In the U.S., Christianity loses members while atheism grows. Why?

[Father Heathen]

Guess I will add "believing in God" to my list of contributing factors to violence. I will have to remember to pay more attention to the old Baptist lady down the street in case she pulls her glock on me.

The problem isn't a belief in god (nothing wrong with that), but a blind adherence to a rigid and irrational dogma.

 

[Apex]

The problem isn't a belief in god (nothing wrong with that), but a blind adherence to a rigid and irrational dogma.

Ah, see the original post did not make that distinction, it just said "religion". With this clarification I do not really see anything to disagree with.

 

[madhatter85]

Ah, see the original post did not make that distinction, it just said "religion". With this clarification I do not really see anything to disagree with.

LDS have a lot in common with athiests, I have always noticed that. we both seek for absolute truth, however the difference is what is accepted as evidence. great quote katzpur posted, was great bares repeating:

"I also do not understand people who say that they “choose” to believe something. I don’t think you can choose to believe. If I could choose to believe something, I would believe that I am the most intelligent man in America. That would feel good; I would like to believe that. But I can’t, because I know better. I can only believe things that I reasonably expect to be true."

"What scientists do is what Karl Popper said in his cute definition of science: 'Science is doing your damnedest with your mind – no holds barred.' The problem with science is not the process, but the artificial limits that most scientists put on the evidence they will accept. Evidence, they say, must be objective. This is a reasonable limitation, in a way, because the goal of science is not just to find truth, but also to communicate it. And you can only communicate things that others will understand through your common experience. But many scientists use this limitation on what they can communicate to others as the criterion for what they will accept for themselves. They will not seek a revelation because it would be a subjective evidence. So what? What a brain-numbing, truth-avoiding, closed-minded attitude this is! This is not doing your damnedest with your mind, no holds barred; it is setting up artificial rules that exclude a wealth of evidence and knowledge."

 

[dogsgod]

LDS have a lot in common with athiests, I have always noticed that. we both seek for absolute truth, however the difference is what is accepted as evidence. great quote katzpur posted, was great bares repeating:

Atheists don't have anything in common with atheists other than not holding any beliefs in any of the gods that people worship. I suppose some atheists believe absolute truths exist and some don't.

 

[madhatter85]

Atheists don't have anything in common with atheists other than not holding any beliefs in any of the gods that people worship. I suppose some atheists believe absolute truths exist and some don't.

Most atheists are atheist because they don't feel they have seen evidence that God exists. If they did find evidence that they accept as valid they would believe in God. They don't want to believe in false ideas of imaginary beings, and I agree completely with that last bit.

Evidence, they say, must be objective. This is a reasonable limitation, in a way, because the goal of science is not just to find truth, but also to communicate it. And you can only communicate things that others will understand through your common experience. But many scientists use this limitation on what they can communicate to others as the criterion for what they will accept for themselves. They will not seek a revelation because it would be a subjective evidence.

Or in other words it is very difficult to communicate what exactly I have accepted as evidence that god exists to other people because it is personal experience.

 

[dogsgod]

Or in other words it is very difficult to communicate what exactly I have accepted as evidence that god exists to other people because it is personal experience.

Explanations that defy the laws of physics are not valid explanations for ones personal experiences. Your experience is real but your explanation isn't.

 

[Beaudreaux]

Or in other words it is very difficult to communicate what exactly I have accepted as evidence that god exists to other people because it is personal experience.

There is no such thing as evidence that cannot be explained to others. Evidence is evident.

 

[footprints]

You are quite mistaken. Surveys among scientists for example show the vast majority are atheists.

Logician, surveys like that are perception based, rather than being based on reality.

Take a survey in Iran and I will guarantee it will come out the other way even pertaining to scientists, the same applies to many other countries. Science takes in many fields, in the specific surveys I have seen, most have been specific to scientists from specific fields.

It can also be reasonably and rationally argued, scientist are not the most educated or intelligent people to go through Uni.

 

[footprints]

The removal of school induced religious indoctrination actually means parents have more control over what their childrens beliefs are.

The only way a parent can control what their childrens beliefs are, is to deny them of all knowledge of everything that goes against their own belief patterns. This means not allowing any person of opposing beliefs ever talking to them pertaining to their beliefs, or the child not reading, overhearing or gaining opposing knowledge in any way shape or form. In essence it is to keep them totally ignorant.

Other children have more influence on children than most parents will ever have, this only gets worse when some children reach adolescence. In most part, children relate and associate to other children much better than they do to their parents, children speak each others language.

 

[Beaudreaux]

Take a survey in Iran and I will guarantee it will come out the other way even pertaining to scientists, the same applies to many other countries.

It must be liberating to have the ability to guarantee the results of surveys that have not been taken, or whose data you have not read. This saves a lot of time. Instead of wasting time reading survey results, as logician has, you can simply infer what the results would be in a given situation and guarantee them with certainty. This saves lots of time that can be effectively used for other things, like guaranteeing the results of experiments not yet perfomed or athletic contests not yet played.

 

[Josh5v]

I have found no empirical evidence to prove either position; that God exists or that God does not exist.

 

[JMorris]

Guess I will add "believing in God" to my list of contributing factors to violence. I will have to remember to pay more attention to the old Baptist lady down the street in case she pulls her glock on me.

you certainly should. when people believe in demonic possessions & apocalyptic scenarios, they tend to be well armed & a bit frazzled.

 

[madhatter85]

Explanations that defy the laws of physics are not valid explanations for ones personal experiences. Your experience is real but your explanation isn't.

None of my experiences defy physical laws

 

[madhatter85]

There is no such thing as evidence that cannot be explained to others. Evidence is evident.

actually there is,

Say you get a 3rd degree burn, you can tell everyone in the world exactly how it felt to the best of your ability, however, nobody will be able to really understand what you have experienced until they have experienced it themselves.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

actually there is,

Say you get a 3rd degree burn, you can tell everyone in the world exactly how it felt to the best of your ability, however, nobody will be able to really understand what you have experienced until they have experienced it themselves.

Since a 3rd degree burn would do severe damage to your nerves, it's quite likely that the sensations you felt wouldn't be enough for you to really understand what you have experienced either.

It could be that you and the doctor examining you would have different opinions of what you'd been through, without either opinion being complete or totally correct. In fact, it could be that the doctor could have a better understanding of what you went through than you did... especially if you're still in shock.

 

[madhatter85]

Since a 3rd degree burn would do severe damage to your nerves, it's quite likely that the sensations you felt wouldn't be enough for you to really understand what you have experienced either.

It could be that you and the doctor examining you would have different opinions of what you'd been through, without either opinion being complete or totally correct. In fact, it could be that the doctor could have a better understanding of what you went through than you did... especially if you're still in shock.

it's call an analogy, take out 3rd degree burns ant put any other sensory experience in it's place.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

it's call an analogy, take out 3rd degree burns ant put any other sensory experience in it's place.

The same objection still applies: we might not be talking about nerve damage any more, but often times someone else may be a better judge than the person who directly experienced something.

For instance, there was a story on the news around here recently about a New Year's Eve hit-and-run. The pedestrian was sure that the vehicle that hit him was a white SUV. When the police collected the fragments that broke off the front end of the vehicle in the crash and analyzed them, they found that they came from a silver Chevy Lumina - a silver sedan, not a white SUV.

People are mistaken about their personal experiences all the time.

 

[nonbeliever_92]

Why is Christianity down and Atheism up? Ultimately, education and practical thinking.

 

[dogsgod]

None of my experiences defy physical laws

Who said they did?

 

[madhatter85]

Why is Christianity down and Atheism up? Ultimately, education and practical thinking.

I agree when it comes to most Christian faiths, however it is not the case with LDS membership.