Gay Radicals Disrupt/Protest Worship Services

[DallasApple]

I dont know..but it seems like whatever it is..it will be 'in our face' for sure.

What do you mean by "in your face"..?? You mean "visible"?

Love

Dallas

 

[Heneni]

Why do you keep talking like heterosexuals are a homogeneous group and that you speak for all of them? We're not the borg, and I'm definitely not frightened by homosexuals. To what, exactly, do they pose a threat?

Sorry, please add SOME to every time ive used the term HETEROSEXUAL. I have to add though...that the SOME is rather a VERY significant amount of people.

The SOME im talking about is the over six million in california who voted YES, and california is not really a conservative state, plus me and a LARGE amount of people I know and others know as well. But of course not you father.

Im not against gay unions. Im against the way they are going about this, and im against their dissatisfaction with civil unions. As far as im concerned it wasnt exactly what they wanted...but then who of us gets what we want all the time? Sometimes a little convincing goes a long way, and protests stop things dead in its tracks. Im not convinced that because they cant use the term 'marriage' they have been scarred for life.

heneni

 

[DallasApple]

You cant play the sympathy card while calling the heterosexuals oppressors.

I have not met or heard one gay person say that...

It does happen to be..that 99.99999999% of all those that want to reserve liberties for themsevles and exclude gays are probably hetero..

Love

Dallas

 

[Autodidact]

I talked about the poor to use it as an example of what other people might think is SLIGHTLY more important than gay marriages. And i think i wouldnt be alone when i say that indeed the plight of the poor is more important than the plight of gay marriages. But ok..to you gay marriages is important fair enough. So then...if its that important...go to court. You did, and you won. And then...that descision was overturned. Now what?

Well..realise that your tactics did not work. You should have had the backing of the millions who voted against it, before going to court. That would have been a better idea. You see...by taking this thing to court, you frightened many heterosexuals, by trying to use the arm of the law to take away from them what they percieve to be theirs. And now...youve lost clout and support.

Heneni

No, I don't think it's a very important issue at all. I can't imagine why all these people are so upset about it, as it's actually rather trivial. That's why I can't understand why you're so set against it, can you explain it?

And now you're just contradicting yourself. Gay people should work toward getting the support of millions of people--without trying to persuade people. How would that work exactly? As I've said several times, have you actually thought about this at all?

I'm not worried about it, though. It's right, and I'm confident that within a few generations it will be recognized. Actually I'm astonished at how fast it's progressing.

 

[Autodidact]

You live in america right? Do they kill you for having sex with a women? No.

Come to think of it, why arent gay people doing more to protect those in saudi arabia from getting killed?

Unless homosexuals start using the words injustice and inequality in a way that convinces heterosexuals that they are included in the homosexuals idea of justice and equality, you wont be making many friends with them.

To you, justice means getting 'married'. Im still trying to get my head around how marriage has become an injustice. It wasnt one before, until the homosexuals made it look like one. So then...why dont you rather take civil unions and make it better for yourself? NOOOOO.....we want to rock the boat and even if it kills you, you need to be 'married'. When the world extended a hand, you bit it off.

Heneni

Oh you are included, don't worry. We'll make sure you can still get married too. And again--what's the difference between civil union and marriage?

Anything is an injustice if it's arbitrarily denied to some people. In the early 60's, hamburgers were an injustice, buses were an injustice, swimming pools were an injustice.

 

[Autodidact]

So Heneni, if I understand your complaint correctly, it's that gay people weren't satisfied with "civil union," but are now pushing for full marriage rights? Is that the problem as you see it?

 

[Heneni]

What do you mean by "in your face"..?? You mean "visible"?

Love

Dallas

Let me explain what i mean about in your face. Its monday morning you put on the TV, and you see gay acitivist protesting. Later you pic up the newspaper and guess what? More of the same. Then you switch on the radio...and more of the same. THen you go on this forum and others...same thing. And most of the 'stuff' you hear and read and see has this overtone....'poor gays, they are also people, feel sorry for them, give them what they want, they cant help who they are, we are bigots if we dont, and we dont have a right to tell them who they should be and what they can and cant do'

Many gays people wanna have the freedom to be who they are, but they wont allow others to remain who they are. Cause that means they cant get 'married' and civil unions is not a good enough start for them.

Heneni

 

[Heneni]

So Heneni, if I understand your complaint correctly, it's that gay people weren't satisfied with "civil union," but are now pushing for full marriage rights? Is that the problem as you see it?

YEHHHH!!! Shes got it! YES, they should be PUSHING for full rights under a civil union. Not scratch the heterosexual marriage lions balls and cry when it doesnt work out.

Heneni

 

[DallasApple]

Let me explain what i mean about in your face. Its monday morning you put on the TV, and you see gay acitivist protesting. Later you pic up the newspaper and guess what? More of the same. Then you switch on the radio...and more of the same. THen you go on this forum and others...same thing. And most of the 'stuff' you hear and read and see has this overtone....'poor gays, they are also people, feel sorry for them, give them what they want, they cant help who they are, we are bigots if we dont, and we dont have a right to tell them who they should be and what they can and cant do'

Many gays people wanna have the freedom to be who they are, but they wont allow others to remain who they are. Cause that means they cant get 'married' and civil unions is not a good enough start for them.

Heneni

All civil rights movements are "in your face"

And HOW are gay people not "allowing" "others" to remain who they are?..HOW in day to day practical ways are gay people not allowing "others" to remain who they are?

Name ONE way..Just ONE ..that if gay people are allowed to get married it woud CHANGE your life???..How would it affect your "status"..What exactly is it that you would lose?

Love

Dallas

 

[Heneni]

No, I don't think it's a very important issue at all. I can't imagine why all these people are so upset about it, as it's actually rather trivial. That's why I can't understand why you're so set against it, can you explain it?

And now you're just contradicting yourself. Gay people should work toward getting the support of millions of people--without trying to persuade people. How would that work exactly? As I've said several times, have you actually thought about this at all?

I'm not worried about it, though. It's right, and I'm confident that within a few generations it will be recognized. Actually I'm astonished at how fast it's progressing.

Dont wait for a few generations to pass by.....you can change things NOW if you acknowledge that the term 'marriage' is not a trivial matter to many heterosexuals.

You might get your 'marriage' but will you have the respect of the heterosexuals? Hmmm....does it actually matter to you? Or is that a trivial little detail as well? We are an annoying fly in the oitment arent we?

Do homosexuals care about what other people feel? Or do they only care about getting what they percieve to be their right? Well, i dont think that you have been a good advocate for the homosexual cause. Perhaps others will succeed where you have failed. You constantly realy on making others look small in comparison to your noble cause. Maybe that will actually be your saving grace. Cant get to the top without stepping on others..

Its time to change tactics. That all im saying. And i dont think its wise to mess around with the heterosexual marriage. Having said that, the decline in respect that heterosexuals have for marriage, might just get you your 'marriage' sooner than later.


Heneni

 

[DallasApple]

.....you can change things NOW if you acknowledge that the term 'marriage' is not a trivial matter to many heterosexuals.

You can change things now if you acknowledge the term "marriage" is not a trivial matter to many homosexuals...

And I'll tell you what..you are probably better off..preaching that TO MANY heterosexuals..Who are on their 2nd 3rd 4th 5th 6th marriage..(and it wasn't cuz death did them part)..The ones afforded the "right" abuse it..Because they also have the right to "divorce"..Thats a real "deep" meaning there Heneni..What is done by a judge and so sacred..Can be "undone" by a judge..

Im "married" and I have a family that is inside that...I have to go..

Love

Dallas

 

[Heneni]

All civil rights movements are "in your face"

And HOW are gay people not "allowing" "others" to remain who they are?..HOW in day to day practical ways are gay people not allowing "others" to remain who they are?

Name ONE way..Just ONE ..that if gay people are allowed to get married it woud CHANGE your life???..How would it affect your "status"..What exactly is it that you would lose?

Love

Dallas

Its not my status im concernd about here. If they cant get married then they must elevate the status of a civil union to whatever they feel is fair to them.

Gay people expect straight people to CHANGE for them. But they wont change for straight people. If they did, they woulnt mess around with heterosexual marriages. Instead they expect the entire heterosexual community to change their perception about marriage to incorportate them. Some have, SOME WONT. Its a bit ambitious and frankly a little vain. Why dont the homosexuals change and let the heterosexuals keep their 'marriage'?

Anyway...this is a bit boring now.

But having said all i did and voicing my opinion, let it be known my dear homosexual friends, that if your in trouble, you can call on me. I'll still love you in the morning. BUT PLEASE....its time to take stock. Your different, your equal, now ACT like it. Dont try to be homosexual and dont cry oppression, depression, discrimination and all the like. Your my equal. Its time you to start believing it. Its only annoying when i consider you my equal and you protest and bicker and give me snotty comments. It means your not convinced of your own status. I cant help you lift yourself up if you keep on wanting to play the oppressed.

Heneni

 

[Sunstone]

I've never yet met a bigot who didn't have plenty of "good reasons" he or she was not a bigot. The problem is, their "good reasons" have never stood up to much scrutiny -- except, of course, in their own eyes. Bigots always hide behind BS reasons so they don't need to admit to themselves and others they are bigots.

 

[Autodidact]

Let me explain what i mean about in your face. Its monday morning you put on the TV, and you see gay acitivist protesting. Later you pic up the newspaper and guess what? More of the same. Then you switch on the radio...and more of the same. THen you go on this forum and others...same thing. And most of the 'stuff' you hear and read and see has this overtone....'poor gays, they are also people, feel sorry for them, give them what they want, they cant help who they are, we are bigots if we dont, and we dont have a right to tell them who they should be and what they can and cant do'

Many gays people wanna have the freedom to be who they are, but they wont allow others to remain who they are. Cause that means they cant get 'married' and civil unions is not a good enough start for them.

Heneni

I can't remember the last time I saw gay activists protesting anything. Where do you live?

Why do you keep saying that gay people are trying to not allow you to remain who you are? Are you afraid that gay people want straight not to get married or something? Other than wanting equality with straight people, how are gay people trying to change straight people?

I thought civil unions was a great start! As I said, I'm amazed at how far we've come. Of course, the eventual goal is full equality, as it should be. Why are you so opposed to it?

 

[Autodidact]

YEHHHH!!! Shes got it! YES, they should be PUSHING for full rights under a civil union. Not scratch the heterosexual marriage lions balls and cry when it doesnt work out.

Heneni

O.K., but if civil unions have "full rights," then how are they different from marriage?

 

[Autodidact]

Heneni: What on earth are you talking about? All I do is live my life, work, take my kids to school, participate in political and civil life, have friends, have fun and be myself. I honestly have no idea what you are drivelling on about not thinking I'm equal or whatever. I think I'm quite equal, thank you, now I just want the law to recognize it, that's all.

The more I think about it, the more I think it's the other side you need to talk to. I don't know anyone, gay or straight, who votes single-issue on gay marriage. But there are literally millions of religious conservatives who do vote based on opposition to gay marriage. This while the country is in the worst shape in decades. I think you need to go tell them that this issue is trivial, and not worth concerning themselves about. Because it really isn't. I mean, only something like 3% of the population is gay; who cares whether they get married or not? Other than gay people themselves, of course, who care very much.

 

[Heneni]

O.K., but if civil unions have "full rights," then how are they different from marriage?

Marriage is something that many heterosexual consider as part of their identity. Their sexuality is part of WHO they are. You understand that im sure. And so in effect there does not have to be any difference between a marriage and a civil union in the future, only in the sense that a marriage will still allow for people to distinguish themselves regarding their sexuality. Eventually when people become more comfortable with the whole idea of civil unions, there might even come a day where no distinction between marriage and civil union is needed, and people will feel comfortable with it. Right now, many are not comfortable with gay marriages, but have opened themselves up to civil unions. They wont let that part of their identity go, but they are willing to allow for others to have their own identity regarding marriage, only they feel it should be a civil union. WHAT that civil union entails is up to you.




Heneni

 

[Heneni]

I've never yet met a bigot who didn't have plenty of "good reasons" he or she was not a bigot. The problem is, their "good reasons" have never stood up to much scrutiny -- except, of course, in their own eyes. Bigots always hide behind BS reasons so they don't need to admit to themselves and others they are bigots.

And what was that about having my own mind again? OHHHH is seee...

You should read that authoritarian book of yours again. Its pretty much what your saying here. Dont let other people have an opinion, call them bigots and label their thoughts as BS. Thats the authoratarian way. well done.:clap

 

[Autodidact]

Marriage is something that many heterosexual consider as part of their identity. Their sexuality is part of WHO they are.

Might this also be true of homosexuals?

You understand that im sure. And so in effect there does not have to be any difference between a marriage and a civil union in the future, only in the sense that a marriage will still allow for people to distinguish themselves regarding their sexuality.

Why, can't you tell by looking which couples are gay and which straight?

Eventually when people become more comfortable with the whole idea of civil unions, there might even come a day where no distinction between marriage and civil union is needed, and people will feel comfortable with it.

Actually, I agree, Heneni, that's the way I see the whole thing going. First civil unions, then elimination of all distinction, then, why are we using different words anyway?

Right now, many are not comfortable with gay marriages, but have opened themselves up to civil unions. They wont let that part of their identity go, but they are willing to allow for others to have their own identity regarding marriage, only they feel it should be a civil union. WHAT that civil union entails is up to you.

But why on earth aren't they? How does it break their leg or pick their pocket? And no, it's not up to us, that's the whole point. It's up to the state.

 

[Autodidact]

Heneni: So this is what you think gay people should be doing? Oh look, they are. How about that? Do you think it will work?