How did Satan get to the garden of Eden?

[muhammad_isa]

your god said he was jealous of other gods....

I didn't know that you were a "Bible lteralist" ..

As Almighty God is not in need of His creation, the context of 'jealous god' implies that He does not wish us to 'take our eye off the ball'

 

[Thief]

I didn't know that you were a "Bible lteralist" ..

As Almighty God is not in need of His creation, the context of 'jealous god' implies that He does not wish us to 'take our eye off the ball'

Digression...but for now....
God needs His creation.
Otherwise we would not be here.

Jealous?....as in...wanting your attention?....sure.
After all that has been done so far...and you turn your affection elsewhere?

Love God.

 

[muhammad_isa]

Digression...but for now....
God needs His creation.
Otherwise we would not be here.

Need? Almighty God is free of need ! He is not dependant on anything whatsoever!
He is able to create an infinte amount of beings of an infinite type .. what makes you think that He's in need of YOU??

Jealous?....as in...wanting your attention?....sure.
After all that has been done so far...and you turn your affection elsewhere?

Too simplistic .. this is the type of understanding which causes people to reel, when it comes to "God sends you to hell", because He is jealous that you worshipped another god..
Makes God sound like a tyrant .. it's simply falsehood, not truth!

 

[waitasec]

Digression...but for now....
God needs His creation.
Otherwise we would not be here.

Jealous?....as in...wanting your attention?....sure.
After all that has been done so far...and you turn your affection elsewhere?

Love God.

i'd say, god needs his creation otherwise he would not be...

 

[muhammad_isa]

i'd say, god needs his creation otherwise he would not be...

What hypocracy! You profess that you disbelieve! :bunny:

 

[waitasec]

What hypocracy! You profess that you disbelieve! :bunny:

i speak da troof roooth

 

[Thief]

Need? Almighty God is free of need ! He is not dependant on anything whatsoever!
He is able to create an infinte amount of beings of an infinite type .. what makes you think that He's in need of YOU??

Too simplistic .. this is the type of understanding which causes people to reel, when it comes to "God sends you to hell", because He is jealous that you worshipped another god..
Makes God sound like a tyrant .. it's simply falsehood, not truth!

Focus...think real hard....picture an angel....looking you in the eye....

Now...ask that question again.

 

[muhammad_isa]

Focus...think real hard....picture an angel....looking you in the eye....

We're talking about Almighty God being "jealous" ..
Are you effectively saying that God gets jealous, like a man who sees his wife with another man?

..I think we have to look much deeper than that .. people with an agenda of criticism of God & the BIble etc, are very quick to take things literally when it suits them .. they simply don't want to understand

In orthodox Abrahamic religion, taking other gods besides God is an unforgivable sin (ie. without sincere repentance)

Everything we think and do has consequences .. taking 'other gods' as an authority, will take us away from the path of righteousness

 

[waitasec]

We're talking about Almighty God being "jealous" ..
Are you effectively saying that God gets jealous, like a man who sees his wife with another man?

..I think we have to look much deeper than that .. people with an agenda of criticism of God & the BIble etc, are very quick to take things literally when it suits them .. they simply don't want to understand

In orthodox Abrahamic religion, taking other gods besides God is an unforgivable sin (ie. without sincere repentance)

Everything we think and do has consequences .. taking 'other gods' as an authority, will take us away from the path of righteousness

yup...

or could it be mans jealousy of free thought?

 

[outhouse]

We're talking about Almighty God being "jealous" ..

he was written in with all the human emotions.

you know, created in our likeness.


Yahweh went through many changed and evolved into what he is today. You attribute different powers and a different definition then christians, and they define him different then judaism.

 

[muhammad_isa]

he was written in with all the human emotions.
..You attribute different powers and a different definition then christians, and they define him different then judaism.

Not really!
It's a case of dogma, which is the preface to creed. Our understanding can be warped by dogma

Both Judaism and Islam insist that "God is one" ..
Actually Jesus says the same in the NT, but the dogma of orthodox, Roman Christianity insists it's heresy not to believe that Jesus is God

 

[outhouse]

when you calim not really but then start with excuses

its hypocritical


and doesnt refute what I said at all.

islam still defines god differently then judaism

 

[Thief]

We're talking about Almighty God being "jealous" ..
Are you effectively saying that God gets jealous, like a man who sees his wife with another man?

..I think we have to look much deeper than that .. people with an agenda of criticism of God & the BIble etc, are very quick to take things literally when it suits them .. they simply don't want to understand

In orthodox Abrahamic religion, taking other gods besides God is an unforgivable sin (ie. without sincere repentance)

Everything we think and do has consequences .. taking 'other gods' as an authority, will take us away from the path of righteousness

So God is able and willing to be jealous....
as your attention is turned to another?

 

[muhammad_isa]

So God is able and willing to be jealous....
as your attention is turned to another?

I don't understand your point..

why did you highlight taking other gods besides God is an unforgivable sin .. ??

..I explained what "jealous" refers to in this context, imo ..

Anyhow, if you want to understand it in a literal sense, that's ok .. I hope you're fearing the consequences of God's "jealousness" :thud:
However, whatever way you wish to see it, Almighty God is not a tyrant .. we are responsible for our own decisions, including disrespecting God's authority.

 

[Thief]

I don't understand your point..

why did you highlight taking other gods besides God is an unforgivable sin .. ??

..I explained what "jealous" refers to in this context, imo ..

Anyhow, if you want to understand it in a literal sense, that's ok .. I hope you're fearing the consequences of God's "jealousness" :thud:
However, whatever way you wish to see it, Almighty God is not a tyrant .. we are responsible for our own decisions, including disrespecting God's authority.

It seems you write about jealousy, and then rebuttal as if you didn't.

Of course God would be jealous.
Turn your attention to someone else, and consequence follows.

 

[muhammad_isa]

Of course God would be jealous.
Turn your attention to someone else, and consequence follows.

Yes .. but why? Is it because God is petty?
..or is it because we've "fallen by the wayside" ?

 

[sincerly]

Originally Posted by sincerly
Hi Thief, Agreed, GOD didn't place Satan in the Garden; however, neither did "he slither in". The "story" isn't the first three chapters of Genesis, but continues to Revelation 22:21.

Back to topic...
I didn't rebuttal this earlier...now seems good.

As depicted, the serpent having subtle qualities....did slither into the garden.
It's a metaphor.

Thief, Gen.3:1 says that the Serpent was created along with the rest of the "animals" and would be in the garden. The characteristic of being more "subtle" was apparently the reason "Satan" could use and the serpent allowed itself to be used by Satan. (Who had used the same brand of "subtlety in deceiving 1/3 of the heavenly angels.)
I see the serpent already in the Tree enjoying the succulent fruit and juicies dripping from its mouth.
God's "because you have done this" denotes a willingness by the serpent to be used and the reason for the curse by GOD.
Then to Satan in the last part of that condemnation-- is the promised Messiah and the long-suffering of GOD in bringing about Satan's end.

 

[Thief]

Yes .. but why? Is it because God is petty?
..or is it because we've "fallen by the wayside" ?

Jealousy implies an emotional bond.
If God cares about you...that makes Him petty?

That you turn your attention away would have no consequence?

 

[Gjallarhorn]

Jealousy implies an emotional bond.
If God cares about you...that makes Him petty?

That you turn your attention away would have no consequence?

Assuming God is all-loving, one would think jealousy wouldn't override love so easily.

 

[Thief]

Originally Posted by sincerly
Hi Thief, Agreed, GOD didn't place Satan in the Garden; however, neither did "he slither in". The "story" isn't the first three chapters of Genesis, but continues to Revelation 22:21.

Thief, Gen.3:1 says that the Serpent was created along with the rest of the "animals" and would be in the garden. The characteristic of being more "subtle" was apparently the reason "Satan" could use and the serpent allowed itself to be used by Satan. (Who had used the same brand of "subtlety in deceiving 1/3 of the heavenly angels.)
I see the serpent already in the Tree enjoying the succulent fruit and juicies dripping from its mouth.
God's "because you have done this" denotes a willingness by the serpent to be used and the reason for the curse by GOD.
Then to Satan in the last part of that condemnation-- is the promised Messiah and the long-suffering of GOD in bringing about Satan's end.

And your thinking the serpent as an animal possessed by the devil?

The book does not say God created the serpent.
It says the serpent was more subtle then any animal He had made.

Nor does the bible relate partaking of the fruit by the serpent.

It does speak of God's curse and the serpent life afterward.
Did you notice the 'error'?...the serpent would eat dust all the days of it's life?

Of course serpents don't actually do so.
Shall we now sort through the 'errors'?
Or step back from the metaphor for the meaning?