I think Islam is a totalitarian ideology with a religious facet.

[outhouse]

Your argument can hold no weight until you bring proof that the Quran has no understanding of nature

Again you change all my words, is this on purpose out of desperation?

I never stated it had no understanding of nature.


What do you call it when people tell things that are not true on purpose?

 

[outhouse]

Do you think it was OK to copy biblical mythology?

 

[Tomorrows_Child]

Again you change all my words, is this on purpose out of desperation?

I never stated it had no understanding of nature.


What do you call it when people tell things that are not true on purpose?

Apparently you said "little understanding of nature" and yet describing everything from astronomy to biology, to geography and geology, shows little understanding? You still haven't answered a single question and this is another one you keep avoiding.

I will not be answering any of your posts until you answer at least a handful of the questions I posed you, after answering ALL yous questions. Thanks.

 

[icehorse]

How many times can one be lucky? As a medical student, I know, very well in fact, the procedure of embryonic development. It is exceptionally well put in the Quran. As is the fact that the earth orbits the sun. In fact, the Quran tells us that the sun itself moves, a fact not discovered until many, many centuries after the revelation of the Quran. How many times can one be lucky and absolutely spot on? Your argument can hold no weight until you bring proof that the Quran has no understanding of nature. As I have brought you clear evidence of it's understanding of nature.

Hey! Another fallacy argument! Congrats! This time it's.... wait for it...

A false dilemma!

For those of you just tuning in, remember the context here is that we're being asked to accept that the Quran is the perfect, final, unalterable word of god. In which case, all we have to do to win is prove that it's not, in fact, perfect! We don't have to prove that it's always wrong - and in fact, it's not always wrong. All we have to prove is that it's sometimes wrong.

How about 25:53 which in my translation says: And it is He Who has let free the two seas (kinds of water): this is palatable and sweet, and that is salt and bitter; and He has set a barrier and a complete partition between them.

 

[Mycroft]

Islam is a totalitarian ideology with a religious component..

So is Christianity.

 

[outhouse]

I will not be answering any of your posts

You never started.


Do you think it was OK to copy biblical mythology?

 

[outhouse]

until you answer at least a handful of the questions I posed

I have seen almost all muslims try to steer the debate into their what I will call myth based philosophy. While always ignoring relevant questions.

Sorry you do not get to steer anything here.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

How do you work that one out? Islam told us the world was round, in fact, a particular shape, like an ostrich egg (the earth is not entirely spherical, as any physicist on earth would tell you) well over 500 years before the vast majority of humanity knew that to be true.

Many cultures independently discovered, since ancient times, that the earth is spherical in shape.

You also have to submit to a theocracy; fallible humans who will curtail what you can hear and say.

That is not really accurate. There is the concept of the Caliphate, but if there is no Caliphate (of which there are officially none) then there is no theocracy to submit to.

3 - This theocracy will also interpret Islam in ways that you might not agree with, but you will be forced to submit.

For a proper Caliphate, it must have the support of the Ummah. That is why Boko Haram and ISIS have not established a Caliphate, because they do not have the support of the Ummah.

 

[outhouse]

Apparently you said "little understanding of nature"

And you said I stated "ALL" nature.

Do you think it is OK to post words other people never said?


What do we call it when people purposely change words to mean something they originally did not?

 

[outhouse]

For a proper Caliphate, it must have the support of the Ummah. That is why Boko Haram and ISIS have not established a Caliphate, because they do not have the support of the Ummah.

You cannot use Ummah that way.

There is no central government or control.

 

[Aquitaine]

Islaam teaches women to dress with modesty, in the West women are taught to dress like escorts

In the West women and men can dress however they please, and the fact that you equate non-islamic women's dress as "dressing like escorts" highlights your own mysogyny.

Homosexuality is the test God gave them, not acting on it is rewarding.

Nonesense. Forbidding homosexuals from engaging in their sexuality is not "letting gays be gays".
It's no secret that Islam is intolerant of homosexuality.

You can't really call someone a pedophile if it was the norm 1400 years ago.

You can if that person is regarded as the most "perfect" human being in existence, and an example to emulate. Considering he was also the final messenger of some all-powerful creator emphasizes how his behavour and morals are seen as the "endgame" of moral and ethical development.
Whereas we actually have modern people who live much more ethical lives than Mohammad, for example those who do not support or engage in pedophilia.

And explain why science at one point was encouraged in Islaam? Why would it not be allowed now? Whats the Islaamic reason?

My best guess is to do with the countries at the time who were stable and powerful enough to dedicate some of their resources to scientific enquirey - primarily the Abbasid and to some extent the Ottomans.
Scientific progression tends to walk hand-in-hand with stable, powerful nations/empires.
One thing is for sure, people definitely didn't get anywhere with those bogus "scientific miracles" in the Quran.

If it wasn't to due with the stable and powerful countries which were Islamic at the time, then why is it that the Islamic world today is so backwards scientifically?

 

[icehorse]

Many cultures independently discovered, since ancient times, that the earth is spherical in shape.

That is not really accurate. There is the concept of the Caliphate, but if there is no Caliphate (of which there are officially none) then there is no theocracy to submit to.

For a proper Caliphate, it must have the support of the Ummah. That is why Boko Haram and ISIS have not established a Caliphate, because they do not have the support of the Ummah.

Currently there are many examples of Muslim majority countries that are more-or-less theocracies.

 

[icehorse]

So is Christianity.

Most of the world's Muslim believe the "church" should also be the government.
Very few of the world's Christians believe the same.

 

[Mycroft]

Most of the world's Muslim believe the "church" should also be the government.
Very few of the world's Christians believe the same.

Whether the Church or the All Controlling, All Seeing, All Knowing god, it's all the same.

 

[icehorse]

Whether the Church or the All Controlling, All Seeing, All Knowing god, it's all the same.

Not at all! Most Christians are quite happy living in a secular society. Most Muslims want to live in a Sharia society. The differences couldn't be more consequential.

 

[outhouse]

Whether the Church or the All Controlling, All Seeing, All Knowing god, it's all the same.

Sorry its not exactly like that bud.

There is a difference between church and state in western countries.

That is not true for most of islam, it is a total way of life ingrained much deeper then western religion.

 

[mahasn ebn sawresho]

Entirely wrong. Islam, as is often the case with many Arabic words, has a root word, in this case Salam, which means...yes you guessed it, peace but, something else which is a case with arabic, a single word can mean an entire sentence in english or many other languages and the literal translation of Islam is:

To obtain peace by submitting one's will to Allah.

This one word gives us an explanation on how to obtain peace, saying something or someone is peaceful is not enough, it is also important that we understand how to achieve that peace. And we do not submit our will to any worldly figure, or a worldly ideology, or a military force, or an economic force and so on and so forth. We submit ourselves to God, which is more than just saying "ah yeah, I'm a muslim" but that requires from us, 5 daily prayers, fasting, pilgrimage, giving money and help to the poor, obtaining education, spreading the truth, looking after the orphaned and the elderly, all these things are done and then we can say we have submitted ourselves to Allah. And in all these selfless acts, we find peace.

Islam does not mean peace
But mean surrenderThese dictionaries Arabic
Despite the disappearance of the original sources on the netThe five obligatory prayers and fasting and prayer and others, it does not mean that you represent the truth
Because all the ordinances of religion even pagan Eladisan
We are here talking about the doctrine and teachings

 

[mahasn ebn sawresho]

How do you work that one out? Islam told us the world was round, in fact, a particular shape, like an ostrich egg (the earth is not entirely spherical, as any physicist on earth would tell you) well over 500 years before the vast majority of humanity knew that to be true. Does this not show an understanding of nature? Would you maybe like to admit you were wrong on that regard? Because you quite clearly were, unless you could show me verses of the Quran claiming the world was flat...as was the accepted knowledge throughout academia at the time. I'll be waiting. In fact, if you can prove me otherwise, I will quite easily disown my faith.

Islam says that the earth is flat
And the evidence is
Even if it reaches of the sun goes down and found her in the eye Hmeh

Zulkarnain have arrived to the scene of the sunset on the ground and how they fall in the eye of Garrison
This is conclusive evidence that the Quran says that the earth is flat, not spherical

 

[mahasn ebn sawresho]

Not at all! Most Christians are quite happy living in a secular society. Most Muslims want to live in a Sharia society. The differences couldn't be more consequential.

you are right
Christian follows the teachings of Christ
Christ said
Give to Caesar what is Caesar
What is to God to God
To accept this Christian idea of man-made laws
And respects the ruling
But Muslim does not believe acceptance of this
Because he says that the Quran is the law of God and he is the best laws
It's a big difference and has a very big results

 

[Tomorrows_Child]

Islam says that the earth is flat
And the evidence is
Even if it reaches of the sun goes down and found her in the eye Hmeh

Zulkarnain have arrived to the scene of the sunset on the ground and how they fall in the eye of Garrison
This is conclusive evidence that the Quran says that the earth is flat, not spherical

Show me the verse where the Quran says the earth is flat. Completely flat. An unequivocal statement by God. I don't want something that can be interpreted in different ways by people with an agenda. I want the actual shape of the earth and an unarguable statement from God in the Quran.

The verse I have. 79:30, “And we have made the earth egg shaped”.

There can be no argument here. How would you interpret egg? Would it be flat? So I'd like a similarly unequivocal statement. Thanks.