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Guilty or Not Guilty - Teacher Education

Guilty or Not Guilty

  • Guilty?

    Votes: 3 42.9%
  • Not Guilty?

    Votes: 4 57.1%

  • Total voters
    7

Guitar's Cry

Disciple of Pan
Actually, the "conservatives" LOVE education and that is why they homeschool and produce better results :D

It wouldn't surprise me if better results were found in homeschooling on basic subjects, especially if the teacher is educated, given it would mean one-on-one with a likely more trusted adult and more accountability. I am also sure conservatives would be more happy with the results since they have complete control over the content.

Problem is not every home is capable of doing this. There's a reason why the school lockdowns became a major issue and why SEL has become important as part of the public school system.
 

SomeRandom

Still learning to be wise
Staff member
Premium Member
It wouldn't surprise me if better results were found in homeschooling on basic subjects, especially if the teacher is educated, given it would mean one-on-one with a likely more trusted adult and more accountability. I am also sure conservatives would be more happy with the results since they have complete control over the content.

Problem is not every home is capable of doing this. There's a reason why the school lockdowns became a major issue and why SEL has become important as part of the public school system.
Forgive my ignorance but what is SEL?
 

Kenny

Face to face with my Father
Premium Member
It wouldn't surprise me if better results were found in homeschooling on basic subjects, especially if the teacher is educated, given it would mean one-on-one with a likely more trusted adult and more accountability. I am also sure conservatives would be more happy with the results since they have complete control over the content.

Problem is not every home is capable of doing this. There's a reason why the school lockdowns became a major issue and why SEL has become important as part of the public school system.
No problem - not every school produces results either. But we don’t have to worry about lockdowns, strikes, indoctrination, and things like that.

Homeschooling has come a long way where resources are pooled together with parents, experts in their fields, help out. Science projects happen, actual court cases performed before judges, debates, logical thinking, intense course depth.

Our 6th grade students can actually draw a map of the world and name with a 90%+ accuracy every country with their capitals. Public schools just can't match that.

I am happy that within the broken school system we still have some good teachers
 
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Kenny

Face to face with my Father
Premium Member
I have seen different interpretations of that.
So please site a primary source and not secondary and one that is not biased.
The problem with finding a source that one can rely on usually translates into, “one that doesn’t say something contrary to what I believe” -


Then you have those sites that support public schools that don’t want to give a good look at homeschooling.

So have fun trying to find one that you can agree with, and that is honest
 

Kenny

Face to face with my Father
Premium Member
I don't know what you're talking about.

I addressed the Fox News and the LIfesitenews articles.

You have yet to offer a single respond that addresses what I said. You have yet to answer anyone's questions about anything.
If you had read the report, they reference the report of Dept of Ed
 

Kenny

Face to face with my Father
Premium Member
Sheesh Kenny, do you ever actually answer questions? I mean, a simple question like "what's your point" shouldn't be so difficult or problematic to answer.....unless you're hiding something.

I'd ask what "systemic problem" you're referring to, but I have a feeling you won't answer that either.
The point is that those in charge of education have gone from education that deals with giving knowledge about things like biology, chemistry, math, grammar et al to promoting culture and personal beliefs such as graphic sex books as shown by the Op
 

Curious George

Veteran Member
The point is that those in charge of education have gone from education that deals with giving knowledge about things like biology, chemistry, math, grammar et al to promoting culture and personal beliefs such as graphic sex books as shown by the Op
No book in the OP. I think that is the other thread where a middle school student read from a book a scene where they dealt with teenagers engaged in sexual activity.
 

Kenny

Face to face with my Father
Premium Member
No book in the OP. I think that is the other thread where a middle school student read from a book a scene where they dealt with teenagers engaged in sexual activity.
Whether books, which there are problems, games, or other methods - it's the same animal with different colors. The book was another post... sorry, mixed up on when it was posted.
 
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Curious George

Veteran Member
Whether books, which there are problems, games, or other methods - it's the same animal with different colors. The book was another post... sorry, mixed up on when it was posted.
I don’t think it is the same. Did you see my post of how the game is played? Literary depictions of sexual activity and a game that, in some circles, has an offensive name are not the same.

But no worries, I had read the other thread and had assumed, correctly, that you were referencing it. I was just trying to keep the focus. We are now discussing three different instances. And for the record, I think the book is okay, the game, if used, should be called by the more politically correct name, and, the assignment was out of line and that curriculum should be tossed.
 

SkepticThinker

Veteran Member
If you had read the report, they reference the report of Dept of Ed
As I pointed out, the findings of the Fox article are based on a "Fox News Digital Analysis,"
And what of the 19-year-old report? What would you like to draw my attention to? Did you read through the entire thing? Do you expect me to? I have to wonder why Fox News is referencing a 19-year-old report. Couldn't they find something more current? Or perhaps that old one best fits their narrative. Sorry, but I can't trust them and you shouldn't either.

Looks like I was right in being skeptical. Here's an article discussing said 1994 Report:

"A report claiming that close to 10 percent of children in public schools—more than 4.5 million—endure sexual abuse or misconduct by school employees has recently touched off a media-fueled panic.

However, “Educator Sexual Misconduct,” by Carol Shakeshaft of Hofstra University, is seriously flawed, both in its methodology and in the way researchers defined sexual abuse and misconduct.

Rather than critically evaluating the report, the media have instead been trumpeting its frightening figures of abuse. Parents deserve better; they deserve the facts.

In the report, Shakeshaft defines “sexual abuse” in an extremely broad manner to include “physical, verbal, or visual” behavior by an educator ranging from sexual intercourse to telling inappropriate jokes. One study cited in the report included sexual comments, gestures or looks in its definition of sexual abuse and asked students if other students had committed such acts toward themselves or each other.

In his preface to the report, Deputy Secretary of Education Eugene Hickock observes that the terms “sexual abuse” and “sexual misconduct” are used interchangeably, which he calls “potentially confusing.” Some data-analysts use loose definitions in order to include differing yet relevant studies within their analysis. This does not appear to be Shakeshaft’s intent.

Although the subtitle of Shakeshaft’s report is “a synthesis of existing literature,” the report is not a meta-analysis. Meta-analysis consists of combining the data provided by multiple sources, all the while being meticulously careful to acknowledge and to adjust for differences in how those sources have collected or defined the data.

For example, they may have studied vastly divergent populations.

Shakeshaft states that, because so few empirical studies in this area exist, meta-analysis is not merited. Instead, she offers a review of “existing literature” which purportedly excludes “discussions ... not based on data.” Which literature does she review?

The use of sources in the report is no less confusing than its definitions. There are nearly 900 citations to news reports from Australia, Britain, Canada and all corners of the U.S., which date from 1989 to 2003. Some citations have little bearing on the report’s focus, e.g., accounts of abuse by priests. Presumably the citations are meant to indicate the prevalence of the claimed sexual abuse. If so, the attempt fails. Several hundred stories stretched over 15 years and three continents do not point to 4.5 million American children being abused today. ..."

 

SkepticThinker

Veteran Member
The point is that those in charge of education have gone from education that deals with giving knowledge about things like biology, chemistry, math, grammar et al to promoting culture and personal beliefs such as graphic sex books as shown by the Op
It appears that you are declaring that the exception is the rule here.

We used to discuss current cultural and social events daily in my fourth grade class. That was 33 years ago.
 

Curious George

Veteran Member
As I pointed out, the findings of the Fox article are based on a "Fox News Digital Analysis,"
And what of the 19-year-old report? What would you like to draw my attention to? Did you read through the entire thing? Do you expect me to? I have to wonder why Fox News is referencing a 19-year-old report. Couldn't they find something more current? Or perhaps that old one best fits their narrative. Sorry, but I can't trust them and you shouldn't either.

Looks like I was right in being skeptical. Here's an article discussing said 1994 Report:

"A report claiming that close to 10 percent of children in public schools—more than 4.5 million—endure sexual abuse or misconduct by school employees has recently touched off a media-fueled panic.

However, “Educator Sexual Misconduct,” by Carol Shakeshaft of Hofstra University, is seriously flawed, both in its methodology and in the way researchers defined sexual abuse and misconduct.

Rather than critically evaluating the report, the media have instead been trumpeting its frightening figures of abuse. Parents deserve better; they deserve the facts.

In the report, Shakeshaft defines “sexual abuse” in an extremely broad manner to include “physical, verbal, or visual” behavior by an educator ranging from sexual intercourse to telling inappropriate jokes. One study cited in the report included sexual comments, gestures or looks in its definition of sexual abuse and asked students if other students had committed such acts toward themselves or each other.

In his preface to the report, Deputy Secretary of Education Eugene Hickock observes that the terms “sexual abuse” and “sexual misconduct” are used interchangeably, which he calls “potentially confusing.” Some data-analysts use loose definitions in order to include differing yet relevant studies within their analysis. This does not appear to be Shakeshaft’s intent.

Although the subtitle of Shakeshaft’s report is “a synthesis of existing literature,” the report is not a meta-analysis. Meta-analysis consists of combining the data provided by multiple sources, all the while being meticulously careful to acknowledge and to adjust for differences in how those sources have collected or defined the data.

For example, they may have studied vastly divergent populations.

Shakeshaft states that, because so few empirical studies in this area exist, meta-analysis is not merited. Instead, she offers a review of “existing literature” which purportedly excludes “discussions ... not based on data.” Which literature does she review?

The use of sources in the report is no less confusing than its definitions. There are nearly 900 citations to news reports from Australia, Britain, Canada and all corners of the U.S., which date from 1989 to 2003. Some citations have little bearing on the report’s focus, e.g., accounts of abuse by priests. Presumably the citations are meant to indicate the prevalence of the claimed sexual abuse. If so, the attempt fails. Several hundred stories stretched over 15 years and three continents do not point to 4.5 million American children being abused today. ..."

Thank you for taking the time to address this.
 

metis

aged ecumenical anthropologist
Actually, the "conservatives" LOVE education and that is why they homeschool and produce better results :D
You might want to read this first: Homeschooling vs Public School - Free Essay Example | PapersOwl.com

Also, what about parents who don't have a relatively high educational level themselves?

BTW, homeschooling is a lot like in-breeding, thus the child can come out with a limited slant on many topics since (s)he may not be exposed to anything other than the parent's viewpoints. For example, if the parents are racists, home-schooling would be right up their alley. If one wants then never to look at anther denomination or religion, that's another advantage of homeschooling.

My wife is a by-product of the parochial school system, and even though she's a devout Catholic, she wanted our kids to go to public schools for the sake of diversity minus "grooming" to only consider her religious viewpoints. Remember "grooming", Ken? :D
 
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Jose Fly

Fisker of men
The point is that those in charge of education have gone from education that deals with giving knowledge about things like biology, chemistry, math, grammar et al to promoting culture and personal beliefs such as graphic sex books as shown by the Op
So are these people "in charge of education" mandating students read these books? Are they reading them to the students?
 

Jose Fly

Fisker of men
For an example:


Memorize the content below? Is this really "education"?
As is often the case, the conservative source for this isn't giving the full story.

The assignment was given in a theater class, and was for each student to write a monologue that another student would act out. Every student had the option to decline to read the one they were given and read a different one. The student who's mom is in the video didn't express any concerns about the monologue and never even mentioned it to the mom. According to the article linked above, the mom found it two months after the assignment.
 
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