How to convert a Hindu

[Maya3]

Here we go again with the "real Hindus" nonsense. You further reduced your credibility. And after just 5 posts! Amazing! (well, not really).

Yup, here it comes. And again with the assumption that we have all been Christian before.

Maya

 

[Vinayaka]

I respectfully concur that this thread would be better placed in a broader forum. The issue is wider than one particular faith.

I disagree. As the starter of this thread, I put it here for a purpose. The topic is a Hindu problem. Yes, I know conversion from this to that and everything else is a world problem, but there are already threads existing on that. If the mods choose to move it, so be it, but I would predict that that's when the mudslinging would truly begin.

As far as this 'real' business goes, are we really as ethnocentric as that? There are staunchly orthodox traditionalists in all sects, as well as others leaning towards a more 'universalist' view in all sects. Each calling the other 'not real' is of little use to anyone, other than maybe an emotional venting. Everyone does have a line in the mind, but that's just opinion, and when opinions get into a discussion, rarely is there a consensus.

 

[Secret Chief]

Fair enough.

 

[Sumit]

Give me something better.

i would appreciate if anyone who have been to india could acknowledge this.

These census do not count 6 crore illegal immigrants and those poor hindus who converted (because most of them still writes their religious title as hindu to enjoy sc/st reservation in government jobs.

 

[Sumit]

first of all, this thread needs to me moved out of the hindu DIR

I think it's evident from the words of "real hindus" who have contributed to this thread that christ has no place in hindu territory
isn't the message getting across?

pseudo-hindus are those who want to try to re-write hinduism to incorporate christ into it.
it's as simple as that.

why re-write hinduism?

I don't think any Hindu here advocated this.

hindus don't need this "christian goodness" to be forced upon them. And it is forced.

go praise your lord somewhere else.
lets keep hinduism pure.

All this thread is about how to solve/discuss problem of conversion but your statement goes in different direction.

you are 100% sure that the indian leadership isn't intentionally keeping the hindu masses poor, I'm not taking your word for it.

It's true that Indian Gov intentionnaly keeps hindu masses poor. But it's we (Hindus) who vote for them, so this problem will only be solved when Hindus will vote a right candidate.

 

[VajraYosid]

Is democracy itself a failed god?

It seems that money = media = votes.

 

[Sumit]

It seems that money = media = votes.

:yes:
Gov spent crores of rupees per month to control Indian media.

 

[Jainarayan]

A problem I see in all this is that "real Hindus" are secure enough in their faith and culture to not be swayed by proselytization. How secure in their faith are those who are easily swayed by proselytization, whether Hindu, Muslim, Jew, Sikh, Christian or Buddhist? Are they "real Hindus" because they are Indian, any more than those of us who adopt Hinduism? Uh... I gotta say that's a resounding and reverberating "No, they are not!". They never were and they never will be. Stop conflating Indian and Hindu. I think Indonesians might take umbrage with that also as much as I do. Whatever the true census is, if Indian Christians are even 10% of he entire population, that says that almost 3/4 of the population at least identify as Hindu. Ten percent of 1.2 billion is 120,000,000.

It seems some people are suggesting that Indians are sheeple. As a non-Indian with an affinity for India and its people, despite what some quarters think of me, I find it highly offensive and nauseating that Indians are so lowly thought of and sold short. Indian culture and civilization, and Hinduism is at least 5,000 years old; I believe it's older. For 5,000 years India and Hinduism have survived onslaughts from Muslims, Greeks (pagan Greeks I might add), and Christians. And still Hinduism survives. The only reason Chingghis Khan didn't make it to India was because of the Himālayas. He would be more of a threat to Indian civilization and Hinduism than all the others put together. And still India and Hinduism would survive. Is Hinduism Sanātana Dharma or not? If it is, then it will survive forever, and those people easily converted away from it were never Hindu to begin with. Why do western white converts have more faith in Indians than some so-called Indian Hindus?

 

[Jainarayan]

Yup, here it comes. And again with the assumption that we have all been Christian before.

Maya

And still are. And I can tell you where this comes from, and the reason it's come up in only the past few days. Shall I tell a story... ? (you know of what I speak )

 

[Jainarayan]

go praise your lord somewhere else.

Go spread your ad hominems and poison back from whence you came, yes?

lets keep hinduism pure.

Ironic words. Your homework is to think about that on several levels.

 

[nameless]

@Jainarayan & Maya

pls dont take newcomers seriously, i dont think any hindu would use the term 'real-hindu'.

 

[Jainarayan]

i dont think any hindu would use the term 'real-hindu'.

My point exactly, hence my putting it in " to denote my sarcasm and derision of those who use it.

 

[vistascan]

A problem I see in all this is that "real Hindus" are secure enough in their faith and culture to not be swayed by proselytization. How secure in their faith are those who are easily swayed by proselytization, whether Hindu, Muslim, Jew, Sikh, Christian or Buddhist? Are they "real Hindus" because they are Indian, any more than those of us who adopt Hinduism? Uh... I gotta say that's a resounding and reverberating "No, they are not!". They never were and they never will be. Stop conflating Indian and Hindu. I think Indonesians might take umbrage with that also as much as I do. Whatever the true census is, if Indian Christians are even 10% of he entire population, that says that almost 3/4 of the population at least identify as Hindu. Ten percent of 1.2 billion is 120,000,000.

I agree. I've talked to American Hindu converts who told me that he was treated as an outsider for a long time, like he wasn't truly Hindu and only Indians can be so. There is an element of ethnocentricity in Hinduism, which needs to be gotten rid of. Ethnocentricity ahs no place in sanatana dharma

 

[Maya3]

I agree. I've talked to American Hindu converts who told me that he was treated as an outsider for a long time, like he wasn't truly Hindu and only Indians can be so. There is an element of ethnocentricity in Hinduism, which needs to be gotten rid of. Ethnocentricity ahs no place in sanatana dharma

It really doesn't especially if you know what Tat Tvam Asi means.
(And I'm not talking about a certain poster here).

Maya

 

[Jainarayan]

I agree. I've talked to American Hindu converts who told me that he was treated as an outsider for a long time, like he wasn't truly Hindu and only Indians can be so. There is an element of ethnocentricity in Hinduism, which needs to be gotten rid of. Ethnocentricity ahs no place in sanatana dharma

As the only westerner at my temple, the only westerner that I know of, I have not yet experienced any type of unwelcome feeling. I don't even get the feeling of being a curiosity. In fact because I disappeared for about 8 months (personal reasons including surgery and re-hab), I got an e-mail from the woman who does seva at the temple asking if I was OK. When I re-appeared in temple, even the priests greeted me pleasantly. One even asked if I was OK all this time. Rather, on the internet (where everyone is an alpha male behind the keyboard) I've been called names and had my motives and devotion questioned time and again (not on this site... yet... it was on another site I do not frequent anymore because the atmosphere is more poisonous than that of the moon Titan).

 

[Kalidas]

I strongly doubt GOD cares much of where we come from.

 

[ratikala]

first of all, this thread needs to me moved out of the hindu DIR

why ? as vinayaka said this is a hindu problem , for hindu discussion .

I think it's evident from the words of "real hindus" who have contributed to this thread that christ has no place in hindu territory
isn't the message getting across?

and what do you concider to be a real hindu ?

why re-write hinduism?

agreed , there is no need to re write hinduism ,....... but there seems to be a deep need that many so called hindus learn to understand and practice it .

hindus don't need this "christian goodness" to be forced upon them. And it is forced.

you also seem to be egnoreing the fact that we have our own take on goodness and were we to practice it there would be no need to fear christianity or conversion .

go praise your lord somewhere else.
lets keep hinduism pure.

you just dont get it do you , if the indian populus were treated in a just manner by there own people , christians would not stand a chance , if people were happy there would be no room for christianity , no need for conversion .

Ratikala, you are 100% sure that the indian leadership isn't intentionally keeping the hindu masses poor, I'm not taking your word for it.

I think you have missread what I have said , I said that I was 100% sure of what I was saying , and that was , ..... and I quote my self

the sadest thing is it is not the christians who are keeplng them poor but the corrupt system of their own country , the christians are simply taking advantage of a pre existing problem .
whilst there is a high percentage of so called hindu who have more concern for their own personal gain than for their fellow indian nationals then there will be poverty and where there is such injustice inflicted from the higher eschelons of indian society there will be dissatisfaction and a lack of faith in the hindu system , leaving an unhapy and neglected under class who fall prey to conversion .

the reason that a large mass of people are kept in poverty is that these so called hindu leaders can line their own corupt pockets , it has nothing to do with conversion , I am not sure that they even care that much , all that they care about is their own personal power and gain .

if you want a hinduism that will serve all its people start thinking in terms of being a good hindu your self and seting a good example and stop shouting at the people who have simply highlighted a failing in modern day hinduism .

 

[ratikala]

namaskaram jainarayan ji :namaste

:yes: It's always been easier to point the finger at someone else instead of taking responsibility.

jai jai :namaste

To twist an old phrase, it's easier to curse the darkness than to light a candle. People who complain are the least likely to do anything to remedy a situation. Not to mention the complacency of the population, and corruption in government; and whose fault is that?

I think buddha put it very succinctly , ....attatchment , anger and ignorance :yes:

oh gosh I had better not mention buddha even if he did identify the problem perfectly , .....it is bound to upset someone , :run:

 

[Jainarayan]

oh gosh I had better not mention buddha even if he did identify the problem perfectly , .....it is bound to upset someone , :run:

:spit: bwahahahahaha

 

[Jainarayan]

you also seem to be egnoreing the fact that we have our own take on goodness and were we to practice it there would be no need to fear christianity or conversion .

The rest of the Gandhi quote is "My own veneration for other faiths is the same as that for my own faith; therefore no thought of conversion is possible." This goes back to being secure in your own faith. If you are secure in it, there is no thought of conversion or changing it. I think there is a basic insecurity with many people.