First person shooter video games

[We Never Know]

Remember candy cigarettes?

Oh the memories!

Yep lol

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I'd expect there to be some de-sensitizing to violence
when people play a lot of violent games. The extent
of it....that's above my pay grade.

I don't know. I like love fictional violence, but real violence is off putting.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Remember candy cigarettes?

Oh the memories!

They still make them.

 

[Quagmire]

Not necessarily. I was speaking of the argument itself.

So you don't want to discuss the topic, you want to discuss particular arguments about the topic (particularly nonsensical ones that nobody brought up because they're easier to refute).

In a very broad sense.
I don’t think every single person making the argument is doing so for the same reasons.
That would be Freuding on a very high level indeed lol
(If you follow?)

I acknowledge that. I’m not trying to say that everyone in this thread is trying to blame video games as the cause of the world’s problems. I do apologise if I came across like that
It was not my intent. I do mean that


Honestly?
I’m a little over this discussion as a whole. I quite literally grew up constantly justifying to adults why GTA wouldn’t turn me or my cousins into violent sociopaths/psychopaths. Bear in mind that in Australia, we didn’t have an R rating for video games until fairly recently. So our games were actually pretty censored for decades. Even as our movie industry was weirdly lax in comparison to US standards. Seriously what you guys rate as R for some nudity, we rate as PG



Lol fair enough


I hesitate to make an explicit “diagnosis” of individuals. I’m just commenting on a trend overall that I perceive.
Apologies if that came across as particularly accusatory. That honestly wasn’t my intent


How about teenagers growing up in a culture that venerates and praises guns constantly and even treats owning them as a human right (2nd amendment.) Then leave these same kids to their own devices. To deal with unaddressed mental health issues they don’t understand, maybe?

You mean how about using them as a diversion from talking about the impact of video games?

Sure, you can do that.

Not sure how helpful it is to do that in a thread specifically about the impact of video games though.

Could such a factor not contribute to their feelings of isolation coupled with a culture that teaches them to admire shooters (looking at you decades upon decades of lone gunman movies)
Could that not lead to detrimental outcomes?
I mean I’m not American so I can’t comment one way or the other. But such a set up does seem a bit “doomed from the start” from my perspective
Just saying

I could make a thread condemning the treatment of conspiracy theorists and their attempts to “fully understand” Micheal Angelo’s works of art (and yes that’s an actual thing. It’s kind of weirdly fascinating, ngl)

If no one shows up, does that render the phenomenon pointed out irrelevant?

I think you missed my point: you were claiming, "nobody here wants to talk about this that and whatever"

I suggested you should create threads about this that and whatever, with the preemptive concession that if nobody showed up it would actually prove your point (not disprove it).

Or to be more clear:
You we're climbing that nobody wanted to talk about this that and whatever.

If nobody showed up in those threads to talk about this that and whatever it would prove your point.

If people actually did show up to those threads it would disprove your point.

For the purposes of that experiment, whether or not this that and whatever are relevant points would be beside the point.

Perhaps on this site. Sure.

Idk, I guess I don’t put that much actual stock into the validity of claims based on thread participation on this site.
If you do, then fair enough.
I can post such threads here, if you really want me to. I have no issue



Apologies I was speaking in a more general sense.
As in my perception of this phenomenon/discussion overall and how it has existed for what now? 3 or 4 decades at this point?
Us 90s kids have it memorised at this point. Sorry lol

"I don't have to listen to you because I already know what you're going to say" .

Probably not the best attitude to come into a discussion with.

I’m a drunk moron. I’m shocked that I can even remember the alphabet some days lol


Just like this thread sounds like a rehash of the Satanic Panic and how actual rock and roll musicians had to appear in front of their congress in order to argue for their right to free speech. In the US no less. Oh yeah we learnt about that in my part of the world. Don’t think we ignored that potential human rights violation
Hmm

Yeah, just like that.

 

[Twilight Hue]

They still make them.

Your right.

On Amazon too. Little over a tenspot.


https://www.amazon.com/World-Confections-Candy-Cigarettes-Pack/dp/B000BXSRT2

 

[Revoltingest]

You’ve clearly never been involved in theatre!
Pah!

But I know nerds who are.

I could point to other excessively violent plays unrelated to religion. Ever hear of the Restoration movement? Religions is another convenient scapegoat but it’s not the only factor in art either

If you're really trying to convince me that
acting in a play with violence ranks up there
with violent video games, it's not working.

And again I could point to plays wholly devoid of religion that involve recreations of extremely graphic violence that were popular



Don’t forget that they used comic books to illustrate why the youth of the 1930s were being corrupted and becoming violent.
Hays Code anyone?
I’m sensing a pattern here
Hmm
History repeats itself?



Why? We’re focussing excessively on the supposed illustrated violence found in FPS games, even though that is merely only one factor in a much broader medium. It’s not even the main factor in video games as a whole. Which is merely just another avenue to tell stories which relate to humanity. You know? Like art does and has done for thousands upon thousands of years?
How is it the developers fault that human history and blood soaked violence have traditionally gone hand in hand?
(With or even without religion interfering.)


Very well. If your choice is to refrain from any rebuttal. So be it
(I’m just kidding. Chill)

Nothing to add.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

I still hold that first person shooter games shouldn't be played by kids. Sadly parents buy the kids the games, put them in their room to keep them out of their hair.

Heck when I play car games with my grandkids, the next time I'm driving it crosses my mind to drive a little faster, etc, but as a stable(ok somewhat stable ) adult I know better.

IMO the games main purposes are giving the perspective of using guns and shooting people.

First-person shooter games are a sub-genre of shooter video games centered on gun and other weapon-based combat in a first-person perspective, with the player experiencing the action through the eyes of the protagonist and controlling the player character in a three-dimensional space.

Though more study is needed this is something to think about


Gaming Causes Poor Emotional Regulation

"One of the biggest negative effects of video games can lead you to struggle with regulating your emotions properly. Studies show that people diagnosed with Internet gaming disorder are more likely to be aggressive, depressed, and anxious.

The main mechanism that leads to those comorbidities is their inability to regulate and control their emotions, such as anger, sadness, fear, or other emotions"

Video Games and Mental Health: How Gaming Affects Your Mental Health.


The health effects of too much gaming

"Gaming has also been associated with sleep deprivation, insomnia and circadian rhythm disorders, depression, aggression, and anxiety, though more studies are needed to establish the validity and the strength of these connections. There has also been concern that exposure to the extreme violence that is commonly found in video games can desensitize teens and young adults to such violence, causing emotional problems and even leading to young people committing acts of violence."


The health effects of too much gaming - Harvard Health

M-rated games contain nothing more horrible than you would find in an R-rated movie. Minors aren't allowed to buy them without an adult, just as they can't go see an R-rated movie at a theater without an adult. So if minors are playing violent, gory games, that's on their parents for either buying them for them or not paying much attention.

Personally, I've loved shooter games since GoldenEye came out in 1997. I love violent, gory games, just as I love violent, gory books and movies. There's a huge difference between real life and fictional violence, though. Sane people can recognize that. If someone can't, they have much bigger problems than a video game.

 

[Revoltingest]

I don't know. I like love fictional violence, but real violence is off putting.

Increased personal propensity for violence,
if resulting from violent video games, would
be a statistical thingamabob. I wouldn't
say it's so based upon an individuals response.

 

[The Kilted Heathen]

That's not clear at all. Or at least I don't see see how it's relevant.

It's entirely relevant in that you're asking me how I'm using "scapegoating" in relation to video games and their influence on violence. It's clear how I've used the term (twice, I should add; hardly enough times to be counted as "a sneeze like I have a cold"); Conservatives typically use video games (and other forms of entertainment) as a scapegoat to distract from issues they don't want to address.

To be a little more clear: there are people in this thread who don't identify as conservatives but who are speculating on the possibility that video games are contributing to violence in our society.
Dismissing thier arguments because "Conservatives use video games as a scapegoat" doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me.

Cool. That's entirely secondary to my use of "scapegoat", though it's relying on the same outdated and misrepresentative studies funded and pushed by Conservatives in their "war on video games". I dismiss their arguments in that they are currently highly inaccurate in their simplistic take on "FPS games", and just like the studies relied on don't even begin to touch on the underlying issues at hand.

 

[SomeRandom]

But I know nerds who are.

Lol fair

If you're really trying to convince me that
acting in a play with violence ranks up there
with violent video games, it's not working.

I wasn’t actually. I was just trying to get across that the two aren’t as different as people like to pretend. Not that they are the same thing, though
I don’t think they are

Nothing to add.

Fair enough

 

[Revoltingest]

I wasn’t actually. I was just trying to get across that the two aren’t as different as people like to pretend.

Who is "pretending" anything here?

 

[SomeRandom]

So you don't want to discuss the topic, you want to discuss particular arguments about the topic (particularly nonsensical ones that nobody brought up because they're easier to refute).

Maybe I’m not getting my point across properly.
Okay. I mean I’m incoherent at the best of times so maybe I shouldn’t be shocked
Let’s try this.

Let’s say that you make a thread discussing the terrible things one can find in a ceremony where a person is hung drawn and quartered. An actual thing that used to happen in society
You might point out to me that the inherent violence is the issue. How it’s corrupting the youth who witness such actions on a public stage. I might counter that the action in and of itself can’t be the only contributing factor because not only is it something that just happens as a consequence of society. But that other contributing factors occur in our society and others
Both of us are bringing up our own point of view and how this specific action affects people who witness it.
Maybe neither of our viewpoints are drawn due to politics whatsoever. Maybe we even agree on who we support. Do you think that perhaps both can be true at the same time?

You mean how about using them as a diversion from talking about the impact of video games?

Sure, you can do that.
Just as I’m sure people did the exact same thing when people decried Batman for promoting violence in the youth.
Don’t tell me that wasn’t a thing back in the day.

This argument seems rehashed to me because we quite literally learnt about it in media studies.
Like not even kidding. Kind of weird in hindsight, tbh

Not sure how helpful it is to do that in a thread specifically about the impact of video games though.

Fair enough.

I think you missed my point: you were claiming, "nobody here wants to talk about this that and whatever"

I suggested you should create threads about this that and whatever, with the preemptive concession that if nobody showed up it would actually prove your point (not disprove it).

Or to be more clear:
You we're climbing that nobody wanted to talk about this that and whatever.

If nobody showed up in those threads to talk about this that and whatever it would prove your point.

If people actually did show up to those threads it would disprove your point.

For the purposes of that experiment, whether or not this that and whatever are relevant points would be beside the point.

I can see what you’re saying.

"I don't have to listen to you because I already know what you're going to say" .

Probably not the best attitude to come into a discussion with.

Alright. I will admit that perhaps my ego was inflated, needlessly so. That’s my bad

Yeah, just like that.

I’m a dumbass. What can I say?

 

[We Never Know]

Increased personal propensity for violence,
if resulting from violent video games, would
be a statistical thingamabob. I wouldn't
say it's so based upon an individuals response.

Not to mention money talks.... People can be bought.

In 2022, the video game market size in the United States was estimated to be 97.67 billion U.S. dollars, setting a new all-time industry record.

 

[SomeRandom]

Who is "pretending" anything here?

Have I pretended that society likes to use scapegoats in favour of inwardly looking at their own issues?
Hmm perhaps I have. My bad
Though isn’t it odd that games, comics etc are often blamed on the rampant shooter culture in the US specifically. When other countries have access to the exact same games, comics etc without said violence.
Perhaps there’s a connection there?
Or are Americans just trigger happy in general?

(This post is mostly in jest)

 

[Revoltingest]

Not to mention money talks.... People can be bought.

In 2022, the video game market size in the United States was estimated to be 97.67 billion U.S. dollars, setting a new all-time industry record.

That could buy a lot of research to show that
violent video games will raise a child's IQ by
20 points, & make them eat their broccoli.

 

[Revoltingest]

Have I pretended that society likes to use scapegoats in favour of inwardly looking at their own issues?
Hmm perhaps I have. My bad
Though isn’t it odd that games, comics etc are often blamed on the rampant shooter culture in the US specifically. When other countries have access to the exact same games, comics etc without said violence.
Perhaps there’s a connection there?
Or are Americans just trigger happy in general?

(This post is mostly in jest)

I think in discussions, tis best to not suggest that
anyone is pretending. Sometimes people sincerely
hold outlandish opinions, eg, that socialism works,
Trump won the 2020 election, Putin is a wonderful
guy who wants to save Ukraine from the Nazis.

 

[We Never Know]

I'm willing to wait more before
making proclamations about it.

Perhaps.
But waiting & researching
will continue anyway.

I see a big difference with video games,
ie, they have active participation.

I don't know.
Never looked into it.
(Because I care very little.)

Those factors are still with us.
Violent video games are the new kids.

That's all above my pay grade.
I don't even play video games.

"I see a big difference with video games,
ie, they have active participation"

Yep its not Mario Kart

 

[Quagmire]

It's entirely relevant in that you're asking me how I'm using "scapegoating" in relation to video games and their influence on violence.

But you're acting as if it's somehow relevant to the points that people have actually brought up in this thread.

Not seeing which points, "conservatives keep saying such and such" is a relative response to unless you believe that everybody in this thread who disagrees with you is a conservative.

It's clear how I've used the term

Yes I know what the term means. I also know what avocado means and I'm sure you do too.

But if I responded to your post with, "Oh yeah? Well avocado!" It wouldn't be much of a rebuttal, would it.

(twice, I should add; hardly enough times to be counted as "a sneeze like I have a cold");

Okay so it's a mild cold.

Conservatives typically use video games (and other forms of entertainment) as a scapegoat to distract from issues they don't want to address.

So what? Unless somebody in this thread is doing that why even bring it up here? How is it relevant to the discussion we're having?

Cool. That's entirely secondary to my use of "scapegoat", though it's relying on the same outdated and misrepresentative studies funded and pushed by Conservatives in their "war on video games".

There's a war on video games?

I dismiss their arguments in that they are currently highly inaccurate in their simplistic take on "FPS games", and just like the studies relied on don't even begin to touch on the underlying issues at hand.

Sounds like you're dismissing any and all arguments on this topic that you don't like the sounds of no matter who they're coming from.

 

[SomeRandom]

I think in discussions, tis best to not suggest that
anyone is pretending. Sometimes people sincerely
hold outlandish opinions, eg, that socialism works,
Trump won the 2020 election, Putin is a wonderful
guy who wants to save Ukraine from the Nazis.

Fair point. I tend to be jovial even at the worst of times

 

[We Never Know]

Oh, you're gonna get it from apologists
for The Gaming Industrial Complex.

Its a hot topic. 117 Posts in 11 hours lol.