German politician says: Ukraine will not win this war

[ImmortalFlame]

Wikipedia is a politically biased and influenced source which specialises in political hit pieces and disinformation.

You're hilarious.

I understand there's no point pursuing this any further with you,

And yet, your post continues...

'Independent'

Yep.

I would never make any such claim from any source, but it certainly has some uncomfortable truths in it, did you know you support neo-nazi's in Ukraine, they even wear the SS insignia. There was a time when even the BBC told some truth, then they conveniently forgot about it.

Neo Nazi threat in Ukraine

Ukraine's most-feared volunteers

The far-right group threatening to overthrow Ukraine's government

Did your government forget to mention this to you?

"I don't believe your propaganda, I just believe what these random videos and films approved by the Kremlin say!"

Meanwhile, in reality, the existence of Neo-Nazis in Ukraine is hardly special. They exist in most countries. It just so happens that the Neo-Nazis in Ukraine have a helpful attribute of being vehemently anti-Russian (because, y'know, the history of Russian meddling, annexation and genocide in the region), so they are kind of helpful to have around when Russia literally attempts to invade you. The fact that Ukraine have a Jewish president should indicate that it's a tad overblown, and the fact that Russia also uses Neo-Nazis as official parts of its own armed forces seems to have mysteriously escaped your attention.

Russian Neo-Nazis Participate in ‘Denazifying’ Ukraine – Der Spiegel - The Moscow Times

At least two neo-Nazi groups are fighting for Russian forces in Ukraine, throwing into question Moscow’s claims of “denazifying” its neighbor, German weekly Der Spiegel reported Sunday, citing a confidential intelligence report.

www.themoscowtimes.com

Who Are The Neo-Nazis Fighting For Russia In Ukraine?

The Kremlin has claimed its war on Ukraine is aimed at “de-Nazifying” the country. What about the neo-Nazi groups actively fighting on the Russian side?

www.rferl.org

Russia's long history of neo-Nazis

The Russian state’s long history of cultivating homegrown neo-Nazis

www.latrobe.edu.au

No, your presenting your own propaganda, but because you agree with it, it's ok, thats the truth.

I presented an online encyclopedia that you off-handedly dismiss despite being unable to refute a single claim I have made. You presented a video that was literally endorsed BY THE KREMLIN and several other random YouTube videos of dubious authenticity.

You mean puppet regime.

No, it was carried out by the government of Ukraine after Maidan.

I'd concentrate on your support of Neo Nazi's if I were you,

Ah yes, I support Neo-Nazis. A totally substantiated argument based on actual things I have said.

and obviously your maths isn't too great, I mean 750 bases verses 3, and a government that killed 3000 of it's own people in order to start a war and kill millions more in the ME, take those blinkers off buddy.

You gonna actually support anything you write, or just repeat Russian propaganda?

Got any comments on the fact that you insist Russia and Ukraine are "intrinsically joined since forever" and yet Ukraine voted OVERWHELMINGLY (92%) in favour of independence in 1991? Or are you just going to ignore that like literally all facts?

 

[Tony B]

You're hilarious.


And yet, your post continues...


Yep.


"I don't believe your propaganda, I just believe what these random videos and films produced by the Kremlin say!"

Meanwhile, in reality, the existence of Neo-Nazis in Ukraine is hardly special. They exist in most countries. The fact that Ukraine have a Jewish president should indicate that it's a tad overblown, and the fact that Russia also uses Neo-Nazis as official parts of its own armed forces seems to have mysteriously escaped your attentions.

Russian Neo-Nazis Participate in ‘Denazifying’ Ukraine – Der Spiegel - The Moscow Times

At least two neo-Nazi groups are fighting for Russian forces in Ukraine, throwing into question Moscow’s claims of “denazifying” its neighbor, German weekly Der Spiegel reported Sunday, citing a confidential intelligence report.

www.themoscowtimes.com

Who Are The Neo-Nazis Fighting For Russia In Ukraine?

The Kremlin has claimed its war on Ukraine is aimed at “de-Nazifying” the country. What about the neo-Nazi groups actively fighting on the Russian side?

www.rferl.org

Russia's long history of neo-Nazis

The Russian state’s long history of cultivating homegrown neo-Nazis

www.latrobe.edu.au

I presented an online encyclopedia that you off-handedly dismiss despite being unable to refute a single claim I have made. You presented a video that was literally endorsed BY THE KREMLIN and several other random YouTube videos of dubious authenticity.


No, it was carried out by the government of Ukraine after Maidan.


Ah yes, I support Neo-Nazis. A totally substantiated argument based on actual things I have said.


You gonna actually support anything you write, or just repeat Russian propaganda?

Got any comments on the fact that you insist Russia and Ukraine are "intrinsically joined since forever" and yet Ukraine voted OVERWHELMINGLY in favour of independence in 1991? Or are you just going to ignore that like literally all facts?

I generally don't waste my time with empty vessels. When you can grasp what your Government did to 3000 of it's own citizens then maybe you'll join the real world, in the meantime enjoy your time on the Truman show.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

I generally don't waste my time with empty vessels. When you can grasp what your Government did to 3000 of it's own citizens then maybe you'll join the real world, in the meantime enjoy your time on the Truman show.

When met with actual facts, you flee like all propagandists.

Also, which government do you think is "mine" exactly?

 

[Tony B]

When met with actual facts, you flee like all propagandists.

Also, which government do you think is "mine" exactly?

Mate, you're like a stuck record, completely stuck on transmit, you're Overton window central, there is no communication with you, so it doesn't really matter does it. You can't negotiate with someone who is deaf, dumb and blind.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

Mate, you're like a stuck record, completely stuck on transmit, you're Overton window central, there is no communication with you, so it doesn't really matter does it. You can't negotiate with someone who is deaf, dumb and blind.

I've answered your questions, you have never answered mine. You're the one stuck on repeat, posting videos instead of arguments and saying literally anything that discredits your position is propaganda.

So, I'll ask again. If Ukraine and Russia are "intrinsically joined since forever", why did Ukraine voted OVERWHELMINGLY (92%) in favour of independence in 1991?

 

[Tony B]

I've answered your questions, you have never answered mine. You're the one stuck on repeat, posting videos instead of arguments and saying literally anything that discredits your position is propaganda.

So, I'll ask again. If Ukraine and Russia are "intrinsically joined since forever", why did Ukraine voted OVERWHELMINGLY (92%) in favour of independence in 1991?

I gave you the last answer I'm going to give pal, there is no debate to be had with disingenuous people like yourself, you reap as you sow, find someone else to bore.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

I gave you the last answer I'm going to give pal,

So you admit that YOU'RE the one "completely stuck on transmit". I'm engaging, you're not.

there is no debate to be had with disingenuous people like yourself, you reap as you sow, find someone else to bore.

You must be really embarrassed to be folding this early. Did I scare you? I could debate you on your level, if you like:

"All your sources are propaganda, and you just get all your opinions from whatever government it is that I assume you live and the television I assume you watch! Imperialism is when you support a popular revolution, but it's not imperialism when you militarily invade your neighbour and steal their land and manipulate their government!"

Am I at your level yet?

 

[Flankerl]

Oh great another Social Media educated right winger who thinks he has seen the light of Russkiy Mir but won't move his butt to live there and get drafted.

 

[Tony B]

Oh great another Facebook educated right winger who thinks he has seen the light of Russkiy Mir but won't move his butt to live there and get drafted.

I don't use Facebook, I'm not that stupid, nor do I support any political party, nor do I support any side in any of these conflicts, apart from that you nailed it

 

[muhammad_isa]

It only seems so.

What people like @Estro Felino really mean with "compromise" in practice just means for Ukraine to bend over backwards with their pants down, while Russia gets whatever it demands..

Nope! We have to be realistic.
Do you even know what Russia is "demanding" ?

As we all know, in the days of the USSR, they were ALL "Russians" .. what's changed, exactly?
It's a lot more complex than making claims about polls of areas from either party.

Do you think that the majority of Ukranians would agree with a war that destroys 100's of thousands
of their men only to be defeated politically, if Trump gets in and drastically cuts support?
OF COURSE NOT !

All this does is create precedents and signals every dictatorial regime around the world that they can blackmail their way to their dreams..

No it doesn't.
One has to take each conflict, and see it in context.
..and not just from the perception of G7 nations, somehow thinking they are superior to everybody else.

That using force and aggression will be rewarded with meeting demands instead of punished.

That is a dangerous attitude .. it's also arrogant.

It would show incredible weakness and that, more so then anything else, is what will upset world balance.

What will upset "world balance", is provoking other nations to align against those who
are arrogant.

I don't particularly like Putin .. I didn't particularly like Saddam Hussein.
Escalation of wars leading to WWIII is ridiculous .. nuclear war is ridiculous.

The only way is through mediation.
That is not to say that war doesn't play a part .. that would be unrealistic.

..so .. rather than causing the death of more and more people by continual escalation, the "most
powerful nation in the world" should be thinking more about dialogue.

Zelensky and Nethanyahu are not prepared to make any compromise .. that is not surprising
.. they are both in serious conflicts .. the only time that they will de-escalate, is if their
support is reduced.

..so just like Israel blames Iran and is behind all the trouble, other nations will say that the trouble
is due to the US.

Might does not necessarily equal right.

 

[muhammad_isa]

They are paying Kiev to wage a war against Russia...because their dream is to conquer Moscow.

Nope .. that is unhelpful.
I would agree that the G7 wants to keep its stranglehold on power .. is that the same thing?
I don't think so.

 

[Estro Felino]

Nope .. that is unhelpful.
I would agree that the G7 wants to keep its stranglehold on power .. is that the same thing?
I don't think so.

I didn't understand anything.
Russia used to be a member of G7 too.