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How does the story of Adam and Eve compatible with science?

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
@YoursTrue Like I was saying...

Apostle John said:
Everything points to there being a Creator.


"In the beginning God created..." Genesis 1:1
I suppose if we don't believe the Bible, we would ask that question.

If we have no text on which we build our faith, anything is possible... except what the text actually says.
There is then reason for the Christian to solidify his faith in God's word, which Jesus himself was fully assured that it was God's word, because not only did he quote it extensively.... In fact he addressed the hypocrites with the words found in it.... exposing their hypocrisy.

If there is no evidence for a creator, then what faith do "Christians" have... other than "blind belief".
Without faith, it is impossible to please God. Hebrews 11:6
Being the "Word of God" does not mean that it is all literally true. In fact the Earth continually tells us that Genesis is mythical. The stories in it never happened. As the "word of God" it still works as a series of morality tales. If one reads it literally the massive evidence in the Earth would make a God a liar since he had to plant false evidence if Genesis is literally true.

Faith is fine, but do not abuse faith. There is no need to use faith to claim that God is a lair, and incompetent and evil to boot.
 

SkepticThinker

Veteran Member
Natural selection is a result - the result of environmental pressure acting on genes, etc. Which then results in a process, they call natural selection.
It is what it is - a process... based on the various existing conditions.
It is not like something that exists, that is being guided by anything to a destination.

That is another thing about your absurd beliefs.
You try to make sense of them, and end up making absurd claims.

Oh. ...and the environment is not intelligent.
Why would the environment need to be intelligent?
 

metis

aged ecumenical anthropologist
"In the beginning God created..." Genesis 1:1
I suppose if we don't believe the Bible, we would ask that question.
The question was meant to be a general inquiry thus not a refuting of scripture.

IOW, it's one thing to "believe" in something without objective evidence, but in the area of science we simply cannot assume our personal religious beliefs are scientifically. If one disagrees with this, then they need to produce objectively derived evidence based on observations and/or testing.

IMO, it makes not one iota of sense to assume the Creation accounts were for teaching actual history as it makes much more objective sense that they were written as myths used for teaching so as to refute the earlier and more widespread polytheistic Babylonian myths.
 
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Jimmy

King Phenomenon
I think all of existence began around 1980 so Adam and Eve is just symbolic of that belief.
 

nPeace

Veteran Member
The question was meant to be a general inquiry thus not a refuting of scripture.
I understand that. Hence my response.

IOW, it's one thing to "believe" in something without objective evidence, but in the area of science we simply cannot assume our personal religious beliefs are scientifically. If one disagrees with this, then they need to produce objectively derived evidence based on observations and/or testing.
There is enough objective evidence for faith, which are both observable and testable.
The thing about most scientific beliefs, which you seem to be promoting, is that we never observe them. Nor can we test them, and most of those beliefs are subjective opinion. Hence why scientists cannot agree on them.

Anytime you have a field of study, that cannot produce direct evidence from an experimental test, it is subject to subjective opinion.
Take for example, Whale Evolution. When did we observe that? What testing gave results that were not influenced by subjective opinion?

I read up on the first so called transitional fossil.
Do you realize how much controversy there was surrounding the scientific beliefs? Archaeopteryx
One scientist even refered to one belief, as Paleobabble. Imagine!

The many hypotheses are such, because they are ideas, which we cannot observe, and which scientist feel inclined to settle for the best explanation... In other words, the best opinion.
That includes the Phylogenetic tree, which is itself a hypothesis... aka an idea.

IMO, it makes not one iota of sense to assume the Creation accounts were for teaching actual history as it makes much more objective sense that they were written as myths used for teaching so as to refute the earlier and more widespread polytheistic Babylonian myths.
No one is assuming.... except perhaps the crowd that makes the assumption that people wrote down history; referred to it as history; corroborated it as history; but really meant it as myth.
That makes absolutely no sense at all.

Those writers were shown to be honest. verified to be, as well.
In fact, the founder of Christianity... the one you say is your lord, did nothing but exalt these ones as being preservers of God's word for later generation.

He never once referred to them as storytellers, and never once did Jesus refer to their record as myth.
It makes sense that if one is a Christian, even if they believed nothing else, they would believe Jesus.
 

It Aint Necessarily So

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Why would the environment need to be intelligent?
I think that comment was in response to the use of the word "directed" in "Natural selection is directed by the environment." Directed appears to have been understood as directed by an intelligence. You know the ruse. Creation implies a creator, design implies a designer, law implies law a giver, and now directed implies a director.
Genesis is not speaking of creation of animals, nor plants
Yes it is.
They might have well said... "Once upon a time, in a far away place...". :laughing:
I like your other version better:
"In the beginning God created..."
There is enough objective evidence for faith
That's a self-contradictory statement. All beliefs are either justified by the rules of interpreting evidence or they are believed by faith if they have not been. It there is enough evidence to justify belief, then no faith is needed to believe.
Those writers were shown to be honest. verified to be, as well.
No Bible writer has been shown to be honest. We don't know that they weren't thieves and liars.
Knowledgable Christians understand evolution within species
Knowledgeable Christians understand that the theory is correct. To use legal language, it's been "proven" beyond reasonable doubt. It is still logically possible that the theory can be falsified if false. That's true of all scientific theories. But all other possibilities than the theory have been ruled out by the evidence for it except a very unlikely one - a deceptive intelligent designer that was found out either because it left an Easter egg behind to be discovered or because it made a mistake in its effort at deceiving man.
you need to know exactly what mammal evolved from the time of mass extinction of the dinosaurs for your belief not to be a belief.
No. It is not necessary to know that, and may not be possible to know. Currently, it is believed to have been an insectivore like a shrew. But the theory doesn't require that the pathways be completely worked out.
zero evidence exists for Darwinian evolution
If that's true for you, that's your fault.
Everything points to there being a Creator.
Nothing does, not since science showed us how the universe could assemble itself and run itself without intelligent oversight. What would a god be needed for? What would its job be?
In fact genetic material that has been found in soft tissue in some fossils completely ridicules Darwinian evolution.
No. The theory is in good shape. Creationism is on life support.
 

Apostle John

“Go ahead, look up Revelation 6”
Nothing does, not since science showed us how the universe could assemble itself and run itself without intelligent oversight. What would a god be needed for? What would its job be?
God is the Creator. Science (man) has never created any planet or life from scratch.

No. The theory is in good shape. Creationism is on life support.
Soft tissue discovered on dinosaur fossils that became extinct 65 million years ago isn’t ridiculous?
 

nPeace

Veteran Member
I like your other version better:
What's the difference?

That's a self-contradictory statement.
How so?

All beliefs are either justified by the rules of interpreting evidence or they are believed by faith if they have not been. It there is enough evidence to justify belief, then no faith is needed to believe.
That's for those who have not up till now grasped what faith is.
They have all sorts of ideas, which are incorrect.

No Bible writer has been shown to be honest. We don't know that they weren't thieves and liars.
Who's we?
 

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
If you go to the original story of Adam and Eve it is pure science.
The Summerians we're the First to tell the story, the Anunaki came to Earth from the planet Nibiru to mine our resources.
They bought a race of slaves with them, an uprising led to the destruction of the slaves.
They needed slaves again so from their body they created Adam and Eve, obviously Genetic engineering.
They grew to like man and even had relations with them as is written in most Religions as Gods mating with Humans.
Eventually they left but apparently keep watch, this led to stories of Gods.
How else did the Summerians map the universe thousands of year's ago with no telescopes.
From what I read and discern, word was passed down about creation from Adam to his children and moreso. Things can get mixed up which is one reason why God commanded Moses to write down His words, also the Israelites kept the scrolls safe.
 

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
God is the Creator. Science (man) has never created any planet or life from scratch.


Soft tissue discovered on dinosaur fossils that became extinct 65 million years ago isn’t ridiculous?
I think that fetuses can be influenced by the actions of their parents, take one obvious, drug and alcohol abuse while pregnant. So no telling but not to change the subject, brain function and natural predilection can also be influenced.
 

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
I think all of existence began around 1980 so Adam and Eve is just symbolic of that belief.
You're funny. But I understand you to an extent. Someone thought about Adam and Eve before you though. Take care.
 

Jimmy

King Phenomenon
You're funny. But I understand you to an extent. Someone thought about Adam and Eve before you though. Take care.
Well I believe the bible appeared around 1980. I do believe God didn't put the truth of life's secrets in writing for very good reasons.
 

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
Well I believe the bible appeared around 1980. I do believe God didn't put the truth of life's secrets in writing for very good reasons.
Again you're cute when it comes to existence. Further, if God put it all in writing by means of His power, or ability to inspire his servants to write it down, it would be larger than all the libraries in the world. Furthermore, life can be fun when you can explore things.
 

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
Well I believe the bible appeared around 1980. I do believe God didn't put the truth of life's secrets in writing for very good reasons.
By the way, what happened in 1980? You keep mentioning that date. Was your thinking cap put on?
 

1213

Well-Known Member
Yes it is.
Sorry, I meant Genesis 2 is not speaking of creating plants and animals, because it just tells how God planted the Garden, which doesn't mean there could not have been other plants and it speaks of forming animals, which doesn't mean there could not have been animals already. Bible doesn't use the word create in Genesis 2 for animals and plants.
 

It Aint Necessarily So

Veteran Member
Premium Member
God is the Creator. Science (man) has never created any planet or life from scratch.
The world doesn't need any other creator. It creates planets without the help of gods or men.
Soft tissue discovered on dinosaur fossils that became extinct 65 million years ago isn’t ridiculous?
It's another triumph for man in his quest for scientific knowledge. What's ridiculous is ridiculing such discoveries because they challenge contradictory beliefs believed by faith. That's the problem with that method. It's guessing, and most guesses are incorrect, so when you guess wrongly and science shows you that, you need to find a way to try to marginalize the evidence as you just did.
I just explained. If your belief is sufficiently justified by evidence, then it is not a faith-based belief. If your belief isn't sufficiently justified by evidence, it is believed by faith. All belief is one or the other, and none are both. Belief by faith after examining evidence that doesn't justify the faith-based belief is the same as belief by faith without looking at anything at all.
That's for those who have not up till now grasped what faith is. They have all sorts of ideas, which are incorrect.
I'm quite familiar with people not grasping what (religious-type) faith is, especially from those who engage in it. It's really a very simple concept - just pick an idea that you would like to be true and just believe that it is.
Who's we?
You and me and everybody else.
 

SkepticThinker

Veteran Member
I think that comment was in response to the use of the word "directed" in "Natural selection is directed by the environment." Directed appears to have been understood as directed by an intelligence. You know the ruse. Creation implies a creator, design implies a designer, law implies law a giver, and now directed implies a director.
Which is exactly what I was thinking and driving at. I guess I shouldn't have expected an actual response to the question. ;)

My mind went right to the Stephen King's It, where the unintelligent universe-vomiting turtle (tortoise?) creates universes accidentally every time he vomits and then ends up choking on a universe and dying, all the while not being able to interact in those universes or have any awareness of what's going on. There's no reason any intelligence would be required. But I guess if that's your starting place, you have to make it work somehow.
Yes it is.

I like your other version better:


That's a self-contradictory statement. All beliefs are either justified by the rules of interpreting evidence or they are believed by faith if they have not been. It there is enough evidence to justify belief, then no faith is needed to believe.

No Bible writer has been shown to be honest. We don't know that they weren't thieves and liars.

Knowledgeable Christians understand that the theory is correct. To use legal language, it's been "proven" beyond reasonable doubt. It is still logically possible that the theory can be falsified if false. That's true of all scientific theories. But all other possibilities than the theory have been ruled out by the evidence for it except a very unlikely one - a deceptive intelligent designer that was found out either because it left an Easter egg behind to be discovered or because it made a mistake in its effort at deceiving man.

No. It is not necessary to know that, and may not be possible to know. Currently, it is believed to have been an insectivore like a shrew. But the theory doesn't require that the pathways be completely worked out.

If that's true for you, that's your fault.

Nothing does, not since science showed us how the universe could assemble itself and run itself without intelligent oversight. What would a god be needed for? What would its job be?

No. The theory is in good shape. Creationism is on life support.
 
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