'In God We Trust' and 'Under God'

[Buddha Dharma]

In my continuing effort to be more political, I suggest we discuss the national motto, and the subject of 'under God' in the pledge of allegiance.

Do you think our motto should be E Pluribus Unum, In God We Trust, or- should we just go with what Franklin favored: rebellion against tyrants is obedience to God?

Same question for 'under God' in the pledge. Does it belong there? Was the original pledge better? I include the mentioned original below:

Explain your answers, if you don't mind.

 

[Revoltingest]

We should return to our original mottos, as shown on the Fugio Cent.

Mind Your business
We Are One

Best mottos ever!

 

[sun rise]

I voted "I just want to vote". Rather than invoke the flag, I would rather say:

"I pledge allegiance to our founding ideals etc".

I'm agnostic on the topic of invoking God since the phase "under God" was added to contrast the US from the "Godless communists".

 

[Duke_Leto]

I voted "I just want to vote". Rather than invoke the flag, I would rather say:

"I pledge allegiance to our founding ideals etc".

I'm agnostic on the topic of invoking God since the phase "under God" was added to contrast the US from the "Godless communists".

Why should I pledge allegiance to the country I happened to be born in, or even its "ideals" (who determines what the "ideals" are)?

I voted for 'Rebellion Against Tyrants is Obedience to God'. I feel like it might inspire a more politically thoughtful population. I don't believe the Pledge of Allegiance should exist.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

I think the Pledge should be gotten rid of and that the motto should be E Pluribus Unum, which more reflects the founding values.

 

[Kenny]

Love, "In God we Trust".

 

[Valjean]

I'm against any loyalty oath.
As a motto, the golden rule might be an improvement, but it's rather wordy. Maybe "Only Kindness Matters" would be better.

 

[beenherebeforeagain]

We should return to our original mottos, as shown on the Fugio Cent.

Mind Your business
We Are One

Best mottos ever!

These would be quite acceptable.

 

[beenherebeforeagain]

I voted "I just want to vote". Rather than invoke the flag, I would rather say:

"I pledge allegiance to our founding ideals etc".

I'm agnostic on the topic of invoking God since the phase "under God" was added to contrast the US from the "Godless communists".

Pledging allegiance to the founding ideals, or even to uphold the Constitution, would be okay with me.

 

[beenherebeforeagain]

Love, "In God we Trust".

And yet, it offends me, as I don't share the "God" that it references. How about "In Gods We Trust" instead?

 

[The Kilted Heathen]

I agree that our motto should be "E Pluribus Unum" (From Many, One), and I agree that our pledge should omit "under god", but I don't have a problem with saying "United States of America". That is what and who we are, after all.

 

[Buddha Dharma]

but I don't have a problem with saying "United States of America". That is what and who we are, after all.

I don't have an issue with saying US of America, but I can understand why it may have originally been omitted. Because nationalism can override democratic ideals, and the author may have wanted to say it's a republic we pledge to. The ideals of a democratic republic.

 

[Skwim]

Exactly what is accomplished by anyone, or simply people in general, pledging their allegiance to their country? All I can see is that it may produce a feel-goody moment in some people.

.

 

[Twilight Hue]

In my continuing effort to be more political, I suggest we discuss the national motto, and the subject of 'under God' in the pledge of allegiance.

Do you think our motto should be E Pluribus Unum, In God We Trust, or- should we just go with what Franklin favored: rebellion against tyrants is obedience to God?

Same question for 'under God' in the pledge. Does it belong there? Was the original pledge better? I include the mentioned original below:

Explain your answers, if you don't mind.

I can live with that. In God We Trust and under God add ons has pretty much run its course.

The USSR doesn't exist anymore.

 

[Sunstone]

I prefer "E Pluribus Unum" as the national motto, and I firmly believe the pledge should be outlawed under pain of being forced to listen to a thousand repetitions of "Acky Breaky Heart" if some fool dares utter it. The US should have no loyalty oaths. No Democracy should. Democracies should earn the loyalty of their citizens, not brainwash loyalty into them.

 

[Phantasman]

The US was created under Judeo-Christian principles. It grew under those principles. When those principles are discarded, the ideology as well as the nation that grew from it, will decline into it's origin. The world takes it's place within the US, bringing the cultures of the world with them. And the same divisions of the world, will be contained in the US as well. The concept of the fore fathers has seen it's peak, and now we see it's demise at hand.

Just my view.

 

[columbus]

I don't have an issue with saying US of America, but I can understand why it may have originally been omitted.

You might want to Google the original intent of the author. His name is Bellamy.

He wrote the pledge as a unifying statement. It was towards the end of the 19th century, when the USA was riddled with hate and resentment lingering from the War of Northern Aggression. And there was also hope that representative government, republics, might take hold in more of the world.
Bellamy wanted an international affirmation of the basic principles, not a pledge to any particular nation. And then in the 50s, the USA government further bastardized the Pledge by inserting "under God", to divide the USA into the camps "Godless commies" and "decent folk who support the current elite".

I would be fine with the Pledge just going away. To me it's a symbol of division and strife.
Tom

 

[Buddha Dharma]

The US was created under Judeo-Christian principles.

False. I was waiting for that to come up though. Do you think the first amendment syncs very well with say the first commandment? To have no gods besides YHVH. The first amendment allows such.

That should be enough to start. I've got Adams, Jefferson, and the gang ready to paste- should the need arise.

 

[columbus]

The USA was created under Judeo-Christian principles.

No it wasn't, it was created in opposition to them.

You won't find anything about representative government or personal liberty or freedoms like speech and religion anywhere in Scripture.
Tom

 

[Buddha Dharma]

You won't find anything about representative government or personal liberty or freedoms like speech and religion anywhere in Scripture.

In fact, what you'll find is pretty much what we had before modern democracy: divine right of kings.