How shall we correct this injustice?

[BrightShadow]

What strategies would you suggest to encourage rapists to turn to self reflection and stop raping?

Read what I wrote on page #4 post# 62 (if you genuinely want to know).

You could discourage any potential rapist by simply increasing the punishment for the crime.

Very little chance for other things to work - if the punishment is not severe.

Self reflection?... Very little you can do there in our current society!

So, the first thing is - to increase the punishment.

Once the threat of a huge retaliatory consequence for their crime (by the justice system) is hanging in front of their faces - you could make other headways with them. With a genuine threat of punishment - they won't commit the crime in the first place.

In other words - you could try and get through to the rapists but the threat of a huge consequence must be on the table - first and foremost.

The way our society is structured these days - such criminals are let out of jail too quickly. That sets a bad example for the future ones.
If you commit a heinous crime - you must do a significant amount of time!
Hope that answers your question.

 

[IamYourYahaweh]

This is actually an ETHICAL issue rather than political, since absolutely every political party has never addressed it. However, since no ethical forum exists, politics seems to be the best place for the thread.

Last summer, my son asked me an odd question. He said, "If you were lost out in the woods, would you be more scared if a bear approached you, or a man?? Without hesitation, I said, "A man." He couldn't wrap his head around that. I tried to explain to him that a bear wasn't going to bother me unless I bothered it, if I scared it in some way, or it was worried about cubs. But a man, out in the middle of nowhere, with no one else to witness, could do ANYTHING. Yeah, I'd be terrified.

The topic is sexual violence against women. This is not to suggest that men aren't victims of sexual violence. When a man is raped, it is just as horrifying and scarring as for a woman. However, sexual violence against men is much, much more rare. So, with all sympathy towards male victims, I'm going to plunge ahead with the topic. I'm also going to stick to US statistics, mostly from the RAINN website (Rape, Abuse & Incest National Network) but as we all know, sexual violence against women is a problem worldwide.

One out of every four women in the US is a victim of sexual violence. However, only about a third (310 out of every 1,000) of these women report it to the police. This meshes with my personal experience. I'm the sort in real life that others sense will be understanding and keep confidences, so I hear all sorts of private things from people, and of the many women who have told me they were raped, NONE went to the police.

Unlike the manosphere fear that women commonly accuse innocent men of rape, the truth is that genuine victims usually say nothing at all. The reasons are many.

• Shock. It's just easier to deny that something so horrible has happened. Going to the police makes it real.
• Shame. Even today in 2024, women are commonly blamed for their own rapes, everything from "Were you drinking" to "How were you dressed."
• Fear of retaliation. Self explanatory.
• Privacy. Women have a modesty that is just not as common among men. Most of us don't even feel comfortable undressing in front of other women in locker rooms. Sexual violence is something deeply personal, and many women just don't want to talk about it.
• Lying: No one suspects a mugging victim of making it up. No one suspects a home burglary victim of making it up. No one suspects a victim of a financial scam of making it up. But no sooner do you say rape, then the first thing that goes through the minds of most men is, "Is she making it up?"
• Concern for the perpetrator: Amazingly, 7% of all sexual assault victims say the reason they didn't go to the police was because they didn't want to get the perp (likely a friend or family member) into trouble.
• Danger: There are literally victims of rape in this country who are currently in jail for "filing a false police report." They first get bullied by overly zealous detectives to withdrawing their complaint, and then are arrested and prosecuted.
• Being raped a second time: If it goes to court, the victim has to endure the vicious attacks of defense attorneys, who will do all they can to drag her through the mud.
• Lack of faith in the system: The truth is, almost no perpetrators of sexual violence ever go to jail. They rape without consequence. Most victims think, "What good does it do to go to the police?" It is this last element that I want to do a deep dive on.

Let's look at some of the statistics. As I already mentioned, not even a third of all sexual assaults are reported to the police. As reported by RAINN: Out of every 1000 sexual assaults, 975 perpetrators will walk free. Only 50 reports will lead to an arrest. Only 28 will lead to a felony conviction. Only 25 will be incarcerated. Out of 1000.

This means that only 2.5% of women who are sexually assaulted will see their victimizer go to jail. And in case you think this website is too generous towards women, please know that I have chosen one that is more conservative. I've seen statistics as low as 0.15%.

The long and short of it is this: men continue to rape women with impunity. I'm not saying that most men are rapists. They're not. (And those many men who do treat women with respect, you have my undying love!) But for those who do harm women, they do a LOT of damage, and they do it without consequence.


So.... Let's get down to the brass tacks. WHAT CAN BE DONE TO CHANGE THIS? How can our laws be changed? How can police policies be changed? How can our justice department be changed?

Id shift it to why do we need to change this? And why do people act like their issues are felt by the world and agreed by the world

 

[BrightShadow]

He should stop sexually assaulting people then.

Once again - sorry to hear what you went through in your early days.
You do know that - if you were a juror in a rape or sexual assaults case -you would have been excused by the Judge.
Defense lawyer for the accused could also ask you to be dismissed because you won't be impartial.
So, for the same reason - it is fruitless talking to you on this regard.
You will always believe Trump raped her.

A 52 year old lady (E Jean Carrol) who was a journalist at the time - should never wait until she is 75 years old to report her rape incident.
That is not fair for the defender (Trump).

If someone is falsely accused - how can he defend himself after 26 years?
That is simply unacceptable.

 

[F1fan]

Yes! A 52 years old Journalist afraid to confront the world and do the right thing?

She did the right thing by exposing Trump for sexual assault, an suing him for defamation. Twice, and winning both times.

She doesn't feel a need to save other women.

Who are you to tell what she neds to feel? This illustrates the abuse and disrespect of many men in the USA.

Change comes from within first.
Before you start fixing others, fix yourself.

Is your message to men who lack maturity and commit rape, or are you schooling victims of sexual assault?

You are blindly supporting a 52 old lady who reported the incident when she was 75 years old.

My support is lucid and deliberate. I support all victims of sexual assault. It isn't their problem, it is a problem of men who commit these acts against women.

If anyone is blind it is your devotion to a disturbed man with a history of sexual assault. Trump has had 26 accusers come forward, and a 27th a few weeks before the election. He has been recorded bragging about doing this to women. He's not fit for any government job.

Something wrong with the culture all right! I see it.

You just don't see it reflected in your views. THAT is why we have a culture problem.

The culture is saying - you should keep your fights to be fought when you are 75 years old. Many more fools will believe an older lady of 75 than a 52 year old lady.

I have no idea what you are talking about here. But sexual assault remains sexual assult forever. And despite your mixed words Trump is guilty of sexual assault, and he has named a fellow accused of sexual assault to lead the DOD, an organization that has had problems with sexual assault itself. The ignorance of the criminal president elect is rampant. How so many lacking character voted for him is beyond my understanding.

Look at your recent posts, all trying to defend Trump and blaming E Jean Carroll. THAT is the culture problem the USA faces, Trump and his followers. They all suffer from a sickness, and lack the basic morals that the rest of us find normal.

 

[Koldo]

Due to the fact that the Dems weaponized the justice system and the fact that - New York City is filled with Koldos and crazy Dems who hate Trump - I am sure Trump did not receive a fair trial.

Sure on what grounds? None. Absolutely none.
The rest of your post is not even worth responding.
Suffices to say I am quite satisfied that you will have to face the consequences of your choices. It is going to be delightful.

 

[crossfire]

Read what I wrote on page #4 post# 62 (if you genuinely want to know).

You could discourage any potential rapist by simply increasing the punishment for the crime.

Very little chance for other things to work - if the punishment is not severe.

Self reflection?... Very little you can do there in our current society!

So, the first thing is - to increase the punishment.

Once the threat of a huge retaliatory consequence for their crime (by the justice system) is hanging in front of their faces - you could make other headways with them. With a genuine threat of punishment - they won't commit the crime in the first place.

In other words - you could try and get through to the rapists but the threat of a huge consequence must be on the table - first and foremost.

The way our society is structured these days - such criminals are let out of jail too quickly. That sets a bad example for the future ones.
If you commit a heinous crime - you must do a significant amount of time!
Hope that answers your question.

That would require the police and prosecutors to actually show some interest in prosecuting rapists, as well as judges and prosecutors refraining from blaming the victim and sending the victims off for psychological brainwashing into making them believe it never happened.

I'm not going to hold my breath on that one.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

We need to live in a Big Brother's studio.
With thousands of surveillance cameras. That assure us safety against criminals.

It's called China. No thanks.

 

[Revoltingest]

That would require the police and prosecutors to actually show some interest in prosecuting rapists, as well as judges and prosecutors refraining from blaming the victim and sending the victims off for psychological brainwashing into making them believe it never happened.

I'm not going to hold my breath on that one.

Conviction faces a high hurdle when the act is
typically done in the dark, away from prying eyes.
Obama tried to cope by replacing presumption of
innocence with presumption of guilt....for men at
universities. It appears he values conviction over
Blackstone's ratio & constitutional rights.
Some "constitutional scholar" he turned out to be, eh.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

Id shift it to why do we need to change this?

Really? You see no need to change the fact that men rape women without consequence? Well, at least we now know who and what you are.

 

[Samael_Khan]

Are you seriously calling Trump a rapist?
I am not here to educate you. Not sure anyone can.
But I can tell you - you got all your facts wrong. You know nothing about our justice system in USA.

Which country are you from? We need to stop coming in your aid.

Google the following question: "Is Trump a convicted rapist?"

You will be shocked at what you will learn.

Trump was NEVER convicted of rape.
E Jean Carroll's lawsuit was a civil trial. All about the money!
Trump was never criminally charged. Trump was found, by a jury, liable for battery (on civil grounds) and defamation.
On Civil grounds only! There is no criminal consequences to finding of 'liability' in a civil court.
So stop calling him a rapist like an ignorant person.

It is annoying to respond to gullible folks who hang their common sense and decency in their basement closet and then come here and respond just to score some points with other biased and gullible folks.

You likeminded folks need a reality check.

If E Jean Carroll put up a good performance at the court (and doubt she did) then I would agree she was indeed raped by someone in her early days BUT it is extremely unlikely that she was raped by Trump. Trump was 49 years old at the time and a multi millionaire who was a renowned figure. He was conducting and hosting models and beauty pageant competitions around the globe. E Jean was a 52 year old Journalist at the time of incident.
If a 52 years old Journalist doesn't know how to handle such situation after being attacked then it is indeed a worrisome culture we live in. Lucky for us - I am certain - she faked it.

Let me ask you a question:
Assuming you are a man - have you EVER gone in the dressing room (changing section) with a woman you hardly knew - in any luxurious department store? Have you ever been to Bergdorf Goodman?
Google the store and check out how luxurious this store is. Check out their designer merchandise. Most folks can't afford it.


Prada, Jimmy Choo, Gucci, Lanvin, Dolce & Gabbana - Bergdorf Goodman


Let me rephrase my question - have you ever gone in the dressing room (changing section) with any woman you hardly knew? Dressing rooms and especially the section you try out different clothes - is not made for two people to go in together. Period!

Teenagers might do it for the purpose of fooling around.

So, why did she go in the dressing-room with him? She hardly knew him. Did he drag her in there? Trump didn't even remember ever knowing her - otherwise he would have claimed consensual from the get-go.

I am not going to continue educating you. This could be my last post to you.
Say what you want. You are just looking to score some points with your likeminded biased folks. You are not even genuine.

Dude, you clearly show ignorance on how victims react to being raped, so how can you educate me on anything?

Say what you want. You care more about deflecting blame from Trump than rape victims. You are like the church who relocate the priests. And you are genuine in that.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

Are you seriously calling Trump a rapist?

A court of law determined that he did indeed shove his fingers into a woman's vagina against her will. In the state of California, rape is any non-consensual penetration by any body part or object, so by California understanding, yes, a court has found that he committed rape.

And then you have 26 women who have all claimed he sexually assaulted them. 26. TWENTY SIX. It would be absolutely absurd to accept the word of one person who says, "No I didn't" when 26 are saying "Yes you did." If 26 witnesses are not enough, then how many DO you require?

 

[metis]

A court of law determined that he did indeed shove his fingers into a woman's vagina against her will. In the state of California, rape is any non-consensual penetration by any body part or object, so by California understanding, yes, a court has found that he committed rape.

And then you have 26 women who have all claimed he sexually assaulted them. 26. TWENTY SIX. It would be absolutely absurd to accept the word of one person who says, "No I didn't" when 26 are saying "Yes you did." If 26 witnesses are not enough, then how many DO you require?

He even bragged about it on the Access Hollywood recording, and yet millions of Americans didn't care enough about these victims to make certain an arrogant maniac like him didn't end up leading our country. Now we are likely to have hell to pay for such depravity.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

He even bragged about it on the Access Hollywood recording, and yet millions of Americans didn't care enough about these victims to make certain an arrogant maniac like him didn't end up leading our country. Now we are likely to have hell to pay for such depravity.

I think the difference between me and MAGA sorts, is that I think he means the things he says. They don't. If I remember correctly, they wrote off that remark as just locker room bragging.

 

[BrightShadow]

@IndigoChild5559 @F1fan @Koldo @Samael_Khan


Every case is different.

Scenario #1:
A 13 year old farm girl raped by her powerful drunk stepfather - who is friends with the local Sheriff.

Scenario #2:
A 52 years old Journalist pulled the rape card - who was self reliant in every aspect in her life at the time of occurrence and wealthy enough to afford to go and shop at the Bergdorf's. And what is the job of a Journalist? Report things. Right? But she doesn't report in for 26 years.


In scenario #1 - Even if the young girl waits multiple years before opening her mouth - I would still tend to believe her. I will think - may be she was too young to realize what happened to her and didn't see that it was an extremely wrong thing. Maybe she was afraid her mother won't believe her. Maybe she thought if she makes noise then she and her mother won't have a place to live anymore. Etc.

None of that applies to a 52 years old Journalist!

A 52 years old Journalist went to shop at an expensive store where they sell designer clothing, designer shoes and designers purses worth thousands of dollars. She meets a multi millionaire there. She decides to go into the dressing-room with him. Something happened in there. She comes out but doesn't feel a need to call the security - instead she continues shopping around with the millionaire. Maybe she decided to get a $3,999 dress because the dress she was wearing got a stain on it. Maybe the millionaire offered to pay for the new dress. Maybe she declined thinking that would turn off the millionaire. Her eyes was really on the $7.999 dress but that was over her 4K limit. Later she tries to reach out to the millionaire but the millionaire just got into a serious relationship with someone else and ignores her calls. With her missed opportunity to hook up with a great catch - she started to grow some resentments - and then years later she decides to write a book. You know the title of that book!

You cannot just paint both the scenarios #1 and #2 with the same brush. You just can't!

To give the same courtesy to a 52 year old journalist as you would give to a 13 year old - is simply foolish.
A 52 years old doesn't deserve it.

Anyone naive enough to believe a 52 years old Journalist (who waits 26 years until she is 75 years or so old) - should have their head examined. They should realize that the Justice System needs to be balanced towards the accused individual as well. Otherwise you would open up a Pandora's box and some women will abuse the system and take down innocent men.

How can a man defend himself against false allegation after 26 years?

Like I said - what happened in NYC - would open up a Pandora's box. Wealthy people will be targeted there with this new "Adult Survivors Act". This law contradicts with the state's constitution. The State's constitution has a 'statutes of limitations' for certain crimes - for a reason. Don't ignore those reasons.

Or else you will have a Kangaroo court - a court that would will always take side with the women against any men on a rape case.

A court of law determined that he did indeed shove his fingers into a woman's vagina against her will. In the state of California, rape is any non-consensual penetration by any body part or object, so by California understanding, yes, a court has found that he committed rape.

Read my post #159 on page 8.

A court of law determined that he did indeed shove his fingers into a woman's vagina

In a Civil court - all you have to do is show probabilities that it probably took place.
51% to 49%
Probably happened does not mean it happened. It means it most likely happened because the defender couldn't prove it didn't happen.
That is insane!

The only way Trump could have defended that it didn't happen - he would have to show he was gay or he was OCD and thus he would never do something like that. He would have to bring everyone he ever married or dated to support that claim that he never puts his finger in there.
How crazy is that? How else he can show he didn't put his finger in there?

he did indeed shove his fingers into a woman's vagina against her will.

How do you defend against that after 26 years? If you have had a one-night stand and didn't like the experience and then the girl tries to reach out to you like a stalker and you avoid her then - out of frustration she could rationalize her experience as a bad one.
This is simply a defense mechanism. Every human has that. Months after a car accident - most people fight it in court that they were innocent.

 

[BrightShadow]

A court of law determined that he did indeed shove his fingers into a woman's vagina against her will. In the state of California, rape is any non-consensual penetration by any body part or object, so by California understanding, yes, a court has found that he committed rape.

And then you have 26 women who have all claimed he sexually assaulted them. 26. TWENTY SIX. It would be absolutely absurd to accept the word of one person who says, "No I didn't" when 26 are saying "Yes you did." If 26 witnesses are not enough, then how many DO you require?

Forgot to make another point regarding CALIFORNIA

California is a land of the nuts and bolts (I mean nuts on the top and and faults underground).
Get it? No?

California has CSZ.
It is nuts that they don't worry about the 9.0
I am going to leave it at that.

Last I checked - they are still counting the vote. They sent absentee ballots to everyone. Not sure if they checked qualifications to receive them. Many non citizens can have a driver's license.

The incident Trump was accused of - occurred in NYC. Why should we worry about California standards?
California and NY are trying to be counter-productive for the country. It is a shame!

 

[BrightShadow]

@IndigoChild5559 @F1fan @Koldo @Samael_Khan

Like I said...
Every case is different. Don't paint every case of rape with the same brush.
People who believe every single allegations brought forth by simply any woman of any age - are modern days Witch-hunters.
The new witch in this case - is any innocent man who are accused of rape.

To give a fair chance for the wrongly accused man - a rape should be reported by an adult female in a timely manner.
Juveniles (under 18) should be allowed more time. I would go as high as 21 years old women to get special considerations and equally extra time to report.

However, a 52 years old lady should not have the same privileges as she has a responsivity to set an example for the rest of women and thus she should report the crime immediately.
After all - this particular lady was a Journalist.

It is mind blowing that you guys don't see the difference.

And the Witch hunt continues...
Falsely accused men don't stand a chance against the witch hunters.

 

[F1fan]

@IndigoChild5559 @F1fan @Koldo @Samael_Khan


Every case is different.

Scenario #1:
A 13 year old farm girl raped by her powerful drunk stepfather - who is friends with the local Sheriff.

Scenario #2:
A 52 years old Journalist pulled the rape card - who was self reliant in every aspect in her life at the time of occurrence and wealthy enough to afford to go and shop at the Bergdorf's. And what is the job of a Journalist? Report things. Right? But she doesn't report in for 26 years.


In scenario #1 - Even if the young girl waits multiple years before opening her mouth - I would still tend to believe her. I will think - may be she was too young to realize what happened to her and didn't see that it was an extremely wrong thing. Maybe she was afraid her mother won't believe her. Maybe she thought if she makes noise then she and her mother won't have a place to live anymore. Etc.

None of that applies to a 52 years old Journalist!

A 52 years old Journalist went to shop at an expensive store where they sell designer clothing, designer shoes and designers purses worth thousands of dollars. She meets a multi millionaire there. She decides to go into the dressing-room with him. Something happened in there. She comes out but doesn't feel a need to call the security - instead she continues shopping around with the millionaire. Maybe she decided to get a $3,999 dress because the dress she was wearing got a stain on it. Maybe the millionaire offered to pay for the new dress. Maybe she declined thinking that would turn off the millionaire. Her eyes was really on the $7.999 dress but that was over her 4K limit. Later she tries to reach out to the millionaire but the millionaire just got into a serious relationship with someone else and ignores her calls. With her missed opportunity to hook up with a great catch - she started to grow some resentments - and then years later she decides to write a book. You know the title of that book!

You cannot just paint both the scenarios #1 and #2 with the same brush. You just can't!

To give the same courtesy to a 52 year old journalist as you would give to a 13 year old - is simply foolish.
A 52 years old doesn't deserve it.

Anyone naive enough to believe a 52 years old Journalist (who waits 26 years until she is 75 years or so old) - should have their head examined. They should realize that the Justice System needs to be balanced towards the accused individual as well. Otherwise you would open up a Pandora's box and some women will abuse the system and take down innocent men.

How can a man defend himself against false allegation after 26 years?

Like I said - what happened in NYC - would open up a Pandora's box. Wealthy people will be targeted there with this new "Adult Survivors Act". This law contradicts with the state's constitution. The State's constitution has a 'statutes of limitations' for certain crimes - for a reason. Don't ignore those reasons.

Or else you will have a Kangaroo court - a court that would will always take side with the women against any men on a rape case.





Read my post #159 on page 8.



In a Civil court - all you have to do is show probabilities that it probably took place.
51% to 49%
Probably happened does not mean it happened. It means it most likely happened because the defender couldn't prove it didn't happen.
That is insane!

The only way Trump could have defended that it didn't happen - he would have to show he was gay or he was OCD and thus he would never do something like that. He would have to bring everyone he ever married or dated to support that claim that he never puts his finger in there.
How crazy is that? How else he can show he didn't put his finger in there?



How do you defend against that after 26 years? If you have had a one-night stand and didn't like the experience and then the girl tries to reach out to you like a stalker and you avoid her then - out of frustration she could rationalize her experience as a bad one.
This is simply a defense mechanism. Every human has that. Months after a car accident - most people fight it in court that they were innocent.

What do you expect us to do, believe a wealthy guy with a history of lying, and with 27 sexual assault claims against him, and audio of him bragging about sexual assaulting women? Sorry, the circumstantial evidence goes against him, and her testimony has other witnesses backing it up.

It's already been explained to you that it is common for rape victims to not report the crime. Her behavior after the assault is common among those traumatized by assault. It's common that they are shamed and not believed. Trump was a public figure with resources, she wasn't.

My advice to you is drop the horrible exercise of defending Trump. It's too late. Trump lost, twice. You're losing this exercise. It only makes you look more foolish and more of a cult member who can't think for himself.

 

[F1fan]

A court of law determined that he did indeed shove his fingers into a woman's vagina against her will. In the state of California, rape is any non-consensual penetration by any body part or object, so by California understanding, yes, a court has found that he committed rape.

Exactly. Trump's character is in the toilet. He has none. Carroll's character is very high.

And then you have 26 women who have all claimed he sexually assaulted them. 26. TWENTY SIX. It would be absolutely absurd to accept the word of one person who says, "No I didn't" when 26 are saying "Yes you did." If 26 witnesses are not enough, then how many DO you require?

And a 27th came out about two weeks before the election. It didn't get much press. There was a lot else going on, and plus if 26 didn't mean anything to Trump cultists, another one is just as irrelevant. There could be 100 women that were victimized by Trump and it would mean nothing to those who don't respect women, but admire Trump. To MAGAs women are second class citizens.

 

[BrightShadow]

Carroll's character is very high.

Watch your favorite individual (E Jean Carroll). She painted her trees and rocks around her house blue.

https://www.tiktok.com/video/7325242097521429803
She named her dog "tits" and cat "Vagina".

She claimed she dated 16 people at the same time because that's what the New Yorkers do.

Sound about right! Shows what you support.


Btw, I am not defending Trump only - I am defending all men against false allegations. Allegations they cannot disprove after 26 years.
Give them a fair trial. Report incidents in a timely manner.

Stop the Witch hunt.

 

[BrightShadow]

Carroll's character is very high.

Found the whole clip
Watch it.