teach what is appropriate to sound doctrine." ~ Titus 2:1
Here is a simple question for you. Please indicate which answer is preferable:
A. Christmas trees are appropriate to sound Christian doctrine.
B. Christmas trees are not appropriate to sound Christian doctrine.
If 'B' was your answer, you're obligated to explain how they're appropriate to Sound Christian Doctrine. Thanks.
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And Merry Christmas. If you have a fireplace, be sure to burn a Yule log.
NulliuSINverba
Active Member
"Let all things be done decently and in order." ~ 1 Corinthians 14:40
"They are to teach my people the difference between the holy and the common and show them how to distinguish between the unclean and the clean." ~ Ezekiel 44:23
"If you keep yourself pure, you will be a special utensil for honorable use. Your life will be clean, and you will be ready for the Master to use you for every good work." ~ 2 Timothy 2:21
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And certainly, if God literally commanded a Christian to do the dishes, wouldn't they literally do the dishes?
NulliuSINverba
Active Member
In name only?
Rick O'Shez
Irishman bouncing off walls
Not long now and Christmas will be over for another year. Hurrah! Bah humbug! 
Desert Snake
Veteran Member
- I do not worship a Xmas tree.
On the other hand, what sort of 'positive' Xian message is it to decry Xian holidays. I mean, just think about it.
On the other hand, what sort of 'positive' Xian message is it to decry Xian holidays. I mean, just think about it.
Rick O'Shez
Irishman bouncing off walls
Just to get us in the Christmas spirit a couple of really bad jokes:
Why is Christmas just like a day at the office ? You do all the work and the fat guy with the suit gets all the credit.
What do you get when you cross a snowman with a vampire? Frostbite.
Why is Christmas just like a day at the office ? You do all the work and the fat guy with the suit gets all the credit.
What do you get when you cross a snowman with a vampire? Frostbite.
Some people equate obeying the written word to obeying God. I think that is ridiculous. Don't you?
Carve means to "cut into a desired shape" Cutting or carving (who would of thought?) a tree is for size not shape and to move it. Maybe I should put it up by it's roots? Anyway, it's not my tree. It is my husbands tree. Do you think I should contend with him? Oh wait! The Bible says not to. Stuck between a rock and a hard place I am.
I just want to say what an interesting sentence. Does it mean something?
It is my husband's tree. He is an atheist. It is to make the room pretty and to put the gifts under. I do that too.
To honor Jesus one must love one another. I don't know what it has to do with a pretty house. Shrugs
I shall stand by those words. Do you think thousands of years ago God remembered to warn us about Christmas trees?
OK. I don't agree. Freedom is supported by not only The Bible but by The Lord. "The truth will set you free"
http://biblehub.com/titus/2-1.htm Do you agree people in glass houses shouldn't throw stones?
As I have said before home decor has nothing to do with sound or unsound doctrine.
I am sure you are welcome.
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I have never done anything superstitous to worship God.
Would you go to dinner with a family who decorated their home for the season?
NulliuSINverba
Active Member
Probably because they're laboring under the misapprehension that it's The Word of God?
Yes. However, I'm not a Christian. If I were, I'd struggle to make a pronouncement such as yours dovetail with John 1:1.
Now that you've conceded that one cannot carve without cutting, shall we examine the various translations of Jeremiah 10:3 that never even mention "carving" to begin with? Such as:
"... for the customs of the peoples are vanity. A tree from the forest is cut down and worked with an axe by the hands of a craftsman." ~ English Standard Version
"For the customs of the peoples are delusion; Because it is wood cut from the forest, The work of the hands of a craftsman with a cutting tool." ~ New American Standard Bible
"For the customs of the people are vain: for one cutteth a tree out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman, with the axe." ~ King James Bible
"For the practices of the people are worthless. Indeed, a tree is cut down from the forest; it's the work of the hands of a craftsman with an ax." ~ Int'l Standard Version
This is just a small sample. May we dispense with the theological tap-dancing of "carving?"
That might be the lamest blame-your-spouse excuse since "The woman you put here with me--she gave me some fruit from the tree, and I ate it."
You've handily reminded me that there are indeed fates worse than being a Christian man.
No. But that's because I remain unconvinced that any such god exists to begin with. If we grant for a moment that he/she/it does exist (and it is indeed the Christian deity) we're still left with a set of Divine Proclamations and Decrees that have been so badly mangled over the centuries that they're practically useless as anything other than heavy-handed poetry.
If I were a Christian, I suppose I'd feel compelled to defend the foundational scriptures of my faith irrespective of the deplorable condition that they were in and/or the largely outdated ideas they enshrine.
Translation: "The Truth shall set you free because the Bible says that the truth shall set you free."
The Bible also says:
"So if the Son sets you free, you will be free indeed." ~ John 8:36
Translation: The Son shall set you free because the Bible says that the Son shall set you free."
1.) Stop trying to change the subject. Please.
2.) Again, I am not a Christian. So claims that the Christian faith co-opted the pagan elements of the Yuletide Season are merely interesting historical window-dressing to me. They cannot corrode my faith, because I have none.
I'm sure your protestations regarding mere "home decor" would carry more weight with me if the decor in question was only put up at the same time Christians are commemorating the erroneous birth date of their unsubstantiated deity.
Or is your home decorated for Christmas all year 'round?
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The same goes for all the Easter Bunnies. Where in the Bible do they come from?
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And you'd probably agree that the act of worshiping a god isn't the least bit superstitious?
Yes.
A better question: Would you understand why some Christians reject the trappings of the Christmas Holiday as totally unsubstantiated by scripture (and hence, to be avoided)?
"work of the hands" suggests art, not one cut.
Excuse? Haha! I am the one saying it is a decoration. I need no excuse for a decoration.
OK
I am saying there is no divine degree about Christmas trees like you and they say.
The foundation I see about a carved image is that it can't do anything and they think it can. What do people think a Christmas tree can do?
We all kn ow that argument. Thanks for the reminder. Some of things misunderstood does not mean all of the things are misunderstood. But I know a little leaven ferments the whole batch. That one is true.
It is seasonal. There aren't flowers in winter so green is the way to go. Haha
To some people it is. I sought God and I found what I needed. I don't stop seeking. When a person stops seeking everything after is superstition. And of course someone who never sought it is all superstition. To each his own.
I understand and I agree with them. Christmas puts Earth in danger. I think it should be stopped but someone going with the flow reasonably should feel no guilt imo.
Christmas is good for the economy it seems (I don't know), but is bad for Earth it seems (I don't know). Who has the will and the means to measure it? I don't have both. You know the will AND the means. Guess which one I have. Go ahead, guess!
I did ask my husband if we might forgo the tree this year (to put the big amount of $20 to the debt) and I think he doesn't hear me most of the time. Haha Why do you think I am on the forum?
Rick O'Shez
Irishman bouncing off walls
Another bad joke:
A policeman finds a drunk in the gutter.
He says "Hello, hello, hello, what are you doing down there?"
The drunk slurs " I'm on the staff Christmas party."
The policeman says "Why are you on your own?"
The drunk says "I'm self-employed."
A policeman finds a drunk in the gutter.
He says "Hello, hello, hello, what are you doing down there?"
The drunk slurs " I'm on the staff Christmas party."
The policeman says "Why are you on your own?"
The drunk says "I'm self-employed."
NulliuSINverba
Active Member
1.) I'm sure that artists would insist that what they're doing is work.
2.) Words of Advice: Probably not wise to dismiss "work of the hands" in front of people who work with their hands.
Apparently, it's nothing more than a totally non-religious decorative item that has practically nothing to do with Christmas.
Superstition isn't defined as "everything after you stop seeking" or "someone who never sought." It means:
Merriam-Webster said:
So you're content to carry on a practice that you feel endangers the earth? Wow.
And your declaration that "someone going with the flow reasonably should feel no guilt" is fairly repugnant.
The common thread running through all of this appears to be that you don't know.
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I'll cede the final word to you, as you've painted yourself into a corner of abrogated responsibility and denial.
One person doing Christmas does no damage. Billions doing it does. Actually it is not the people who celebrate it who do the damage. It is the money grabbers who do. Make more stuff for Christmas. I say make due with what you have.
You're kind of amazing and arguing something you do not care about is weird. My family cares about Christmas so I do too. Going with the flow buying and decorating a tree and buying pesents is repugnant. OK?????? DUMB. Super dumb.
A Christmas tree has nothing to do with Jesus' birth. Correct! I suspected there was a brain cell in there. It is a decoration. It makes a house pretty. Pretty is repungnant OK. I think evolution does not agree with you.
You're kind of amazing and arguing something you do not care about is weird. My family cares about Christmas so I do too. Going with the flow buying and decorating a tree and buying pesents is repugnant. OK?????? DUMB. Super dumb.
A Christmas tree has nothing to do with Jesus' birth. Correct! I suspected there was a brain cell in there. It is a decoration. It makes a house pretty. Pretty is repungnant OK. I think evolution does not agree with you.
I didn't say that. I said the work of an artist is not cutting down a tree. I can cut down a tree. I am not an artist,
I know that. It is my opinion God is for seeking. When they believe they know God naturally they can't keep seeking God. SO....everything after knowing God is superstition. That is my opinion. I know it isn't anyone else's opinion and that is OK.
I am not content about Christmas. My argument is to leave the people contented who are content about Christmas. It's no big deal. It makes no sense to be guilting them.
There is tons of stuff on forum that is repugnant. You should get use to it.
That is right! I just know that humankind can't judge something as complicated as Christmas because THEY DON'T know.
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OK! Now you're being nice. I should apologize for your brain cell. I am sorry. Did you report me?
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Rick O'Shez
Irishman bouncing off walls
Couldn't resist another bad joke:
A young woman is in line to see Santa. When it's her turn, she climbs up on Santa's lap.
Santa asks, "What would you like Santa to bring you for Christmas?"
She replies, "I want a Barbie and a G.I. Joe."
Santa looks at her for a moment and says, "I thought Barbie comes with Ken."
"No," she said . "She comes with G.I. Joe, she fakes it with Ken."
A young woman is in line to see Santa. When it's her turn, she climbs up on Santa's lap.
Santa asks, "What would you like Santa to bring you for Christmas?"
She replies, "I want a Barbie and a G.I. Joe."
Santa looks at her for a moment and says, "I thought Barbie comes with Ken."
"No," she said . "She comes with G.I. Joe, she fakes it with Ken."
Servant_of_the_One1
Well-Known Member
Nothing to do with Prophet Jesus peace be upon him.
More to do with big fat $$$ and idolworship(tree worship).
More to do with big fat $$$ and idolworship(tree worship).
Desert Snake
Veteran Member
Tree worship? Seriously?
What is humorous is that Xmass really isn't religious for me. Yet still, I notice the association of Christ and Xmas.
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MikeSavage
Active Member
2 Cor. 6:
17 “‘Therefore, get out from among them, and separate yourselves,’ says Jehovah, ‘and quit touching the unclean thing’”; “‘and I will take you in.’” 18 “‘And I will become a father to you, and you will become sons and daughters to me,’ says Jehovah, the Almighty.”
Since Christmas originates as a pagan holiday, then the scriptures do apply.