Homosexuality

[Shadow Wolf]

A man looking upon a woman with lust isn’t homosexual attraction. It isn’t even particularly heterosexual attraction. Lust and attraction aren’t the same thing.

It's what Jesus said. You look upon someone with lust amd you are guilty of fornication.
And we don't really lust for things we aren't attracted to.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

This also doesn’t speak to homosexuality. It speaks to a particular act which, in that particular culture, was considered to be immoral. It says nothing about loving, mutual, and consensual relationships.

It wasn't a specific culture. It was referring to specific acts. And ultimately homosexuals do not inherit the Kingdom. It isn't a specific culture, it is gods law.

 

[MyM]

That’s obvious. If you knew more about what constitutes homosexuality, you’d see that the Creator never mentions it in the Bible.


Nope. See above. These aren’t “homosexual acts.” They’re acts of gang-rape. Same-sex gang rape isn’t an act of sexual orientation; it’s an act of violence.

You’re misinterpreting what the Bible says. The sin was inhospitality and violence, not sexual orientation.

It is mentioned in the Bible and in the story of Lot it is mentioned the men wanted the men inside. .... just read

 

[Left Coast]

I must have missed it sorry what was it that you wanted to know about Ezekiel?

Ezekiel identifies the sin of Sodom and Gomorrah. Do you know what it is?

the angels made themselves known to Lot

In the story, Lot immediately recognizes them on sight, as does Abraham.

 

[sojourner]

It's what Jesus said. You look upon someone with lust amd you are guilty of fornication.
And we don't really lust for things we aren't attracted to.

Of course we do. Consider prison rape. Those men aren’t homosexual, and they’re not sexually attracted to their victims. They do, however lust for the dominance and violence.

 

[sojourner]

It wasn't a specific culture. It was referring to specific acts. And ultimately homosexuals do not inherit the Kingdom. It isn't a specific culture, it is gods law.

Of course it is. It certainly isn’t our culture. “Homosexuals” are never mentioned in the Bible. “God’s Law” is culturally-derived.

 

[sojourner]

It is mentioned in the Bible and in the story of Lot it is mentioned the men wanted the men inside. .... just read

find me one single instance of the word “homosexual” appearing in the Greek or Hebrew texts. You can’t, because those words don’t exist in either ancient Hebrew, or in Koine Greek. Why not? Because homosexuality wasn’t conceived of in those cultures. There was no such thing in their minds as “sexual orientation.” The mob wanted to rape the visitors — not love them. That makes it, not an act of homosexuality, but an act of violence.

 

[Martin]

If there is some kind of all powerful God responsible for creating the universe, I don't imagine it would care about the bedroom antics of some intelligent apes in the corner of a distant galaxy.
Is it more likely that the Bible authors lived in a homophobic culture?

 

[MyM]

Ezekiel identifies the sin of Sodom and Gomorrah. Do you know what it is?



In the story, Lot immediately recognizes them on sight, as does Abraham.

In Islam, the angels were not known on first sight.

Was the whoredom that she committed. still is an extremely weird weird weird story to be attributed unto God.

 

[Mock Turtle]

Ironic....the most compassion is, once again, from an atheist.

Probably more surprising perhaps since I was sexually abused by an older boy when a child and which did affect me for a number of years - which I have mentioned before. But I couldn't really project his behaviour onto others, and just doing sufficient thinking enabled me to come to a sensible conclusion as to this. And as remarked, attitudes have gotten so much better here and elsewhere around the world as to becoming more tolerant and accepting.

 

[Left Coast]

In Islam, the angels were not known on first sight.

That's nice. But it's not what the actual story says.

Was the whoredom that she committed. still is an extremely weird weird weird story to be attributed unto God.

Incorrect. Want to try again with a reference?

 

[Sand Dancer]

No one is fair game for crimes.

I agree. Just saying that it was a cultural norm, albeit very wrong.

 

[Martin]

I'm following from @Vouthon's thread which seems to be going in a different direction.

I saw on there some folks saying that essentially homosexual kin should be let go of. I first would like to know how Christians accord this with 'forgive seventy times seven' and eating with sinners and so on, and second how could any person, in his heart, disown a brother or sister or whoever, or a friend, for this? One can disagree with the behaviour, or one can repudiate the person, but I don't think this is an issue like murder or rape, by any means. In every other area of his life he could be a stellar person, a model student, a great giver, a considerate worker, but you're going to kick him out because he fell in love with another boy?

Could you find it in yourself to disown someone over this? Some of your friends may be closeted, some may be out, some may be your brothers or sisters.

Is this the way forward? I disagree massively with what the LGBT movement has done and become and I do not own any of that. But that is not what I'm talking about.

I'm pretty sure my sister is straight, but it wouldn't bother me in the slightest if she wasn't. Apart from anything else, it's her business, not mine.

 

[MyM]

find me one single instance of the word “homosexual” appearing in the Greek or Hebrew texts. You can’t, because those words don’t exist in either ancient Hebrew, or in Koine Greek. Why not? Because homosexuality wasn’t conceived of in those cultures. There was no such thing in their minds as “sexual orientation.” The mob wanted to rape the visitors — not love them. That makes it, not an act of homosexuality, but an act of violence.

the word may not have existed but the acts did. It's not that hard to find

If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them. Leviticus 20:13

Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination. Leviticus 18:22

Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind 1 Corinthians 6:9

 

[MyM]

That's nice. But it's not what the actual story says.



Incorrect. Want to try again with a reference?

In Islam, it is

lol I don't know much about that story except from Ezekiel 16 ..is that what you are referring to?

 

[1213]

...
Could you find it in yourself to disown someone over this? Some of your friends may be closeted, some may be out, some may be your brothers or sisters.
....

I think the homosexual act is basically the same as trying to eat through your ear, because it is also hole in your head. It is not reasonable. And I rather be with reasonable people.

But, I don’t think this is a problem, because I think they wouldn’t really want to be in my company either, which is why I think we are even.

Also, it is interesting, why they use rainbow flag as their symbol. It symbols segregation, because all colors are separated. If they truly are for equality, they should have brown flag, because in that all colors are mixed up equally. Much better symbol for equality.

 

[Left Coast]

In Islam, it is

The story is from the Bible. If Islam has a different, later version of the story, I can't speak to that.

lol I don't know much about that story except from Ezekiel 16 ..is that what you are referring to?

Yes, what does the chapter say the sin of Sodom was?

 

[MyM]

The story is from the Bible. If Islam has a different, later version of the story, I can't speak to that.



Yes, what does the chapter say the sin of Sodom was?

She was a prostitute but what does that have to do with Ezekiel and lot?

 

[Rival]

She was a prostitute but what does that have to do with Ezekiel and lot?

Ezekiel 16:49,

“Now this was the sin of your sister Sodom: she and her daughters were arrogant, overfed and unconcerned; they did not help the poor and needy."

 

[sojourner]

the word may not have existed but the acts did. It's not that hard to find

If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them. Leviticus 20:13

Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination. Leviticus 18:22

Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind 1 Corinthians 6:9

Acts are not the orientation. Therefore, the Bible identifies acts — not orientations. Since homosexuality is an orientation and not an act, the Bible doesn’t speak about homosexuality.