Homosexuality

[ftv1975]

What do you mean a balance between male and female?

Usually when people mean balance where no actual quantifiable variable can be measured the term balance is New Age nonsense. Such as the balance between good and evil and other non-wisdom.

So tell me what this balance is between male and female.

I wonder when one factors in the infertility rate of men and women as well as adding in intersex on top of the percentage of individuals with sexual attraction towards the same sex, a natural attraction, one wonders if this supposed God who created a balance isn't the world's biggest fool or most inept engineer. Because if there is to be a "balance" this so called designer did a half-assed job of it.

As far as the "balance" of a man and woman as parental figures I merely point to the long human history of extended families. In which children were raised by a varying number of males and females, direct and indirect relatives, in large communal societies and the notion of leaving the nest, living with one other person and producing a child in a neat 1950's idyllic lifestyle is the iconoclasm that doesn't seem to be working out so well when we try to force or coerce others to adhere to it.

Balance? Not between men and women, good and evil, the Earth and whatever (Al Gore?), etc. Only the Law of Thermodynamics implies any type of balance of energy and matter in the Universe. Something tells me certain posters are using too much energy for the wrong reasons. Perhaps they are out of balance.

men and women are made up of energy and matter!

 

[ftv1975]

This is a lie.

I get tired of people slandering me. It's immoral. It's morally wrong. Stop doing it. Would you like it if someone did it to you? You are morally obligated to make some effort to find out the facts before spreading insidious lies about entire groups of people to which you do not belong.

Do you enjoy it when people tell lies about Mormons? Did you know that all Mormons are idiots who are so stupid they actually believe the baloney in the Book of Mormon? Did you know that Mormons believe that there are innumerable Gods, and they want to become a God?

Did you enjoy that slander? Neither do I. Stop doing it. Thank you.

i haven't told any lies!

 

[ftv1975]

And who put you in charge of deciding the purpose of my sex life? I'll make a deal with you. I'll allow you to decide the purpose of your pitiful sex life, and you allow me the same respect, O.K.?

nobody put me in charge of anything just have an opinion just as you do.

 

[Sunstone]

then tell me what is the point? in plain english. what is the point of having sperm? what is the point of having ovaries? How to procreation get accompished?

Are you seriously suggesting that anything in nature has a point or purpose? If so, could you provide some hard evidence for your assertion that sperm and ovaries have a purpose?

It is obvious things in nature have functions. But to assert they have purposes is so quaint as to be downright Medieval.

 

[Nepenthe]

MARRIAGE MATTERS​

Why Children Need a Male and Female Parent Glenn T. Stanton

Glenn T. Stanton is hardly a scholarly reference; I don't ascribe much importance to a masters degree in Interdisciplinary Humanities applied to the Social Research and Cultural Affairs and Senior Research Analyst for Marriage and Sexuality at a prop'-tank like Focus on the Family. Yes, James Dobson's Focus on the Family... which leads to:

You also reference Kyle D. Pruett, a Harvard trained PhD, several times. Yet Dr. Pruett's research shows that same sex families are just as healthy and nurturing. Dobson, and Focus on the Family, misinterpreted, misquoted and cherry picked data from Pruett's studies to support their bigoted agenda.

"Look, I said, if you're going to use my research to judge and implicate personal decisions people are making, you are going to hear from me about it because I consider this a destructive use of good science," Dr. Pruett said in an interview.

While "fathers make unique contributions to children, never do I say in my book that children of gay parents are at risk. Love binds parents and children together, not gender. There are plenty of boys and girls from these families with masculine and feminine role models who turn out just fine."
​

And here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KPuTQAoO7qo

​

 

[cardero]

Nothing in nature dictates that any physical entity should marry, have sex, reproduce or encourage the institution of family.

 

[ftv1975]

Are you seriously suggesting that anything in nature has a point or purpose? If so, could you provide some hard evidence for your assertion that sperm and ovaries have a purpose?

It is obvious things in nature have functions. But to assert they have purposes is so quaint as to be downright Medieval.

LOL! that was funny. you had me going there to think that nothing in nature has or surves a purpose.

 

[ftv1975]

[/i][/size]

Glenn T. Stanton is hardly a scholarly reference; I don't ascribe much importance to a masters degree in Interdisciplinary Humanities applied to the Social Research and Cultural Affairs and Senior Research Analyst for Marriage and Sexuality at a prop'-tank like Focus on the Family. Yes, James Dobson's Focus on the Family... which leads to:

You also reference Kyle D. Pruett, a Harvard trained PhD, several times. Yet Dr. Pruett's research shows that same sex families are just as healthy and nurturing. Dobson, and Focus on the Family, misinterpreted, misquoted and cherry picked data from Pruett's studies to support their bigoted agenda.

"Look, I said, if you're going to use my research to judge and implicate personal decisions people are making, you are going to hear from me about it because I consider this a destructive use of good science," Dr. Pruett said in an interview.

While "fathers make unique contributions to children, never do I say in my book that children of gay parents are at risk. Love binds parents and children together, not gender. There are plenty of boys and girls from these families with masculine and feminine role models who turn out just fine."​

And here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KPuTQAoO7qo

how is it that a 3 or 4 year old can know they are gay? thanks for the information.

 

[Vile Atheist]

LOL! that was funny. you had me going there to think that nothing in nature has or surves a purpose.

Everything is made of chemicals and the results of interactions of those chemicals. What is the purpose of chemicals?

 

[Smoke]

how is it that a 3 or 4 year old can know they are gay? thanks for the information.

I knew no later than the age of two that I was gay. I didn't know the word for it, and I didn't understand about sex and relationships, but I knew that boys stirred me in a way that girls did not, and I knew that it was not a good idea to let people know about that, because they wouldn't like it.

I may have known earlier, but I don't remember anything before the age of two.

 

[Sunstone]

LOL! that was funny. you had me going there to think that nothing in nature has or surves a purpose.

Is that the best support you can give your lunatic theory that nature has purposes? The very best support you can give it?

 

[Autodidact]

Okay show me the research that convinced you?

"a growing body of scientific literature demonstrates that children who grow up with 1 or 2 gay and/or lesbian parents fare as well in emotional, cognitive, social, and sexual functioning as do children whose parents are heterosexual." Pediatrics Magazine

21 studies which "almost uniformly reports findings of no notable differences between children reared by heterosexual parents and those reared by lesbian and gay parents..."
Judith Stacey & Timothy Biblarz, "(How) does the sexual orientation of parents matter?" American Sociological Review, 2001-APR

A range of rigorous studies has shown that children in lesbian families do at least
as well as children in heterosexual families. Recent studies have identified some
differences in child outcomes, most of which are positive. The outcomes for
children growing up with lesbian parents include:
· no difference in cognitive function;
· no difference in emotional function;
· no difference in psychological and behavioural development;
· gender role behaviour: children tend to play gender-typical games,
however, some male and female children of lesbian parents show less
traditionally gender-ascribed traits;
· no differences in sexuality identity for adult offspring of lesbian and nonlesbian
families, although some adults from lesbian families are more likely
to consider the possibility of not being heterosexual, and are more likely to
report same-sex experience;
· children show more awareness and understanding of diversity more
generally; and
Ruth McNair (2004) Outcomes for Children Born of ART in a Diverse Range of Families (Occasional Paper), Melbourne: Victorian Law Reform Commission

The American Psychological Association, American Psychiatric Association and National Association of Social Workers have stated in an Amicus curiae brief presented to the Supreme Court of the State of California: "The scientific research that has directly compared outcomes for children with gay and lesbian parents with outcomes for children with heterosexual parents has been remarkably consistent in showing that lesbian and gay parents are every bit as fit and capable as heterosexual parents, and their children are as psychologically healthy and well-adjusted as children reared by heterosexual parents. Amici emphasize that the abilities of gay and lesbian persons as parents and the positive outcomes for their children are not areas where credible scientific researchers disagree. Statements by the leading associations of experts in this area reflect professional consensus that children raised by lesbian or gay parents do not differ in any important respects from those raised by heterosexual parents. No credible empirical research suggests otherwise.

The Australian Psychological Society has stated: "The family studies literature indicates that it is family processes (such as the quality of parenting and relationships within the family) that contribute to determining children’s wellbeing and ‘outcomes’, rather than family structures, per se, such as the number, gender, sexuality and co-habitation status of parents. The research indicates that parenting practices and children’s outcomes in families parented by lesbian and gay parents are likely to be at least as favourable as those in families of heterosexual parents, despite the reality that considerable legal discrimination and inequity remain significant challenges for these families."[

"Despite considerable variation in the quality of their samples, research design, measurement methods, and data analysis techniques, the findings to date have been remarkably consistent. Empirical research to date has consistently failed to find linkages between children’s well-being and the sexual orientation of their parents. If gay, lesbian, or bisexual parents were inherently less capable than otherwise comparable heterosexual parents, their children would evidence problems regardless of the type of sample. This pattern clearly has not been observed.
Gregory M. Herek, The American Psychologist

"The vast consensus of all the studies shows that children of same-sex parents do as well as children whose parents are heterosexual in every way," she tells WebMD. "In some ways children of same-sex parents actually may have advantages over other family structures."Researchers looked at information gleaned from 15 studies on more than 500 children, evaluating possible stigma, teasing and social isolation, adjustment and self-esteem, opposite gender role models, sexual orientation, and strengths.

Studies from 1981 to 1994, including 260 children reared by either heterosexual mothers or same-sex mothers after divorce, found no differences in intelligence, type or prevalence of psychiatric disorders, self-esteem, well-being, peer relationships, couple relationships, or parental stress.

"Some studies showed that single heterosexual parents' children have more difficulties than children who have parents of the same sex," Perrin says. "They did better in discipline, self-esteem, and had less psychosocial difficulties at home and at school." from here.

I could post a lot more but don't have time.

If you find conclusions floating around the net to the contrary, they are from known, proven liars like Focus on the Family or the Family Research Council.

 

[Autodidact]

so do you feel that men and women are the same and the only difference is the physical?

Not at all. What I know (don't feel) is that the significant differences between men and women do not result in different outcomes for their children. I know this because scientific research tells us this.

 

[Autodidact]

MARRIAGE MATTERS​

Why Children Need a Male and Female Parent Glenn T. Stanton

• “The cooperative input and influence of a male parent and a female parent is essential for proper child development.
• “As fathering expert Dr. Kyle Pruett of Yale Medical School explains in Fatherneed: Why Father Care is as Essential as Mother Care for Your Child, “fathers do not mother.” Psychology Today explains, “fatherhood turns out to be a complex and unique phenomenon with huge consequences for the emotional and intellectual growth of children.” A father, as a male parent, brings unique contributions to the parenting project.
• Likewise, a mother, as a female, uniquely impacts the life and development of her child, as Dr. Brenda Hunter explains in her book, The Power of Mother Love: Transforming Both Mother and Child. Erik Erikson, a pioneer in the world of child psychology, explained that father love and mother love are qualitatively different kinds of love. As cited in Kyle D. Pruett, The Nurturing Father, (New York: Warner Books, 1987), p. 49.

Mothers and Fathers parent Differently

• Dr. Pruett: By 8 weeks of age, infants can tell the difference between a male or female interacting with them. This diversity, in itself, provides children with a broader, richer experience of contrasting relational interactions—more so than for children who are raised by only one gender. Whether they realize it or not, children are learning at earliest age, by sheer experience, that men and women are different and have different ways of dealing with life, other adults and children.

Mothers and Fathers Play Differently

• Fathers tend to play with, and mothers tend to care for, children….Fathers encourage competition; mothers encourage equity. One style encourages independence while the other encourages security….Both provide security and confidence in their own ways by communicating love and physical intimacy.

Fathers Push Limits; Mothers Encourage Security

• Either of these parenting styles by themselves can be unhealthy. One can tend toward encouraging risk without consideration of consequences. The other tends to avoid risk, which can fail to build independence, confidence and progress. Joined together, they keep each other in balance and help children remain safe while expanding their experiences and confidence.

Mothers and Fathers Communicate Differently

• Father’s talk tends to be more brief, directive and to the point. It also makes greater use of subtle body language. Mothers tend to be more descriptive, personal and verbally encouraging.

Fathers and Mothers Prepare Children for Life Differently

• Dads tend to see their child in relation to the rest of the world. Mothers tend to see the rest of the world in relation to their child.

Fathers Provide a Look at the World of Men; Mothers, the World of Women

• Girls and boys who grow up with a father are more familiar and secure with the curious world of men. Girls with involved, married fathers are more likely to have healthier relationships with boys in adolescence and men in adulthood because they learn from their fathers how proper men act toward women. They also learn from mom how to live in a woman’s world. This knowledge builds emotional security and safety from the exploitation of predatory males.
• Mothers help boys understand the female world and develop a sensitivity toward women. They also help boys know how to relate and communicate with women.

Fathers and Mothers Teach Respect for the Opposite Sex

• FACT: A married father is substantially less likely to abuse his wife or children than men in any other category. This means that boys and girls with married fathers in the home learn, by observation, how men should treat women.
• The American Journal of Sociology finds that, “Societies with father-present patterns of child socialization produce men who are less inclined to exclude women from public activities than their counterparts in father-absent societies.” Scott Coltrane, “Father-Child Relationships and the Status of Women: A Cross-Cultural Study,” American Journal of Sociology, 93 (1988) p. 1088.
• Girls and boys with married mothers learn from their mothers what a healthy, respectful female relationship with men looks like.

CONCLUSION
When we disregard the gender distinctions of parental influence as unimportant or unnecessary, we seriously diminish the proper development of children. Kids need the active participation of a mother and a father, and both parents need to be true to their gender designs. Both bring different and equally important things to the parenting project. We impoverish children and society when we deny our kids the influence of a mother and father, because we limit their development into full, healthy adults.

Fascinating theory. However it turns out to be wrong. Because when we study the actual outcomes of actual children, the only significant differences turn out to be that adult children of same-sex couples are more flexible and open-minded. Sorry, these guys are wrong.

 

[Autodidact]

What Single-Parenting Can Tell Us About Same-Sex Parenting
MercatorNet. A voice for human dignity. Our focus is parenting and family issues, bioethics, religion, philosophy and entertainment.

more info on same sex parenting.

Didn't click on the link. Just want to point out before I do that single-parenting is not a good way to learn about same-sex parenting. To do actual scientific research, you hold the other variables constant, and look at the one you're examining in isolation. So we hold the number of parents constant, and compare the gender. And we see that same-sex parents do AT LEAST as well.

When I have time, I'll explain an enormous advantage that same-sex parents have, and why this research is actually biased in favor of different-sex parents.

 

[Autodidact]

What Single-Parenting Can Tell Us About Same-Sex Parenting
MercatorNet. A voice for human dignity. Our focus is parenting and family issues, bioethics, religion, philosophy and entertainment.

more info on same sex parenting.

Ah, clicked on the first link. I see that Jason Dulle is a total liar. He asserts that heterosexual families do better, but doesn't cite a single piece of research in support of his lie. I'm guessing that's because he knows it doesn't.

 

[ftv1975]

Is that the best support you can give your lunatic theory that nature has purposes? The very best support you can give it?

oh! you were being serious. here is a website that explains sexual organs and what there pupspose are.HowStuffWorks "How Sex Works"

 

[Kerr]

oh! you were being serious. here is a website that explains sexual organs and what there pupspose are.HowStuffWorks "How Sex Works"

Well, that is humans at last, it does not apply everywhere. Anyway, no, there is no higher purpose in nature. It is all about what survives and not. To put it simple.

 

[ftv1975]

"a growing body of scientific literature demonstrates that children who grow up with 1 or 2 gay and/or lesbian parents fare as well in emotional, cognitive, social, and sexual functioning as do children whose parents are heterosexual." Pediatrics Magazine

21 studies which "almost uniformly reports findings of no notable differences between children reared by heterosexual parents and those reared by lesbian and gay parents..."
Judith Stacey & Timothy Biblarz, "(How) does the sexual orientation of parents matter?" American Sociological Review, 2001-APR

A range of rigorous studies has shown that children in lesbian families do at least
as well as children in heterosexual families. Recent studies have identified some
differences in child outcomes, most of which are positive. The outcomes for
children growing up with lesbian parents include:
· no difference in cognitive function;
· no difference in emotional function;
· no difference in psychological and behavioural development;
· gender role behaviour: children tend to play gender-typical games,
however, some male and female children of lesbian parents show less
traditionally gender-ascribed traits;
· no differences in sexuality identity for adult offspring of lesbian and nonlesbian
families, although some adults from lesbian families are more likely
to consider the possibility of not being heterosexual, and are more likely to
report same-sex experience;
· children show more awareness and understanding of diversity more
generally; and
Ruth McNair (2004) Outcomes for Children Born of ART in a Diverse Range of Families (Occasional Paper), Melbourne: Victorian Law Reform Commission

The American Psychological Association, American Psychiatric Association and National Association of Social Workers have stated in an Amicus curiae brief presented to the Supreme Court of the State of California: "The scientific research that has directly compared outcomes for children with gay and lesbian parents with outcomes for children with heterosexual parents has been remarkably consistent in showing that lesbian and gay parents are every bit as fit and capable as heterosexual parents, and their children are as psychologically healthy and well-adjusted as children reared by heterosexual parents. Amici emphasize that the abilities of gay and lesbian persons as parents and the positive outcomes for their children are not areas where credible scientific researchers disagree. Statements by the leading associations of experts in this area reflect professional consensus that children raised by lesbian or gay parents do not differ in any important respects from those raised by heterosexual parents. No credible empirical research suggests otherwise.

The Australian Psychological Society has stated: "The family studies literature indicates that it is family processes (such as the quality of parenting and relationships within the family) that contribute to determining children’s wellbeing and ‘outcomes’, rather than family structures, per se, such as the number, gender, sexuality and co-habitation status of parents. The research indicates that parenting practices and children’s outcomes in families parented by lesbian and gay parents are likely to be at least as favourable as those in families of heterosexual parents, despite the reality that considerable legal discrimination and inequity remain significant challenges for these families."[

"Despite considerable variation in the quality of their samples, research design, measurement methods, and data analysis techniques, the findings to date have been remarkably consistent. Empirical research to date has consistently failed to find linkages between children’s well-being and the sexual orientation of their parents. If gay, lesbian, or bisexual parents were inherently less capable than otherwise comparable heterosexual parents, their children would evidence problems regardless of the type of sample. This pattern clearly has not been observed.
Gregory M. Herek, The American Psychologist

"The vast consensus of all the studies shows that children of same-sex parents do as well as children whose parents are heterosexual in every way," she tells WebMD. "In some ways children of same-sex parents actually may have advantages over other family structures."Researchers looked at information gleaned from 15 studies on more than 500 children, evaluating possible stigma, teasing and social isolation, adjustment and self-esteem, opposite gender role models, sexual orientation, and strengths.

Studies from 1981 to 1994, including 260 children reared by either heterosexual mothers or same-sex mothers after divorce, found no differences in intelligence, type or prevalence of psychiatric disorders, self-esteem, well-being, peer relationships, couple relationships, or parental stress.

"Some studies showed that single heterosexual parents' children have more difficulties than children who have parents of the same sex," Perrin says. "They did better in discipline, self-esteem, and had less psychosocial difficulties at home and at school." from here.

I could post a lot more but don't have time.

If you find conclusions floating around the net to the contrary, they are from known, proven liars like Focus on the Family or the Family Research Council.

i wouldn't mind if you sent me a private message with more info.

 

[ftv1975]

Which was a bit what I was meaning when I asked for the definition of the word purpose. Purpose is a human concept, thereby the purpose of sex is basically what we make it. I am not saying that our bodies came from nothing, I am just saying there is a difference between purpose and, in lack of better way to put it, functional purpose.

yes! i should say funtional purpose this is a more accurate statement.