imagine...

[Thief]

ok thief,
this is true, what next? do you think the religions of the world would be even more at odds with one another? because god is going to do what he has been doing...nothing.

Well let's just run with it....
Seems to be going that way...anyway....

God does reveal Himself....checks in to say....'Hi there'.
First one prophet and then another.
In one culture....and then another.

And any writing set down will never affect any two people in the same way.

Diversity in believing?...sure...lots of it.
Will it get worse?....oh yeah...war is at hand.

Will it ever come together?...yes....but not in this life.

As you stand at the gate....wanting to get in....
Do you really think it matters which prophet you followed?
Moses is not with God?....Jesus not a Son?.....Muhammad failed?

It is the nay saying that will be left at the door.

 

[waitasec]

Well let's just run with it....
Seems to be going that way...anyway....

God does reveal Himself....checks in to say....'Hi there'.
First one prophet and then another.
In one culture....and then another.

And any writing set down will never affect any two people in the same way.

Diversity in believing?...sure...lots of it.
Will it get worse?....oh yeah...war is at hand.

Will it ever come together?...yes....but not in this life.

As you stand at the gate....wanting to get in....
Do you really think it matters which prophet you followed?
Moses is not with God?....Jesus not a Son?.....Muhammad failed?

It is the nay saying that will be left at the door.

do you think god wants me to follow anyone else other than following my reasoning, resolve, integrity and self dignity? after all i was born with these qualities, why not use them?

 

[Father Heathen]

Well let's just run with it....
Seems to be going that way...anyway....

God does reveal Himself....checks in to say....'Hi there'.
First one prophet and then another.
In one culture....and then another.

And any writing set down will never affect any two people in the same way.

Diversity in believing?...sure...lots of it.
Will it get worse?....oh yeah...war is at hand.

Will it ever come together?...yes....but not in this life.

As you stand at the gate....wanting to get in....
Do you really think it matters which prophet you followed?
Moses is not with God?....Jesus not a Son?.....Muhammad failed?

It is the nay saying that will be left at the door.

I'm a prophet.

Give me a cut of your profits.

Now do a back flip through this hoop.

What? Don't you believe in god?

 

[Thief]

do you think god wants me to follow anyone else other than following my reasoning, resolve, integrity and self dignity? after all i was born with these qualities, why not use them?

Not bad....
And I would have to say yeah!.....(I'm a rogue theologian)

But neither can I assume to stand well in the presence of others.

Can you picture yourself seated at a table, alongside prophets of great
renown?....would it seem awkward?

Walk in heaven...where even angels have been known to fail?

 

[Thief]

I'm a prophet.

Give me a cut of your profits.

Now do a back flip through this hoop.

What? Don't you believe in god?

You're such a clown!

 

[Father Heathen]

You're such a clown!

Peace be upon me. In my name. Amen.

 

[Father Heathen]

I decided to take some of my posts here and start a thread on the topic of god vs. religion.

 

[waitasec]

Not bad....
And I would have to say yeah!.....(I'm a rogue theologian)

But neither can I assume to stand well in the presence of others.

Can you picture yourself seated at a table, alongside prophets of great
renown?....would it seem awkward?

Walk in heaven...where even angels have been known to fail?

then my innate qualities would be subjected to interpretation of said prophets
isn't god bigger than that?

if you are true to those qualities you are born with, why couldn't you stand well in the presence of others?

 

[Ben Masada]

john lennon was on to something. but lets take this idea one step further
(if that's possible...)
lets say science found unquestionable evidence for god somehow...what would happen then?
would god all of a sudden appear to humanity and tell us how we are to serve him, if that is what would be required?
or, if at that point after the discovery god still remains the way god is now, what do you think would happen? do you think humanity would unite or become even more divided than we are now?

what do you think?

Too hypothetical and unnecessary. We have the Scriptures to go by. It is not forbidden from us, neither it is far off. It is not in heaven, that we should say, Who shall go up for us to heaven, and bring it to us, that we may hear it and do it? Neither is it beyond the sea, that we should say, Who shall go over the sea for us, and bring it to us, that we may hear it, and do it? But the Word is very near to us, in our mouth, and in our heart, that we may do it. (Deut. 30:11-14)

 

[Father Heathen]

Too hypothetical and unnecessary. We have the Scriptures to go by. It is not forbidden from us, neither it is far off. It is not in heaven, that we should say, Who shall go up for us to heaven, and bring it to us, that we may hear it and do it? Neither is it beyond the sea, that we should say, Who shall go over the sea for us, and bring it to us, that we may hear it, and do it? But the Word is very near to us, in our mouth, and in our heart, that we may do it. (Deut. 30:11-14)

"It's far too easy for mere mortal men to put words in my mouth and use me as a sock puppet. Zip zap zippity zop." -God

 

[Thief]

then my innate qualities would be subjected to interpretation of said prophets
isn't god bigger than that?

if you are true to those qualities you are born with, why couldn't you stand well in the presence of others?

Yep...God is bigger than that.

It's all about superlatives.

Bigger, faster, stronger, more intelligent, greatly experienced.....

Why choose out of mediocrity?...when the very best is at hand?

 

[Father Heathen]

Yep...God is bigger than that.

And that's the problem with religions and holy books; they try to slap their own ugly face on god and stuff "him" in a tiny box.

You're catching on.

 

[Thief]

And that's the problem with religions and holy books; they try to slap their own ugly face on god and stuff "him" in a tiny box.

You're catching on.

Stop clowning around...
you're discussing something...
bigger, faster, stronger, more intelligent, and greatly experienced.

No tiny box for Him.
He's got the entire universe for His own.

But maybe it's not the existence of God that you are aiming at?
just religion.

 

[waitasec]

Stop clowning around...
you're discussing something...
bigger, faster, stronger, more intelligent, and greatly experienced.

No tiny box for Him.
He's got the entire universe for His own.

But maybe it's not the existence of God that you are aiming at?
just religion.

thief, when looking through a peep hole do you think whatever it is you see is small enough to fit into your limited perception and comprehension? in other words, do you think it's small enough to fit through the peep hole or the realm of understanding?

 

[waitasec]

Why choose out of mediocrity?...when the very best is at hand?

exactly...what do you think this is all about. the conservative understanding of a deity that is actually concerned with our daily lives...that is mediocre at best.

 

[Thief]

thief, when looking through a peep hole do you think whatever it is you see is small enough to fit into your limited perception and comprehension? in other words, do you think it's small enough to fit through the peep hole or the realm of understanding?

Sounds like a trick question.

How about...
It's easier for a camel to fit through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the gates of heaven.

The rich man fails...not for lack of 'know how'.
'Know how' is how he got rich.

In appearence, people who do well...seem to understand.
But does that type of understanding lead to the next life?

The path to destruction is traveled by many.
The gate way to heaven is narrow.

Does that mean I need to be narrow minded?.....no.

Now which peep hole were you talking about?

 

[Penumbra]

I think that if science were to find unquestionable evidence for God, a lot more people would require nothing more. They'd be believers. And then He'd say something similar to what Jesus said to the Apostle, Thomas. It would be something along these lines: "Because my existence has been proven to you, you believe. Blessed are those who did not require scientific evidence in order to believe."

Why would belief without evidence be considered by god to be a virtue rather than an error?

There is a massive set of contradicting and unsubstantiated claims regarding religion, gods, afterlives, and the supernatural in general.

 

[waitasec]

Sounds like a trick question.

well it's not...it's what father heathen and i have been saying all along
our understanding is that peep hole and using our labels limits what it is we see.

How about...
It's easier for a camel to fit through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the gates of heaven.

The rich man fails...not for lack of 'know how'.
'Know how' is how he got rich.

well the eye of the needle wasn't impossible to go through, it just takes tenacity when facing challenges to go forward and eventually you'll find your way through.

but this isn't the point i'm making.
this eye of the needle is basically keep trying and if you are really searching for an answer you'll find it through progress.

In appearence, people who do well...seem to understand.
But does that type of understanding lead to the next life?

i don't think if people are successful means anything, they still have to sleep soundly at night.

The path to destruction is traveled by many.
The gate way to heaven is narrow.

what is the path of destruction, skepticism?
sounds like fear to me.

Does that mean I need to be narrow minded?.....no.

Now which peep hole were you talking about?

why do you think there is so much strife between religions?
because of their narrow mindedness and mediocrity...and unfortunately we are surrounded and live a life that is consequential to this small minded ideal. that god can actually fit through that peep hole.

 

[waitasec]

Why would belief without evidence be considered by god to be a virtue rather than an error?

good question!!!

There is a massive set of contradicting and unsubstantiated claims regarding religion, gods, afterlives, and the supernatural in general.

only if you were to believe without evidence that these contradicting and unsubstantiated claims make absolute sense...:sarcastic

 

[Katzpur]

Why would belief without evidence be considered by god to be a virtue rather than an error?

Those of us who believe see evidence in God's existance everywhere we look. I don't think very many of us have faith in Him without having seen evidence. But it's not evidence that can be replicated by science. Accepting something only where there is absolute proof requires nothing of us. St. Gregory once said, "If the work of God could be comprehended by reason, it would be no longer wonderful, and faith would have not merit if reason provided proof.” I see the same thing as being true pertaining to the existance of God itself.

There is a massive set of contradicting and unsubstantiated claims regarding religion, gods, afterlives, and the supernatural in general.

You're right. There is. And believing that God doesn't exist is just one of those unsubstantiated claims.