Everyday Biphobia

[The Hammer]

You know...I am really intolerant when people do things secretly. It doesn't bother me at all if people are polyamorous of if they have threesome sex, etc....as long as they say it.
Because it's squalid to let people believe that you are something you are not

Why is it yours (or anyone else's business) what someone does in their bedroom anyways? I have plenty of kinks that I am "secretive" about, because I don't feel it is necessary to go out shouting from the roof tops, or quietly gossiping to the guy next to me, or even telling my friends for that matter. It's no one's business but my own, and if I choose to keep my sexuality the same way, who cares?

 

[The Hammer]

with all due respect, comparing social life and gossiping with crimes, is a bit unfair

Sorry, but it is a perfectly legitimate example, despite the social progress made, it is still very unaccepting in most places. So the threat of violence is always a possibility. I still am not "aboveboard" as you put it at work, or with all of my family. Either out of no time/context to tell them, or it's none of their business. The latter is especially true with my coworkers.

They want to gossip and make opinions? Good for them. Opinions are like arseholes.

 

[Estro Felino]

Why is it yours (or anyone else's business) what someone does in their bedroom anyways? I have plenty of kinks that I am "secretive" about, because I don't feel it is necessary to go out shouting from the roof tops, or quietly gossiping to the guy next to me, or even telling my friends for that matter. It's no one's business but my own, and if I choose to keep my sexuality the same way, who cares?

That's because you don't come from a cultural background where everyone is obsessed with other people's sexual life. I do.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

That's because you don't come from a cultural background where people are obsessed with other people's sexual life.

I wonder if that's partly because many people are a bit bored with their sex life, and want a bit of titillation?

 

[The Hammer]

That's because you don't come from a cultural background where everyone is obsessed with other people's sexual life. I do.

No, this is very much the case here in the US. People want to know all the details of another person's sex life. But the deal is, I don't care, it's not their business.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

No. Also pansexuals don't have sex with pans. Ha. Look puns.

Pansexual is to sexual as pancake is to cake.

 

[Drolefille]

Sorry, but bisexuality, as a word, has an etymology that is profoundly binary when it comes to gender. I agree that it doesn't realistically foreclose attraction to other categories, but it also isn't describing that. The same is true with heterosexuality and homosexuality; they can also be attracted to other categories.

Activists insist on the definition you suggest but that's not how the term is usually used, and it is not yet a true term of art; the Bi is referencing sex, understood to be male and female.

Bisexuality does not have to exclude, it can be used that way, but it is not inherently exclusionary. Words adapt, their etymology notwithstanding.

Where did this whole bi = cheater thing come from? I don't get it. Maybe this fear says more about you than about me.

Bingo! Assuming someone who is bi is a cheater is absolutely about the individual's prejudices and insecurities and doesn't actually say anything about bisexuals.

Also, I really find the term "monosexual" annoying and borderline offensive when used to suggest it is somehow more liberating to be bisexual because homosexuality and heterosexuality are somehow restricting. Use of that term while insisting bisexuality carries the same meaning as pansexual, and complaining of bisexual erasure, is not doing anyone much good.

Nope, there's nothing that suggests that monosexuality is so passé and boring. I don't understand being monosexual, I don't understand not being attracted to only people of a specific gender or sex. I don't understand the concept of caring about the genitals of the person who you play with, even while blindfolded. Monosexual makes it clear that I don't understand both straight people and gay people in this respect.

How in the world does using the term monosexual harm anyone?
Additionally pansexual and bisexual overlap but are not precisely the same. Personally I prefer pansexual because I don't care about gender at all in my attraction - and that includes biological sex, and gender presentation as well. But there is nothing inaccurate about bisexual when used to describe me.

Policing other people's labels is crappy. And telling bisexuals who they're actually attracted to - still kinda biphobic.

I'm sorry, it must have been difficult for you. And besides, we all know that the cultural context you live in is very puritan.

In my cultural context, people can't stand that people do things secretly. People must live their sexuality aboveboard. One time two people I barely knew talked behind my back, and I learned of this conversation thanks to a friend of mine.

- It's disgusting that all men are fond of each other, it's a shame.
- You see, I think that the tall dark-haired guy, Ginnie's friend, is a very good person, though. At least he does everything aboveboard.
- He has nothing to do with the people I was talking about. I was talking about pigs, nasty men. That guy was born that way, poor little thing.


I was the guy.

Hay, you have this habit of speaking for everyone in Sicily, Italy, the gay community and even all women as if you knew everything about them. It's so old and yes your posts have been homophobic, sexist and biphobic as well.

I have never heard "monosexual" used in a way that is meant to show that bisexuality is better. The only time I see monosexual used is in relation to a view that does not see sexuality as a spectrum, but sees it as this one (hetero) or that one (homo), hence "mono", which completely removes other sexualities from the mix.

I use it to refer collectively to anyone who is heterosexual or homosexual. Not because they don't view sexuality as a spectrum, but simply because they're each attracted to one and only one gender/sex.

That's because you don't come from a cultural background where everyone is obsessed with other people's sexual life. I do.

Stop making assumptions about other people's culture and stop claiming to speak for everyone in your culture.

Edited to finish a thought.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

I use it to refer collectively to anyone who is heterosexual or homosexual. Not because they don't view sexuality as a spectrum, but simply because they're each attracted to one and only one gender/sex.

At the risk of complicating things further, I think it's worth pointing out that sex and gender aren't the same, and the "monosexual" label probably includes a spectrum of attraction (or at least the potential for attraction) to different types of transgender person. Is a man who's attracted to cisgender women and male-to-female transgender women monosexual or bisexual? How about a man who's attracted to cisgender women and female-to-male transgender men?

I guess this just goes to show that no label is perfect, and if you really want to know which categories of person someone is attracted to, you'll have to ask.

 

[Estro Felino]

I wonder if that's partly because many people are a bit bored with their sex life, and want a bit of titillation?

hum...I think that's just curiosity

 

[Rick O'Shez]

hum...I think that's just curiosity

It's not that interesting, unless people are a bit bored of course. It can all get a bit gossipy too.

 

[Drolefille]

At the risk of complicating things further, I think it's worth pointing out that sex and gender aren't the same,

This is absolutely true.

and the "monosexual" label probably includes a spectrum of attraction (or at least the potential for attraction) to different types of transgender person.

Indeed, I left it vague because some people who ID as straight do so based on genitalia or sex and others do it based on gender.

Is a man who's attracted to cisgender women and male-to-female transgender women monosexual or bisexual? How about a man who's attracted to cisgender women and female-to-male transgender men?

Self identification, right? I would love to see more people using the term polysexual as well, but I think it's unlikely. And some people are attracted to gender presentation - they like feminine people.

I guess this just goes to show that no label is perfect, and if you really want to know which categories of person someone is attracted to, you'll have to ask.

Yep, you go with the label they use as much as possible and ask clarifying questions if you're not sure.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Indeed, I left it vague because some people who ID as straight do so based on genitalia or sex and others do it based on gender.

... and some people base it on both, or a combination.

Self identification, right? I would love to see more people using the term polysexual as well, but I think it's unlikely. And some people are attracted to gender presentation - they like feminine people.

For myself, I think that self-applied labels about orientation to be less and less relevant to my life. I'm a man in a committed monogamous relationship with a woman; any discussion of who I might want to have sex with if I wasn't in this relationship is pretty much academic.

What would I do if I wasn't in my current relationship? I would be sad - that's what I'd do. If I was in a position to have other partners, finding other partners would not be my main concern.

 

[Drolefille]

... and some people base it on both, or a combination.

Yep.

For myself, I think that self-applied labels about orientation to be less and less relevant to my life. I'm a man in a committed monogamous relationship with a woman; any discussion of who I might want to have sex with if I wasn't in this relationship is pretty much academic.

What would I do if I wasn't in my current relationship? I would be sad - that's what I'd do. If I was in a position to have other partners, finding other partners would not be my main concern.

That's fair, but to contrast, as a bisexual, being even in a monogamous relationship with my primary BF (something we've discussed) erases my bisexuality. And I think the world needs bisexual role models and advocates. Otherwise I become "bi until settled down" or "lesbian until graduation" or whatever other role others want to shove on me from a distance. I'm still bi, regardless of my current relationship.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

That's fair, but to contrast, as a bisexual, being even in a monogamous relationship with my primary BF (something we've discussed) erases my bisexuality.

It doesn't have to. I was careful to say "for myself".

And I think the world needs bisexual role models and advocates. Otherwise I become "bi until settled down" or "lesbian until graduation" or whatever other role others want to shove on me from a distance. I'm still bi, regardless of my current relationship.

And I'm still hetero... it's just that this is becoming less important for me personally. If you feel differently, that's cool. What's important to you is up to you.

 

[Drolefille]

It doesn't have to. I was careful to say "for myself".


And I'm still hetero... it's just that this is becoming less important for me personally. If you feel differently, that's cool. What's important to you is up to you.

We're agreeing here, dude. I was just highlighting why, particularly in a thread about bierasure and biphobia, I feel entirely different about it.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

That's because you don't come from a cultural background where everyone is obsessed with other people's sexual life. I do.

If you back up, this on display, by an American, earlier in the thread. We may seem like prudes to outsiders, and while we are, we tend to try to make it our business what other people do in the bed room.

 

[Estro Felino]

I don't understand why bisexual men tend to show publicly their heterosexual side, whereas they keep their homosexual side secret.

this is not fair, towards gay men, above all. Let's say a gay man is in love with a bisexual man, whose bisexuality is kept secret. The gay man in question will never hit on this bisexual man, because he thinks that he's straight.
and gay men never hit on straight guys, I can promise you that.


so...shall I believe that bisexual men keep their bisexuality hidden, because they don't want gay men to hit on them?

 

[Drolefille]

I don't understand why bisexual men tend to show publicly their heterosexual side, whereas they keep their homosexual side secret.

this is not fair, towards gay men, above all. Let's say a gay man is in love with a bisexual man, whose bisexuality is kept secret. The gay man in question will never hit on this bisexual man, because he thinks that he's straight.
and gay men never hit on straight guys, I can promise you that.


so...shall I believe that bisexual men keep their bisexuality hidden, because they don't want gay men to hit on them?

Bisexual people don't have a "heterosexual" and a "homosexual" side. They're bisexual, not both straight and gay.

Making biphobia - and closeting because of it - an affront to a gay man is insulting. It isn't about you. Bi men closet because it's socially and physically safer for them to do so. Any one else's attraction to them is not the bisexual man's problem.

Besides everything you just said applies to closeted gay men.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

I don't understand why bisexual men tend to show publicly their heterosexual side, whereas they keep their homosexual side secret.

Because like other homosexuals, same sex relationships is specific areas in this country are much safer when closeted due to threats against a demographic if same sex attractions are made public or "normalized."

this is not fair, towards gay men, above all.

People are not sexual resources. Bisexual men are not here for gay men's pleasure. They are not the fantasy unicorn. They are human beings with lives and dreams and boundaries. Respect that.

Let's say a gay man is in love with a bisexual man, whose bisexuality is kept secret. The gay man in question will never hit on this bisexual man, because he thinks that he's straight.
and gay men never hit on straight guys, I can promise you that.

Ever think that two bisexual men might be secretly attracted to each other, but because of societal homophobia and biphobia they do not pursue anything because of it?

This is what phobia does. NOT the existence of bisexuality itself.

so...shall I believe that bisexual men keep their bisexuality hidden, because they don't want gay men to hit on them?

No. You shouldn't believe that. Why not listen to the bisexual men in this very thread, instead of projecting your own biases against bisexuals?