For Parents: If God Told You To...

[ChristineES]

All I can say that we all judge God by human standards. Christians actually consider this a symbolic story of Jesus' sacrifice and God's willingness to give His own son. I really can't expect someone who doesn't follow it to understand it the way that we do. No Christian would sacrifice their own child in this day and age(unless he or she is mentally ill or something, as I said earlier).

 

[Me Myself]

All I can say that we all judge God by human standards.

If he cannot be good by human standards, how can he be good by God standards?

If he cannot be good with the human, how can he be trusted with the divine?

Christians actually consider this a symbolic story of Jesus' sacrifice and God's willingness to give His own son.

You believe Jesus sacrifice was just symbolic?

You don´t believe that Jesus died because it was very important for God to have a human sacrifice of himself so that he can not send us all to hell?

Let´s just remember that the one who is asking for his son is himself. He is putting a debt and paying it himself. He could just forgive us the debt instead of doing the circus to kill... himself to convince himself of not sending us to eternity in flames.

No Christian would sacrifice their own child in this day and age(unless he or she is mentally ill or something, as I said earlier).

I still dont understand this. It is not okay to sacrifice kids as long as it is 2012 or beyond? something like that?

 

[Father Heathen]

All I can say that we all judge God by human standards.

Which apparently are higher than god's. If there is a god, he would be a being of pure love and pure logic. Therefore, anything devoid of compassion or reason is not of god. However, we're not judging god. We're judging how ancient goat herders perceived and portrayed god.

Christians actually consider this a symbolic story of Jesus' sacrifice and God's willingness to give His own son.

Disregarding that it's from the Torah.

I really can't expect someone who doesn't follow it to understand it the way that we do.

Of course.

No Christian would sacrifice their own child in this day and age(unless he or she is mentally ill or something, as I said earlier).

Of course they wouldn't, but that what never the point.

 

[ChristineES]

If he cannot be good by human standards, how can he be good by God standards?

If he cannot be good with the human, how can he be trusted with the divine?



You believe Jesus sacrifice was just symbolic?

You don´t believe that Jesus died because it was very important for God to have a human sacrifice of himself so that he can not send us all to hell?

Let´s just remember that the one who is asking for his son is himself. He is putting a debt and paying it himself. He could just forgive us the debt instead of doing the circus to kill... himself to convince himself of not sending us to eternity in flames.



I still dont understand this. It is not okay to sacrifice kids as long as it is 2012 or beyond? something like that?

I didn't say Jesus' sacrifice was symbolic, but that story of Abraham may have been. As we keep repeating, Abraham did not sacrifice his son, God had not intention of letting Abraham sacrifice his son- he used a lamb in Isaac's place. Just as Jesus was a "lamb" in our place (people who followed God before had to sacrifice lambs and eat the meat of the lamb- a sort of feast). It could be a true story- and if Abraham was told to sacrifice his son, he probably, since he was called a friend of God, would have known the message was really from God and not just some voice. We accept that.

 

[Sleeppy]

I'm disappointed that this didn't attract any Jews from the forum.

Abraham's faith was such that he trusted God to be and do as He said. He trusted God's decisions above his own, recognizing that he was in the hand of the Almighty and All-knowing God. Abraham recognized this as being the only God; the one God caring for him and his forefathers. If you don't understand it, start from the beginning of Abraham and God's relationship. If you don't understand the relationship, start from the beginning of the Hebrews and God's relationship. If you don't understand that even, start from the beginning in Genesis.

I don't expect anyone who habitually attacks the Bible's assertions to understand anything therein. I'd be very surprised to see that happen.

 

[Sleeppy]

How many sons are sacrificed in wars, for the agendas of nations?

 

[Father Heathen]

As we keep repeating, Abraham did not sacrifice his son, God had not intention of letting Abraham sacrifice his son-

Yes, it has been repeated, and it continues to be irrelevant each time. The point is that Abraham was willing to murder his own son. Sure, in the end it didn't actually happen, and god didn't really intend for him to do so, but it doesn't change the fact that it was in Abraham's heart and mind. So go ahead and repeat it some more.

he used a lamb in Isaac's place. Just as Jesus was a "lamb" in our place (people who followed God before had to sacrifice lambs and eat the meat of the lamb- a sort of feast).

Does it really make sense to you that a supreme being would require a pile of dead animals?

It could be a true story- and if Abraham was told to sacrifice his son, he probably, since he was called a friend of God, would have known the message was really from God and not just some voice. We accept that.

If Abraham was truly a righteous man, he would've known that what god had asked of him was evil and unjust, and that the moral coarse of action would be to defy god. That should've been the test. The story would've been a lot more meaningful.

 

[Father Heathen]

How many sons are sacrificed in wars, for the agendas of nations?

If you're trying to draw an analogy, it's a rather poor one.

 

[Father Heathen]

I'm disappointed that this didn't attract any Jews from the forum.

Abraham's faith was such that he trusted God to be and do as He said. He trusted God's decisions above his own, recognizing that he was in the hand of the Almighty and All-knowing God. Abraham recognized this as being the only God; the one God caring for him and his forefathers. If you don't understand it, start from the beginning of Abraham and God's relationship. If you don't understand the relationship, start from the beginning of the Hebrews and God's relationship. If you don't understand that even, start from the beginning in Genesis.

I don't expect anyone who habitually attacks the Bible's assertions to understand anything therein. I'd be very surprised to see that happen.

You don't see how problems would arise when people, who out of blind obedience, act without conscience? Do you think it's an admirable character trait? Don't you think such people could easily be manipulated and exploited and used as pawns in heinous things?

 

[Sleeppy]

If you're trying to draw an analogy, it's a rather poor one.

Let's keep our civility. Even my weak analogies can be used effectively. Was there anything else you needed to say?

 

[Sleeppy]

You don't see how problems would arise when people, who out of blind obedience, act without conscience? Do you think it's an admirable character trait? Don't you think such people could easily be manipulated and exploited and used as pawns in heinous things?

You keep calling it blind obedience. Have you read Genesis 21, at least?

 

[Me Myself]

I remember when God said he was going to make a flood in x place, and the person told him "but what if there are 50 good peole there?" and God told him "okay, if there are 50 good people, I am not gong to maket he flood" Then the person says "but if there are 10 good people? would you make the flood then?".

This person that do tells what is moraly right is what should be encouraged. Not the one that says that if God asks you to kill a complete inocent then it is the right thing to do (I KNOW God knew he wasn´t gonna die. The thing is that Abraham didn´t know that and was willing to kill an inocent (his own kid) because of God (or if you will it, this voice he had heard so many times and appeared to be friendly to him)

 

[chinu]

This question is aimed at theists...If your God came to you and commanded that you sacrifice your child to him/her/it or them, would you do it?

Definatly i'll sacrifice if the child is my own property, but its god property which is borrowed from him.

 

[brambleberry]

:beach: reruns are sooo boring ...

If you are new to the forums it isn't a re-run, it is a new episode to us.

 

[BobbyisStrange]

I didn't say Jesus' sacrifice was symbolic, but that story of Abraham may have been.

How can one pick and choose which story they think is symbolic and which isnt?

 

[BobbyisStrange]

Definatly i'll sacrifice if the child is my own property, but its god property which is borrowed from him.

So, if God told you to sacrifice your child to it, you would?

 

[BobbyisStrange]

Now - to answer your question. In the context of 21st century Christianity, I do not believe that the God I worship would expect me to sacrifice my child. So, if I started hearing voices telling me to do this, I would make an appointment with a psychiatrist immediately.

This is weird to me...Though Abraham did not sacrifice Isaac, you still justify his intentions by saying God really didnt want this to happen...totally ignoring the fact Abraham was absolutelty getting ready to murder his son...however if this same God should ever ask you to do the same, you would go to a psychiatrist...May i ask what you would do, despite all treatment, if God still kept at you asking for the deed to be done?

 

[Breathe]

This question is aimed at theists...If your God came to you and commanded that you sacrifice your child to him/her/it or them, would you do it?

A deity who asked me to sacrifice my child would not be worthy of my worship, and any further worship towards that divinity would immediately be stopped.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

See post #7.

But point is that the story depicts Abraham's willingness to murder his own son at the command of his god as a good thing.

Unless, of course, it doesn't.

What do you take as the message of the story if not that?

Elaborate.

What about you first letting us know what you've read on the Akedah (other than the material culled by surfing the internet in response to this post)?

 

[chinu]

So, if God told you to sacrifice your child to it, you would?

No i cannot sacrifice the thing which is not my own property ?