Flood Evidences — revised

[Audie]

Gotta love hockeycowboy's logic here....

Many aspects of the flood story are explained by supernatural acts of God. And how do we know that's possible? Because people have seen the ghost of Lincoln!

Starting witn a Gish, Hock then changes topics so fast
nobody could keep up or pin him down on anything.

I tried, with the flash frozen mammoths and the temperate-
only vegetation in mouths. Got accused of dishonesty
for calling it "flash" indtead of whatever adjective was used
for freezing something so fast it doesnt even fall down.

We try contrary facts-

There is 40k yrs difference in dates from oldest to youngest
The carcasses are rotten, scavenged, and few are even partly intact
The vegetation associated is that of the arctic. No "temperate- only."
Likewise any smaller, associsted animals.

All in actual, accessible, original source
resesrch papers

All of those together or separarately disprove the
strange version of the "flood' that he concocted, or
got from a woo woo site, but the validity of
any of those resesrch papers is as nothing
when he trots out Churchill- who'd probably
swallow his cigar even today, if he found out
he was cast as a creo-floodie.

For lo, stepping on the wild Hock-assertions with fact
is like stepping on mercury.

 

[Jose Fly]

It is not just the JW's, though they practice it as hard as any, but fundamentalists and creationists in general. I feel pretty confident that scripture can be found to justify doing it too. A person can rationalize anything abusing the Bible. Just ask the pelican.

True, but hockeycowboy's most recent accusation against the scientific community sounded exactly like the ones Deeje used to throw around (e.g., science being a "giant fraud factory"). That's why I put my comment in the context of JWs.

 

[Jose Fly]

All of those together or separarately disprove the
strange version of the "flood' that he concocted, or
got from a woo woo site, but the validity of
any of those resesrch papers is as nothing
when he trots out Churchill- who'd probably
swallow his cigar even today, if he found out
he was cast as a creo-floodie.

For lo, stepping on the wild Hock-assertions with fact
is like stepping on mercury.

Such is the nature of religious faith....it's not only believe in the absence of evidence, it's believe in the face of contrary evidence. And remember, hockey believes that the real reason the world's scientists haven't agreed with his beliefs for over 200 years is because they're under the influence of satan. So under the same framework, you, me, and everyone else here who opposes must be similarly compromised by the evil one.

And that gives him any easy "out" for anything and everything we say to him....just wave it away and not think about it because it's merely satan trying to tempt him away from The One True Faith.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

True, but hockeycowboy's most recent accusation against the scientific community sounded exactly like the ones Deeje used to throw around (e.g., science being a "giant fraud factory"). That's why I put my comment in the context of JWs.

Considering that they hold the unheard of, never before seen, no one has ever done it, view that theirs is the only correct way to believe, I think they should be held to a higher standard. Surely, even the pelican could not disagree with that.

Giant fraud factories, vaccines are more dangerous than exposure to disease, global floods, the ghost of Lincoln. J & W brand is on a roll.

Conspiracy theories and fundamentalist views. Forrest Gump would say they were like peas and carrots.

 

[Audie]

Such is the nature of religious faith....it's not only believe in the absence of evidence, it's believe in the face of contrary evidence. And remember, hockey believes that the real reason the world's scientists haven't agreed with his beliefs for over 200 years is because they're under the influence of satan. So under the same framework, you, me, and everyone else here who opposes must be similarly compromised by the evil one.

And that gives him any easy "out" for anything and everything we say to him....just wave it away and not think about it because it's merely satan trying to tempt him away from The One True Faith.

Satan...I missed that, but sure, makes sense for any JW
to be a WWCOSLSTTTDTWOG-believer.
(World wide conspiracy of satan-led scientists to
try to destroy the word of god)

Now IF I were a christian, I would probably
think it was his group that are the pawns of satan,
for reason that they are so palpably in the
lie-spreading biz.

 

[Audie]

Considering that they hold the unheard of, never before seen, no one has ever done it, view that theirs is the only correct way to believe, I think they should be held to a higher standard. Surely, even the pelican could not disagree with that.

Giant fraud factories, vaccines are more dangerous than exposure to disease, global floods, the ghost of Lincoln. J & W brand is on a roll.

Conspiracy theories and fundamentalist views. Forrest Gump would say they were like peas and carrots.

You can hardLy beat hydroplate on youtube for
wholesale fraud.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

Such is the nature of religious faith....it's not only believe in the absence of evidence, it's believe in the face of contrary evidence. And remember, hockey believes that the real reason the world's scientists haven't agreed with his beliefs for over 200 years is because they're under the influence of satan. So under the same framework, you, me, and everyone else here who opposes must be similarly compromised by the evil one.

And that gives him any easy "out" for anything and everything we say to him....just wave it away and not think about it because it's merely satan trying to tempt him away from The One True Faith.

You can't prove that wrong. Old Nick, he is one gollywompsious miscreant that is in control of everything sciency. And businessy. And politically. And...

Funny, I did not know that J & W brand had been around for 200 years.

I believe in the Two Witness Doctrine. If two people did not witness it, it didn't happen. Not just two people. But two very, very, very special people.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

Satan...I missed that, but sure, makes sense for any JW
to be a WWCOSLSTTTDTWOG-believer.
(World wide conspiracy of satan-led scientists to
try to destroy the word of god)

Now IF I were a christian, I would probably
think it was his group that are the pawns of satan,
for reason that they are so palpably in the
lie-spreading biz.

Are you saying that Satan is a major share holder in J & W brand? That's just conspiracy thinkin'.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

You can hardLy beat hydroplate on youtube for
wholesale fraud.

That is some "spit take" science, that is.

You have to have a lot brand loyalty to believe garbage like that.

 

[Audie]

Are you saying that Satan is a major share holder in J & W brand? That's just conspiracy thinkin'.

But as a nonxian, I dont actually believe in no
stinkin' "satan".

 

[Dan From Smithville]

Starting witn a Gish, Hock then changes topics so fast
nobody could keep up or pin him down on anything.

I tried, with the flash frozen mammoths and the temperate-
only vegetation in mouths. Got accused of dishonesty
for calling it "flash" indtead of whatever adjective was used
for freezing something so fast it doesnt even fall down.

We try contrary facts-

There is 40k yrs difference in dates from oldest to youngest
The carcasses are rotten, scavenged, and few are even partly intact
The vegetation associated is that of the arctic. No "temperate- only."
Likewise any smaller, associsted animals.

All in actual, accessible, original source
resesrch papers

All of those together or separarately disprove the
strange version of the "flood' that he concocted, or
got from a woo woo site, but the validity of
any of those resesrch papers is as nothing
when he trots out Churchill- who'd probably
swallow his cigar even today, if he found out
he was cast as a creo-floodie.

For lo, stepping on the wild Hock-assertions with fact
is like stepping on mercury.

I love J & W brand, flash frozen mammoth. You can get it regular or stuffed with wild greens. I keep of few of those mammoth meal kits in the freezer, ready for when unexpected guests arrive. It is flooderific!

 

[Dan From Smithville]

But as a nonxian, I dont actually believe in no
stinkin' "satan".

Even as a Christian, I do not believe in a literal entity named Satan. It is a metaphor of sin. As in I know what he meta for and he was up to no good.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

But as a nonxian, I dont actually believe in no
stinkin' "satan".

Satan. We don't need no stinkin' Satan.

 

[wellwisher]

In terms of indirect evidence for a world wide flood, a large pool of water has been discovered beneath the earth's crust, below East Asia, the size of the Arctic Ocean. This was discovered in 2007 and proved that w large amounts of water exist within the earth. The link below has the story.

Huge 'Ocean' Discovered Inside Earth | Live Science

This vast pool of water below the crust is not yet part of the oceans. Theoretically, if this hot and high pressure ocean of water was to find a way to the surface, such as through an active plate boundary, hot water and steam would geyser into the atmosphere. The volume of water is so much, warm water and steam could cause world wide cloud cover, followed by torrential rains, as the water vapor reaches the upper atmosphere.

If this was to occur under the ocean, where the crust is thinner, this much hot water convicting upward, would cause a huge series of tidal waves, that would impact of the entire Pacific coast. The ocean would rise as fast as this extra ocean of mantle water enters, with the tidal waves bringing water far inland.

This scenario is hypothetical, however, another discovery by scientists, the same year, found a large scar on the bottom of the Atlantic Ocean where the mantle was exposed. This scar suggests a catastrophic event, from below the crust, that eroded a large section of the crust. This event may have been due to a sub mantle water breach below the Atlantic Ocean. It was not magma or it would have made more crust. Water would have made less crust. Its tidal waves would have impacted the Atlantic Coats. The bible says it rained for 40 days, which would have been the amount of time to clear the atmosphere.

Earth's Crust Missing In Mid-Atlantic

 

[Dan From Smithville]

In terms of indirect evidence for a world wide flood, a large pool of water has been discovered beneath the earth's crust, below East Asia, the size of the Arctic Ocean. This was discovered in 2007 and proved that w large amounts of water exist within the earth. The link below has the story.

Huge 'Ocean' Discovered Inside Earth | Live Science

This vast pool of water below the crust is not yet part of the oceans. Theoretically, if this hot and high pressure ocean of water was to find a way to the surface, such as through an active plate boundary, hot water and steam would geyser into the atmosphere. The volume of water is so much, warm water and steam could cause world wide cloud cover, followed by torrential rains, as the water vapor reaches the upper atmosphere.

If this was to occur under the ocean, where the crust is thinner, this much hot water convicting upward, would cause a huge series of tidal waves, that would impact of the entire Pacific coast. The ocean would rise as fast as this extra ocean of mantle water enters, with the tidal waves bringing water far inland.

This scenario is hypothetical, however, another discovery by scientists, the same year, found a large scar on the bottom of the Atlantic Ocean where the mantle was exposed. This scar suggests a catastrophic event, from below the crust, that eroded a large section of the crust. This event may have been due to a sub mantle water breach below the Atlantic Ocean. It was not magma or it would have made more crust. Water would have made less crust. Its tidal waves would have impacted the Atlantic Coats. The bible says it rained for 40 days, which would have been the amount of time to clear the atmosphere.

Earth's Crust Missing In Mid-Atlantic

I have seen no one argue that there may not be some natural event that resulted in the biblical mythology of a global flood, but the existence of a body of water under Asia does not equate to the flood as described in the Bible. It also does not address the paucity of evidence that is reasonably expected to exist if such a flood were to have been an actual event.

All that such 'evidence' evokes is more speculation and more questions that must, like water, seek their own level, yet never do.

Simple observations tell us that the flood described in Genesis, did not happen, at least as it is described. Yet, to support an event of that scale, to find even the merest hint of evidence, creationists have to dig deeper and deeper into the earth. And for evidence that should be so easily available, we should be kicking it up with each step.

 

[sooda]

In terms of indirect evidence for a world wide flood, a large pool of water has been discovered beneath the earth's crust, below East Asia, the size of the Arctic Ocean. This was discovered in 2007 and proved that w large amounts of water exist within the earth. The link below has the story.

Huge 'Ocean' Discovered Inside Earth | Live Science

This vast pool of water below the crust is not yet part of the oceans. Theoretically, if this hot and high pressure ocean of water was to find a way to the surface, such as through an active plate boundary, hot water and steam would geyser into the atmosphere. The volume of water is so much, warm water and steam could cause world wide cloud cover, followed by torrential rains, as the water vapor reaches the upper atmosphere.

If this was to occur under the ocean, where the crust is thinner, this much hot water convicting upward, would cause a huge series of tidal waves, that would impact of the entire Pacific coast. The ocean would rise as fast as this extra ocean of mantle water enters, with the tidal waves bringing water far inland.

This scenario is hypothetical, however, another discovery by scientists, the same year, found a large scar on the bottom of the Atlantic Ocean where the mantle was exposed. This scar suggests a catastrophic event, from below the crust, that eroded a large section of the crust. This event may have been due to a sub mantle water breach below the Atlantic Ocean. It was not magma or it would have made more crust. Water would have made less crust. Its tidal waves would have impacted the Atlantic Coats. The bible says it rained for 40 days, which would have been the amount of time to clear the atmosphere.

Earth's Crust Missing In Mid-Atlantic

If this is your attempt to prove a global flood, you only appear foolish.

The flood was in the Euphrates River basin and was fed by mountain snowmelt and spring rains. Trying to prove an epic children's story is beyond ridiculous.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

If this is your attempt to prove a global flood, you only appear foolish.

The flood was in the Euphrates River basin and was fed by mountain snowmelt and spring rains. Trying to prove an epic children's story is beyond ridiculous.

I find it interesting how the flood-supporter casually talks about the release of such vast amounts of energy over a short period of time as if it happens all the time. Now, not only would it have to be explained how terrestrial aquatic and marine organisms survived the turbidity and changes in salinity, they have to explain how they survived being cooked.

That there would be no telltale evidence left behind that screams of an event taking place that should have left evidence everywhere that is observable at the level of a whisper is difficult to grasp apparently.

 

[sooda]

I find it interesting how the flood-supporter casually talks about the release of such vast amounts of energy over a short period of time as if it happens all the time. Now, not only would it have to be explained how terrestrial aquatic and marine organisms survived the turbidity and changes in salinity, they have to explain how they survived being cooked.

That there would be no telltale evidence left behind that screams of an event taking place that should have left evidence everywhere that is observable at the level of a whisper is difficult to grasp apparently.

What would make water go UP .. water seeks its own level and is affected by gravity. This whole claim is asinine.

 

[Dan From Smithville]

What would make water go UP .. water seeks its own level and is affected by gravity. This whole claim is asinine.

I could see water under pressure blowing out of the earth. Geysers are an easy example, but you are onto something here in the fact that it would take cataclysmic action necessary to create such pressure. Action that would leave behind a lot more evidence than a scar. Of course, this is based on a literal interpretation of the story. A smaller event with lesser, more local impact would be significant enough for people with a smaller view of the world to think it was the end. Even a tremendous local event like you have mentioned would seem to be enough of an event for a limited population without knowledge of the greater world.

 

[sooda]

I could see water under pressure blowing out of the earth. Geysers are an easy example, but you are onto something here in the fact that it would take cataclysmic action necessary to create such pressure. Action that would leave behind a lot more evidence than a scar. Of course, this is based on a literal interpretation of the story. A smaller event with lesser, more local impact would be significant enough for people with a smaller view of the world to think it was the end. Even a tremendous local event like you have mentioned would seem to be enough of an event for a limited population without knowledge of the greater world.

The flood sediment (footprint) is 150 miles wide and 350 miles to the south. They call that the Fertile Crescent. It flooded many, many times.. That's how the Delta south of Basra came to be.

They don't want science or common sense.. They want fantastic, supernatural children's tales.