For trinity believers: Does your world come unravelled if Jesus is not God,but ONLY Gods Son?

[Brian2]

This is discombobulated and poorly argued. "The closest I could find is Hebrews" ? Sorry but the author of Hebrews is not close enough .. needs to come from the Big Guy -- From Jesus .. and No .. the man Jesus being Adopted by God at the age of 30 does not imply same nature .. nor being called the Son .. by any stretch .. Hercules was not Zeus .. NO .. NO ..and NO.

Jesus is not His Father. I guess that means you misunderstand the Trinity.
Jesus did say "The Father and I are one".
But Thomas did say to Jesus "My Lord and My God" and Jesus said, "Because you have seen you believe".

Then you say something really lacking in understanding " Early Church said Jesus was their God" ????? .. That Doesn't make Jesus "The Most High God" The debate is not whether or not Jesus was Divine (althought that was one of the debates back then .. the nature of Christs divinity) This is about Jesus being "The Most High" . Satan is divine .. and has wicked powers .. but Satan is not "The Most High" .. the .. just as the Transformer is not the All Spark. trying to come up with descent analogy.

The Trinity States that Jesus "IS" The Father .. and the HOly Spirit for that matter... dogma that not only is not stated directly in the Bibe .. but contradicted many times over by Jesus .. who always references His GOD .. the one who adopted him - as someone other than himself.

You are not stating Tinity doctrine correctly. It does not say that the Son is the Father.
But the Bible tells us that there is one true God (Jesus Father) and the Bible shows that Jesus is not the Father and early Christians say that Jesus is their God.
The whole thing points to more than one person in the one true God imo.
(I and the Father are one. I am in the Father and the Father is in me.)

The "Uncreated Son" is made up silliness - and thus doesn't mean that Jesus is same substance.

Sounds like you think that when the Bible tells us that all things were created by the Son, that you think that the Son was created through the Son.
Sounds definitely like silliness, and anti Bible silliness imo.

 

[seekandfind]

No it would not unravel my world because The thing is a Son of God - is a God.

David said *the Lord* (our Father) said unto *my Lord* (Yahweh /Jesus) sit at my right hand until I make your enemies your footstool

Right , even Satan is a Son of God. But neither are the Almighty God.

You are misrepresenting scripture with your explaination here: "David said *the Lord* (our Father) said unto *my Lord* (Yahweh /Jesus) sit at my right hand until I make your enemies your footstool"

It should show "David said, 'The *LORD*(YHWH: the proper noun of the God of Israel -not AVI: father) said unto *my lord*(adonai: "lord, master"- not YHWH: Gods name) sit at my right hand...'"

You were either purposely misleading or didnt know what you were doing here. Ill hope for the latter.

 

[seekandfind]

I don't know what you mean by a Kingdom from the heavens. But I do know that there is one Kingdom of God and it will include the Kingdoms of the earth.
Rev 11:15 Then the seventh angel sounded his trumpet, and loud voices called out in heaven: “The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of His Christ, and He will reign forever and ever.”

You are misunderstanding the scripture you posted because the kingdoms of the earth will be destroyed so Gods Kingdom will not "include" the kingdoms of the earth. The verse is implying it will be the only kingdom....

“In the days of those kings the God of heaven will set up a kingdom that will never be destroyed. And this kingdom will not be passed on to any other people. It will crush and put an end to all these kingdoms, and it alone will stand forever,"- Dan 2:44

Remember Daniels book was going to be "sealed until the end"? Its time to understand it.

Even the OT saints are in the Kingdom of God.
Luke 13:28,29 “You will see Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, and all the prophets in God’s kingdom. But you will be left outside. There you will cry and grind your teeth with pain. People will come from the east, west, north, and south. They will sit down at the table in God’s kingdom.

They arent there yet. They will on earth under its rulership during the 1000 years and hopefully after that, too.

 

[Sargonski]

That has to do with Jesus being our righteousness, or even YHWH is our righteousness if you want to read it that way. Our righteousness does not depend on our deeds, it is a gospel of grace and we are the ones who receive that grace.



Paul says that he takes the gospel to the Jews first then the Gentiles in any place he goes. But that doesn't mean that all Jews accept the gospel before all Gentiles.



It sounds like you are saying that people need to earn their salvation through their works.
We all know that faith without works is dead, but it is faith that works through love (Gel 5:6) and our works are what shows our faith, (James 2:18) not what earn our salvation.
Where does faith come into salvation in your opinion?
What does redemption mean to you and who are the ones who have been redeemed?
Jesus bought us with His death on.
1Cor 6:19 Do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have received from God? You are not your own; 20 you were bought at a price. Therefore glorify God with your body.
1Peter 1:19 You were bought with the precious blood of Christ’s death. He was a pure and perfect sacrificial Lamb.

But of course I understand why you say what you do. It is because the gospel of the JWs is a gospel of works, where you earn your salvation through your works.
Not only that, the Governing Body has decided that most of the New Testament does not apply to all Christians, it applies only to the 144000 anointed class (but even they need to earn their salvation as a JW).
So most JWs are not redeemed or part of the New Covenant, or in the Kingdom of God, or go to heaven ever etc etc.
How is it possible to let a little group of men tell you that the gospel and being born again and receiving the Holy Spirit does not apply to you.
Nowhere in the scriptures is that even hinted at. If it is then show me where.

John 14:23 Jesus answered him, “If anyone loves me, he will keep my word, and my Father will love him, and we will come to him and make our home with him.

So anyone can receive the Spirit of God (and since there is only one Spirit-Eph 4:4- that means that the Spirit of God is the Spirit of Christ.



Are you saying that "enrolled in the heavens" (Heb 12:23) is not talking about a book of enrolment where the identity of those who have obtained eternal life is written?
Ah I get it, that is just another verse that the Watch Tower says only applies to the 144000, and it is about them being in heaven forever.
Who gave the Governing Body the authority to make such claims when the scriptures clearly show their claims about the 144000 being the "only" are wrong. (eg John 14:23)

First off I am not a JW and have never read their Bible .. So why are you making up fairy tale nonsense and attributing it to me ... and then go on and on the Evil's of JW's as if this Ad Hom fallacy constitutes support for your claims about works. Clearly you unaware the majority of Christianity has works as part of the salvation formulation !? and that this is because Jesus gives a works based salvation formulation in his most famous sermon ... the topic of which is how one is saved .. but a sermon you have completely ignored your assessment of the question. Why is that ? Why would I use Paul as a source rather than Jesus ..

Your claim that the OT metions Christians as being the First Fruits is completely wrong .. as is your claim that Paul's "Jews first and then Gentiles" refers when they are introduced to scripture and not "First Fruits" This stuff about Paul is just something you made up because you thought it would sound good rather than .. supporting your claim with Bible Passage -- that supports your claim. Romans 2 GNT

10 But God will give glory, honor, and peace to all who do what is good, to the Jews first and also to the Gentiles. 11 For God judges everyone by the same standard.

12 The Gentiles do not have the Law of Moses; they sin and are lost apart from the Law. The Jews have the Law; they sin and are judged by the Law. 13 For it is not by hearing the Law that people are put right with God, but by doing what the Law commands. 14 The Gentiles do not have the Law; but whenever they do by instinct what the Law commands, they are their own law, even though they do not have the Law. 15 Their conduct shows that what the Law commands is written in their hearts. Their consciences also show that this is true, since their thoughts sometimes accuse them and sometimes defend them. 16 And so, according to the Good News I preach, this is how it will be on that Day when God through Jesus Christ will judge the secret thoughts of all.

Jews are the first fruits ... Got it ? Nowhere in the OT are Christians claimed to be the first fruits ... and in fact Jesus says he was sent "Only" to the Jews "lost sheep of Israel" .. so even the New Testament does not support this made up assertion.

"Works - Salvation" .. Obviously Paul disagrees with you in this passage .. no free pass through Judgement .. "Sola Fide" an anathema even according to Paul .. for it is by "Doing what the law commands" = "Works" that people are put right with God.

That said .. it is true that in other parts of Scripture Paul contradicts himself .. and that Paul said a number of other silly things .. Romans 13 in particular -- and perhaps we should not say "Silly" because it was for good reason that Paul says to respect the authority of the Romans .. but this has nothing to do with any teachings of Jesus or Command from God

So this brings us full circle to your previous blunder .. Why have you not considered the teachings of Jesus on the topic of Works .. in his most famous sermon on the very topic of how one achieves salvation. I will take the words of Jesus over the words of Paul thank you. Paul never knew Jesus .. and contradicts himself on the matter .. and Jesus.

So how about we go to Jesus .. for the thoughts of Jesus on Salvation -- and not some vague one liner .. but an entire Sermon on the topic .. and perhaps look there for the answer .. instead of running around like Pauline chicken with head cut off trying to avoid and hide from the Teachings of Jesus .. and think maybe it is because of this Sermon that the Majority of Christianity includes works in the Salvation Formulation .. Salvation meaning how one gets into heaven .. how one is put right with God.

and Last .. Brother Brian -- Orthodox and Catholic Christians are not JW's. Now tell us what Jesus has to say on this topic in Matt 5-7 .. an entire 2 chapters on how one gets through the pearly Gates.. Where Jesus states that "Only those that do the Will of the Father" get into heaven.

Should be simple -- what does Jesus mean by "Will of the Father" - something he talks about extensively in this Sermon .. starting with "Blessed are the Poor in Spirit - For theirs is the Kingdom of Heaven"

What is Poor is Spirit Friend .. would that mean "Don't have much Faith" -- there some prophecy for you !? tough to say what that one means but come up with something .. onus is on you to explain away the obviously anti-faith comment . which you can't so will ignore on the basis of vagueness .. which is fine, as the rest of the Sermon is not Vague at all .. telling us many times over the Will of the Father.

Tell us then .. what is the "Will of the Father" Jesus tells us about in this Sermon. I will give you a head Start .. my favorite Passage Matt 7:12 .. "Don't do to others what you hate .. .. this rule sums up the Law and the Prophets" .. now go and Learn

 

[Brian2]

You are misunderstanding the scripture you posted because the kingdoms of the earth will be destroyed so Gods Kingdom will not "include" the kingdoms of the earth. The verse is implying it will be the only kingdom....

“In the days of those kings the God of heaven will set up a kingdom that will never be destroyed. And this kingdom will not be passed on to any other people. It will crush and put an end to all these kingdoms, and it alone will stand forever,"- Dan 2:44

Yes the Kingdom's of the earth are going to be incorporated into the Kingdom of God.

They arent there yet. They will on earth under its rulership during the 1000 years and hopefully after that, too.

No, read what it says. The OT saints will be IN the Kingdom of God.
The Kingdom is going to absorb the Kingdoms of the world into it. The Kingdom of God is not a Government made up of Jesus and 144000 anointed Christians.

 

[seekandfind]

No, read what it says. The OT saints will be IN the Kingdom of God.
The Kingdom is going to absorb the Kingdoms of the world into it. The Kingdom of God is not a Government made up of Jesus and 144000 anointed Christians.

Its crazy how you say read what it says and then ignore what it says. It says nothing about "absorbtion" of earthly kingdoms but clearly says they will be destroyed- meaning destroyed.

Does your bible read different at Dan 2:44?
“In the days of those kings the God of heaven will set up a kingdom that will never be destroyed. And this kingdom will not be passed on to any other people. It will crush and put an end to all these kingdoms, and it alone will stand forever"

 

[Eli G]

...
I don't know what you mean by a Kingdom from the heavens. ...

In the Kningdom of God, kings will be in heavens and subjects will be on earth.

Rev. 5:9 And they sing a new song, saying: “You are worthy to take the scroll and open its seals, for you were slaughtered and with your blood you bought people for God out of every tribe and tongue and people and nation, 10 and you made them to be a kingdom and priests to our God, and they are to rule as kings over the earth.”

Matt. 6:9 “You must pray, then, this way:
‘Our Father in the heavens, let your name be sanctified. 10 Let your Kingdom come. Let your will take place, as in heaven, also on earth.....' "

 

[Brian2]

Its crazy how you say read what it says and then ignore what it says. It says nothing about "absorbtion" of earthly kingdoms but clearly says they will be destroyed- meaning destroyed.


Does your bible read different at Dan 2:44?
“In the days of those kings the God of heaven will set up a kingdom that will never be destroyed. And this kingdom will not be passed on to any other people. It will crush and put an end to all these kingdoms, and it alone will stand forever"

Yes OK, the Kingdom of God is expanding and will take in the Kingdoms of the world, they will become part of the one Kingdom of God. (Rev 11:15)
IMO it is like when the British took over control of other countries and they became part of the British Empire. It is not the important issue.
The OT saints are going to be IN the Kingdom of God. It is not a Government set up to rule, it is the realm over which the King rules.

 

[Brian2]

In the Kningdom of God, kings will be in heavens and subjects will be on earth.

So are you agreeing that the Kingdom includes at least, the part that is ruled over?

Rev. 5:9 And they sing a new song, saying: “You are worthy to take the scroll and open its seals, for you were slaughtered and with your blood you bought people for God out of every tribe and tongue and people and nation, 10 and you made them to be a kingdom and priests to our God, and they are to rule as kings over the earth.”

Rev 5:9,10 does not show that the kings are in heaven and the subjects are on earth. It might suggest that could be the case, but does not show it.
And really most translations have "rule on the earth" and not "rule over the earth."

Revelation 5:10 - The Lamb is Worthy

You have made them to be a kingdom and priests to serve our God, and they will reign upon the earth.

biblehub.com

And the whole thing is based on a presumption that the JW idea of the 144000 being the only kings and priest and that the NT scriptures are mainly talking to this 144000 instead of to all Christians is the truth.
But there is nothing in the scriptures which tells us that, it comes from the mind of the Governing Body only.

Matt. 6:9 “You must pray, then, this way:
‘Our Father in the heavens, let your name be sanctified. 10 Let your Kingdom come. Let your will take place, as in heaven, also on earth.....' "

So the Kingdom is coming to earth. Those on earth will be in the Kingdom.

 

[Eli G]

Of course, all subjects on earth will be part of the Kingdom. There is not Kingdom only with kings ...

If all Christians are going to be kings, over whom will they reign when the wicked are eliminated?

Psal. 37:10 Just a little while longer, and the wicked will be no more;
You will look at where they were,
And they will not be there.
11 But the meek will possess the earth,
And they will find exquisite delight in the abundance of peace.

All people on earth will enjoy the eternal benefits that the kingdom of Christ and his brothers from heaven will bring them.

 

[Brian2]

Of course, all subjects on earth will be part of the Kingdom. There is not Kingdom only with kings ...

If all Christians are going to be kings, over whom will they reign when the wicked are eliminated?

Psal. 37:10 Just a little while longer, and the wicked will be no more;
You will look at where they were,
And they will not be there.
11 But the meek will possess the earth,
And they will find exquisite delight in the abundance of peace.

All people on earth will enjoy the eternal benefits that the kingdom of Christ and his brothers from heaven will bring them.

And if the subjects on earth will be part of the Kingdom then that means they are also born of the Spirit, yes?

John 3: 5 Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.

 

[Eli G]

And if the subjects on earth will be part of the Kingdom then that means they are also born of the Spirit, yes?

John 3: 5 Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.

That is a diferent topic, the same as this answer: if someone does not worship Jehovah, they cann't be born of the spirit, because the Father is Jehovah, not Jesus.

1 Pet. 1:3 Praised be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, for according to his great mercy he gave us a new birth to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, 4 to an incorruptible and undefiled and unfading inheritance. It is reserved in the heavens for you, 5 who are being safeguarded by God’s power through faith for a salvation ready to be revealed in the last period of time.

John 20:17 Jesus said to her: “Stop clinging to me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father. But go to my brothers and say to them, ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father and to my God and your God.’”

 

[Brian2]

That is a diferent topic, the same as this answer: if someone does not worship Jehovah, they cann't be born of the spirit, because the Father is Jehovah, not Jesus.

1 Pet. 1:3 Praised be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, for according to his great mercy he gave us a new birth to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, 4 to an incorruptible and undefiled and unfading inheritance. It is reserved in the heavens for you, 5 who are being safeguarded by God’s power through faith for a salvation ready to be revealed in the last period of time.

John 20:17 Jesus said to her: “Stop clinging to me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father. But go to my brothers and say to them, ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father and to my God and your God.’”

Why is it a different topic? John 3:5 says that you cannot enter the Kingdom of God unless you are born of the Spirit. That is talking about the Kingdom and the requirements for entry. So why try to change the topic?
Well I know why you might want to change the topic. It is because the teachings of the Watch Tower is that only the 144000 are born again.
That means that the subjects of the Kingdom are not part of the Kingdom. Those on earth are not in the Kingdom. The Kingdom is only the government according to the WT.
So are those on the earth part of the Kingdom? And if so, are they born again according to scripture?
Do the kingdoms of the earth become the Kingdom of God or not?

 

[Eli G]

As said:

1 Pet. 1:3 Praised be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, for according to his great mercy he gave us a new birth to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, 4 to an incorruptible and undefiled and unfading inheritance. It is reserved in the heavens for you, 5 who are being safeguarded by God’s power through faith for a salvation ready to be revealed in the last period of time.

Peter says that being born again, properly of the spirit, is to an inheritance reserved IN THE HEAVENS.

PS: If the Bible says so, the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses teaches it to us, and the WT publishes it. We don't need your approval nor your permission.

 

[Eli G]

...
So are those on the earth part of the Kingdom? And if so, are they born again according to scripture?
Do the kingdoms of the earth become the Kingdom of God or not?

Meditate in these words of Jesus:

Luke 7:28 I tell you, among those born of women there is no one greater than John, but a lesser person in the Kingdom of God is greater than he is.

What do you think Jesus meant? Will John the Baptist be in the kingdom of heaven or not?

 

[seekandfind]

Yes OK, the Kingdom of God is expanding and will take in the Kingdoms of the world, they will become part of the one Kingdom of God. (Rev 11:15)
IMO it is like when the British took over control of other countries and they became part of the British Empire. It is not the important issue.
The OT saints are going to be IN the Kingdom of God. It is not a Government set up to rule, it is the realm over which the King rules.

Now it seems youre just being willfully ignorant about the kingdoms of the earth getting destroyed as the scriptures have clearly shown. Those kingdoms dont become part of Gods Kingdom- those kingdoms get destroyed.(Dan 2:44)

Also nobody claimed the Kingdom doesnt fall under the ruling of a king. Its so odd you cant admit a Kingdom is a government. Youre so determined to prove that someone else is wrong, and youre right, that youll toss logic to the side. Its weird. You even toss Gods word to the side so you can be right.

" and you made them to be a kingdom and priests to our God, and they are to rule as kings over the earth.” Rev 5:10

Why you cling to your belief that is clearly against the scriptures should concern you but it doesnt seem to bother you at all.

 

[Brian2]

As said:

1 Pet. 1:3 Praised be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, for according to his great mercy he gave us a new birth to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, 4 to an incorruptible and undefiled and unfading inheritance. It is reserved in the heavens for you, 5 who are being safeguarded by God’s power through faith for a salvation ready to be revealed in the last period of time.

Peter says that being born again, properly of the spirit, is to an inheritance reserved IN THE HEAVENS.

PS: If the Bible says so, the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses teaches it to us, and the WT publishes it. We don't need your approval nor your permission.

You haven't got my approval or permission and the Bible does not say so, so what does God think of it.
Why isn't this inheritance, reserved in the heavens, the New Jerusalem which comes down from heaven according to Revelation?

Rev 21: 1 Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and the sea was no more. 2 And I saw athe holy city, new Jerusalem, ccoming down out of heaven from God, dprepared eas a bride adorned for her husband. 3 And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, “Behold, fthe dwelling place of God is with man. He will gdwell with them, and they will be his people,2and God himself will be with them as their God.

Rev 3:12 The one who overcomes I will make a pillar in the temple of My God, and he will never again leave it. Upon him I will write the name of My God, and the name of the city of My God (the new Jerusalem that comes down out of heaven from My God), and My new name.

Why isn't this inheritance, reserved in the heavens, our new resurrection body, incorruptible and immortal?

2Cor 5:1 For we know that if the tent that is our earthly home is destroyed, we have a building from God, a house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens. 2 For in this tent we groan, longing to put on our heavenly dwelling, 3 if indeed by putting it on we may not be found naked. 4 For while we are still in this tent, we groan, being burdened—not that we would be unclothed, but that we would be further clothed, so that what is mortal may be swallowed up by life. 5 He who has prepared us for this very thing is God, who has given us the Spirit as a guarantee.
6 So we are always of good courage. We know that while we are at home in the body we are away from the Lord, 7 for we walk by faith, not by sight. 8 Yes, we are of good courage, and we would rather be away from the body and at home with the Lord. 9 So whether we are at home or away, we make it our aim to please him. 10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each one may receive what is due for what he has done in the body, whether good or evil.

So we have 2 possibilities which scripture gives us and the WT chooses one with no scriptural confirmation, but which agrees with WT doctrine and so the WT need something they can say is scriptural confirmation, but really is Governing Body imagination, and based on the idea that some go to heaven and some do not. But the scriptures tell us that New Jerusalem comes down from heaven to be with His people (on earth) and God is going to dwell (there) with them.

 

[Brian2]

Meditate in these words of Jesus:

Luke 7:28 I tell you, among those born of women there is no one greater than John, but a lesser person in the Kingdom of God is greater than he is.

What do you think Jesus meant? Will John the Baptist be in the kingdom of heaven or not?

The OT saints are going to be in the Kingdom of God, so why wouldn't John the Baptist also be in the Kingdom of God?
Luke 13:28 In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when you see Abraham and Isaac and Jacob and all the prophets in the kingdom of God but you yourselves cast out.
But John the Baptist was not in the Kingdom when Jesus spoke. The preaching about the Kingdom began after John (Luke 16:16)
There is a judgement and many people who are not Born again will be allowed into the Kingdom because of how they have lived and plainly they will be born again at that time (otherwise they would not be able to enter the Kingdom)

Matt 25:31 “When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, jthen he will sit on his glorious throne. 32 Before him kwill be gathered all the nations, and he will separate people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. 33 And he will place the sheep on his right, but the goats on the left. 34 Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. 35 For I was hungry and you gave me food, I was thirsty and you gave me drink, I was a stranger and you welcomed me,

 

[Brian2]

Now it seems youre just being willfully ignorant about the kingdoms of the earth getting destroyed as the scriptures have clearly shown. Those kingdoms dont become part of Gods Kingdom- those kingdoms get destroyed.(Dan 2:44)

If you have a look at the various translations you can see that some have the kingdoms being destroyed and consumed.

Daniel 2:44 - Daniel Interprets the Dream

In the days of those kings, the God of heaven will set up a kingdom that will never be destroyed, nor will it be left to another people. It will shatter all these kingdoms and bring them to an end, but will itself stand forever.

biblehub.com

Personally I don't think that there will be nothing left.
Isa 60:11 Your gates will always stand open; they will never be shut, day or night, so that the wealth of the nations may be brought into you, with their kings being led in procession. 12 For the nation or kingdom that will not serve you will perish; it will be utterly destroyed.…

It is only those nations or kingdoms that do not serve those in Jerusalem that will be destroyed.
Rev 21:23And the city has no need of sun or moon to shine on it, because the glory of God illuminates the city, and the Lamb is its lamp. 24 By its light the nations will walk, and into it the kings of the earth will bring their glory.

Also nobody claimed the Kingdom doesnt fall under the ruling of a king. Its so odd you cant admit a Kingdom is a government. Youre so determined to prove that someone else is wrong, and youre right, that youll toss logic to the side. Its weird. You even toss Gods word to the side so you can be right.

Of course, everybody is under the ruling of a King. But I see nothing that tells me that the Kingdom of God is a government that does not include those who are subjects.
IOWs the WT teaches that those with an earthly calling are not in the Kingdom because the Kingdom is the Government in heaven and that is only the 144000, the ones covered by the New Covenant and born again.
Those with an earthly calling are neither governing, nor in the Kingdom nor born again.

" and you made them to be a kingdom and priests to our God, and they are to rule as kings over the earth.” Rev 5:10

Why you cling to your belief that is clearly against the scriptures should concern you but it doesnt seem to bother you at all.

What have I said that is against the scriptures?
I already showed you that New Jerusalem with Jesus and 144000 will be in the New Jerusalem on earth.
I already showed you that most translations have "and they are to rule as Kings on the earth" Rev 5:10
(and interestingly if you look in the Kingdom Interlinear Translation at the diagramme illustrating the basic meaning of Greek prepositons-inside front cover-, the preposition used at Rev 5:10 means upon in it's basic meaning).
I will also give this quote: Romans 5:17 For if, by the trespass of the one man, death reigned through that one man, how much more will those who receive an abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness reign in life through the one man, Jesus Christ!
This shows that "reigning" does not necessarily need subjects.
However I personally think there are subjects and they are the nations, which serve those in the New Jerusalem.

 

[seekandfind]

I believe that the Bible is a collection of works in many different styles over thousands of years. I believe that it is inspired by God. I don't believe it contradicts itself - I believe that we may be too dense to understand all of it. For instance, predestination vs. free will - I believe they work together but I am not sure we can grasp how. I'm OK with that, and other things. What do you believe about the bible?

I also believe it all inspired by God. I believe that he had it written for a purpose, and that was for us to understand it. Im with you that we wont understand some of it, but thats ok, God said that would happen. Understanding is a lot about timing. Notice what he told Daniel....

"As for you, Daniel, keep the words secret, and seal up the book until the time of the end. Many will rove about, and the true knowledge will become abundant.” Daniel 12:4

Did you notice how long the truth is hidden(secret)?