How long did it take for intelligence to exist in the universe?

[idav]

Again we would need to define intelligence better here.

Chemical reactions to stimuli and simple behaviors like plants and insects and then self awareness, abstract though, communication, reasoning, emotions, planning, reasoning, learning, and problem solving, in animals with a more developed higher nervous system.

When putting the criteria that high of course you end up trying to compare intelligence to that of a human. However, I believe that right as life begins that signs of intelligence are already emerging if only for the very fact that organisms are beginning to have their own wills.

 

[shawn001]

When putting the criteria that high of course you end up trying to compare intelligence to that of a human. However, I believe that right as life begins that signs of intelligence are already emerging if only for the very fact that organisms are beginning to have their own wills.

That is why we have to define it better here.

One cell or bacteria or even plants are not "intelligent" unless your using an extremely liberal interpretation of Intelligence, because they lack a more advanced nervous system and a way to process information. They react to certain aspects of their enviroment and stimuli chemically.

Part of early nerous system in evolution was the autonomic nervous system and the fight or flight responce.

This is from 2005

Intelligent bacteria?

Intelligent bacteria?

Insects like Ants and Bee's use chemical and electrial methods to communicate and the whole colony can work together with complex behaviors, but the intelligence say of a single ant is well, you know.

 

[idav]

This is from 2005

Intelligent bacteria?

Intelligent bacteria?

Insects like Ants and Bee's use chemical and electrial methods to communicate and the whole colony can work together with complex behaviors, but the intelligence say of a single ant is well, you know.

Everything can be broken down further to just reactions to stimuli. When we take a step back we see an intelligent organism. While one singe neuron is intelligent with it's trillions of connections, it does take a network. Same as a bee and the hive, stepping back you see an intelligent colony with much more efficiency and strength.

 

[shawn001]

Lets go back to the origanl question

"How long did it take for intelligence to exist in the universe?"

We don't know because there could have been other life forms that evolved, before us.

In regards to earth, if all "life" shows "intelligence" then would you say cynobacteria that created the oxygen atmosphere we have today, 3.8 billion years ago was intelligent?

 

[idav]

Lets go back to the origanl question

"How long did it take for intelligence to exist in the universe?"

We don't know because there could have been other life forms that evolved, before us.

In regards to earth, if all "life" shows "intelligence" then would you say cynobacteria that created the oxygen atmosphere we have today, 3.8 billion years ago was intelligent?

When a system emerges it is a sign of intelligence. It is the point that the system becomes purpose driven and with life that purpose is replicating and building to larger more complex functions. At what point do organisms really have their own will?

 

[PolyHedral]

When a system emerges it is a sign of intelligence. It is the point that the system becomes purpose driven and with life that purpose is replicating and building to larger more complex functions. At what point do organisms really have their own will?

When they start computing stored data, not just reacting to stimuli.

 

[idav]

When they start computing stored data, not just reacting to stimuli.

All cells with DNA do this.

 

[PolyHedral]

All cells with DNA do this.

DNA is seemingly read-only.

edit: oops.

 

[idav]

DNA is seemingly read-only.

edit: oops.

Most cells I know of can also store data. Even if at rudimentary levels.

 

[shawn001]

When a system emerges it is a sign of intelligence. It is the point that the system becomes purpose driven and with life that purpose is replicating and building to larger more complex functions. At what point do organisms really have their own will?

"When a system emerges it is a sign of intelligence"

Please explain the above?

"At what point do organisms really have their own will"

"really have their own will"

I think you might mean conciousness here, but maybe not.

Again, this leads us back to when they evolve and develop a nervous system.

 

[PolyHedral]

Most cells I know of can also store data. Even if at rudimentary levels.

What data is there for a cell to store?

 

[idav]

"When a system emerges it is a sign of intelligence"

Please explain the above?

It isn't us that is intelligent but the collection of our cells that are intelligent. If your to say that a cell is not intelligent then we aren't intelligent either. So to say that a neuron is no more intelligent than a cell located on my finger. They just have different jobs, don't discriminate, lol. When we see the system we see intelligence emerging like a colony of ants as another example that has been brought up.

"At what point do organisms really have their own will"

"really have their own will"

I think you might mean conciousness here, but maybe not.

Again, this leads us back to when they evolve and develop a nervous system.

I don't really mean consciousness but it may be related. At some point an organism acts rather than reacts and perhaps is able to think about what is being done. I'm attempting to illustrate that the basic functionality of our body isn't all that intelligent without the collective. Lifeforms are machines doing what they were born to do but intelligence is just a complex version of the machine like functions already possible in every cell.

What data is there for a cell to store?

Learning is always a good thing for an organism to be able to do. Read and write.

 

[PolyHedral]

It isn't us that is intelligent but the collection of our cells that are intelligent.

This doesn't sound coherent. What's "us", if not our collective cells?

Learning is always a good thing for an organism to be able to do. Read and write.

I wasn't aware single-celled organisms could learn except by natural selection.

 

[shawn001]

It isn't us that is intelligent but the collection of our cells that are intelligent. If your to say that a cell is not intelligent then we aren't intelligent either. So to say that a neuron is no more intelligent than a cell located on my finger. They just have different jobs, don't discriminate, lol. When we see the system we see intelligence emerging like a colony of ants as another example that has been brought up.

Our system evolved over a very long time. Read the transcript here and some other interesting things on that site.

NOVA | What Is Intelligence?


But you said

"When a system emerges it is a sign of intelligence"

So that system didn't just emerge.



I don't really mean consciousness but it may be related. At some point an organism acts rather than reacts and perhaps is able to think about what is being done. I'm attempting to illustrate that the basic functionality of our body isn't all that intelligent without the collective. Lifeforms are machines doing what they were born to do but intelligence is just a complex version of the machine like functions already possible in every cell.

It is very related.

"At some point an organism acts rather than reacts and perhaps is able to think about what is being done.'

Then you need a nervous system and conciousness.

NOVA | The Electric Brain

Learning is always a good thing for an organism to be able to do. Read and write.

Communication is very important. Then you start getting into cultural evolution.

Where do single cells store information?

If I take one neuron out of the system, can it think like the brain?


"like a colony of ants as another example that has been brought up."

Insects have a simple central nervous system.

The Nervous System

 

[idav]

This doesn't sound coherent. What's "us", if not our collective cells?

We lose enough brain cells and the collective will not amount to as much as with a healthy brain.

I wasn't aware single-celled organisms could learn except by natural selection.

We know that natural selection isn't the only reason for life evolving.

 

[idav]

Communication is very important. Then you start getting into cultural evolution.

Where do single cells store information?

If I take one neuron out of the system, can it think like the brain?

As the example above to poly. Kill enough brain cells and you know what can happen.

"like a colony of ants as another example that has been brought up."

Insects have a simple central nervous system.

The Nervous System

Yes but what I'm getting at is that a colony of ants is more intelligent and stronger than one single ant.

 

[PolyHedral]

We lose enough brain cells and the collective will not amount to as much as with a healthy brain.

Well, yeah. I never said anything about "us" being coherent. If you disassemble "us" of course it won't behave like "us" anymore.

We know that natural selection isn't the only reason for life evolving.

Since when?

 

[idav]

Well, yeah. I never said anything about "us" being coherent. If you disassemble "us" of course it won't behave like "us" anymore.


Since when?

It doesn't take much for us to lose what we would call intelligence. I think intelligence is much more than passing human standardized tests. In the natural world intelligence is what keeps organisms alive, or not. More than just simple reaction to stimuli.

 

[garrydons]

I think that intelligence is 'pre-universe' and that essentially all things are 'made of' intelligence.

Then who possess that intelligence?

 

[fishy]

I tend to suspect, on a very regular basis, that Chief Engineer Scotty's skills are in constant demand.