Is a prostitute and one-night stand the same?

[nnmartin]

I can accept that they are both working for free here.

 

[nnmartin]

With a hooker the two parties certainly know beforehand but most one night stands are spontaneous rather than planned so what exactly are the two parties supposed to know beforehand?

both parties could know beforehand that there would be no further contact or chance of relationship.

both parties may already have partners for instance and just agreed to one night of fun whilst away from home or through too much drink etc..

 

[lunakilo]

ok, so how is this any more immoral than paying someone minimum wage to clean your toilets?

You are changing the topic.

If action B is more immoral than action A, does that mean that action A is ok?
If something is immoral it is immoral.

would you say someone that was physically disabled, too old, too unconventional or just downright ugly, and thus needed to pay for it, to have 'something wrong with them?'

I think there is something wrong with the gramma in your sentense (mine too I know I can't spell ) I am not sure I understand it, but I think you are asking if I think people I am saying that people who are "physically disabled, too old,..." and have to pay for sex if they want any have something wrong with them.

In the sense of they are not 'cool' enough to get sex without paying for it, which puts them in the 'lame' category; yes.

(And I don't think being physically disabled, oll or just plain ugly necessarily means people will not have sex with you.)

 

[blackout]

People have REASONS (their Own reasons)
for doing things one way, instead of another.

When people do/approach a thing differently (for their own reasons),
this constitutes both reason... and DIFFERENCE.

(ie, yes, they are Different. aka- Not the same.)

 

[lunakilo]

It would stray off topic to get into a debate about whether or not prostitution should be legal, but here in Ontario where I live, our Provincial Court has paved the way by striking down laws against brothels: Ontario's top court legalizes brothels for safety - Yahoo! News The case will still have to go up before the Supreme Court of Canada for a final ruling, so it's a little too early to say it's green light for the red light districts.

I honestly don't know where to stand on this issue. For the most part, I have been assuming that legalized prostitution will remove the hazards associated with street prostitution, but I'm hearing conflicting claims about the results so far from Holland and other European countries, to say it's a good thing and will make life better for the girls who are in a blackmarket business right now.

I will have to stray the thread a bit off topic with some info...

I live in Denmark where prostitution is legal.
And I can tell you it has both positive and negative effects.

Positive because it protects the prostitutes who as I said before are usually people who have enough problems in their lives.
I see no reason to make their lives more dificult by making what they do illigal (I do not see any moral reason to ban prostitution).

Negative because it creates problems with human trafficing of sex slaves.
Prostitution is legal, but pimping is not. Unfortunatly legally proving that a prostitute is not working alone is often difficult, so there is little risk of getting caught.
There are many examples of women bering lured to Denmark from a country outside th EU with the promise of a job, and when they get here it turns out to be a job as a prostitute.
They have no work permit, and so if they go to the police they are in trouble.
If they get caught they will be thrown out of the country, but the people behind it are rarely caught.

 

[Sunstone]

if there is a difference then someone can please point it out.

I pointed out at least one difference between prostitution and one-night stands in post #19. Why have you not addressed that post?

 

[Sunstone]

would you say someone that was physically disabled, too old, too unconventional or just downright ugly, and thus needed to pay for it, to have 'something wrong with them?'

Nowadays, anyone can get sex in this country without paying for it. Where have you been?

 

[blackout]

Nowadays, anyone can get sex in this country without paying for it. Where have you been?

Paying?

 

[nnmartin]

I
There are many examples of women bering lured to Denmark from a country outside th EU with the promise of a job, and when they get here it turns out to be a job as a prostitute.
They have no work permit, and so if they go to the police they are in trouble.
If they get caught they will be thrown out of the country, but the people behind it are rarely caught.

I can't see the problem here because the girl knows she does not have a work permit.

If I were to come to the US on a tourist visa and pick up work as a casual laborer then no doubt I would also be arrested and deported too if caught.

but if I were willing to take the risk then yes, sure maybe it would work out.

So if you want legal work in Denmark then apply for a work permit. If you don't but then get caught then it is your own fault for committing the crime of working illegaly.

don't want to chance it , don't do it.

simple

 

[nnmartin]

Nowadays, anyone can get sex in this country without paying for it. Where have you been?

not sure about that but I'm sure it wouldn't entail good sex with a hot chick at the place and time of one's convenience (ie: if you were ugly, too old, weird or had some other such impediment)

 

[nnmartin]

Post 19

It seems to me false and misleading to suggest that no love is ever involved in one-night stands. I can recall a one-night stand I had with a woman I was very much in love with -- and still am in love with.

it would be most unlikely to be in love with someone you had just met.

this is mainly what I am referring to here - ie: picking up a non working-girl at a bar

So that would seem to me one possible difference between a one-night stand and prostitution, contra the OP.

but not really a difference in the scenario I have laid out really.

 

[Sunstone]

Post 19

it would be most unlikely to be in love with someone you had just met.

this is mainly what I am referring to here - ie: picking up a non working-girl at a bar

but not really a difference in the scenario I have laid out really.

You're changing the argument now. Earlier, you said a one-night stand was "exactly" like prostitution. Now, you're saying it's no longer exactly like prostitution? If so, you've lost the argument.

 

[lunakilo]

but many people in the Western nations are subliminally influenced by Christianity and hence condemn the use of prostitutes without fully realising why.

You could be right about that.
Most western countries were one upon a time christian, and some of the old views of what is right and what is wrong may just stick around because no one has bothered to actively do something to change those views.

As I said before I live in a country where prostitition is legal, but that does not mean that people in general think it is 'right'
My argument that it is 'immoral' to buy sex because it is taking advantage of a person in a bad situation only works if you see this as damaging to the prostitute in some way.
That is, that the person who is a prostitute would choose not to be a prostitute if she(or he) had the choice.

I think this is generally so, by why it is so is a good question.

But I don't think this makes your original statement that one-night stand=prostitution correct.

 

[lunakilo]

I can't see the problem here because the girl knows she does not have a work permit.

If I were to come to the US on a tourist visa and pick up work as a casual laborer then no doubt I would also be arrested and deported too if caught.

but if I were willing to take the risk then yes, sure maybe it would work out.

So if you want legal work in Denmark then apply for a work permit. If you don't but then get caught then it is your own fault for committing the crime of working illegaly.

don't want to chance it , don't do it.

simple

So you expect a random person from Zimbabwe to know the rules of getting a work permit in Denmark?
If a person is promised work + a work permit and the arrives and finds out this is a lie, then what?

The problem isn't that the girl gets kicked out. She is breaking the law working without a permit after all.
The problem is the pimp who gets away with it and probably ruins a young girls life in the process.
If prostitution wasn't legal he would probably not be able to make a proffit as easily.
He probably would find some other way to make money and fewer young girls would fall into his trap.

 

[cablescavenger]

I would say yes, there is no difference whatsoever in performing with a prostitute or having a one-night stand.

The only thing it comes down to is the belief that with a one-nighter there is some kind chance that the girl/man actually fancies you. However whether they do or not is utterly meaningless as there is no love involved.

Handing over money to a girl afterwards is no different to handing over your phone number, or money for drinks and meal.

exactly the same, except one's ego feels bigger with a one-nighter as it believes it has scored the 'real thing'.

agree, disagree?

They are both people.

 

[Sunstone]

I don't see how the question -- is prostitution the same as a one-night stand -- is anything but prudish nonsense. I guess if you want to be a prude, you can be a prude. But it seems like such a waste of life to be one.

 

[Trey of Diamonds]

both parties could know beforehand that there would be no further contact or chance of relationship.

both parties may already have partners for instance and just agreed to one night of fun whilst away from home or through too much drink etc..

You are working under a false assumption. One night stands are rarely discussed prior to while one party may know that it is a one night stand it is rare that both parties do. Generally one finds out they were a one night stand only after the second stand fails to materialise.

 

[work in progress]

I will have to stray the thread a bit off topic with some info...

I live in Denmark where prostitution is legal.
And I can tell you it has both positive and negative effects.

Positive because it protects the prostitutes who as I said before are usually people who have enough problems in their lives.
I see no reason to make their lives more dificult by making what they do illigal (I do not see any moral reason to ban prostitution).

Negative because it creates problems with human trafficing of sex slaves.
Prostitution is legal, but pimping is not. Unfortunatly legally proving that a prostitute is not working alone is often difficult, so there is little risk of getting caught.
There are many examples of women bering lured to Denmark from a country outside th EU with the promise of a job, and when they get here it turns out to be a job as a prostitute.
They have no work permit, and so if they go to the police they are in trouble.
If they get caught they will be thrown out of the country, but the people behind it are rarely caught.

Thanks for giving an inside look at the issue! It appears that legalized prostitution doesn't erase all the ills associated with the business...pimps, organized crime, drugs and female slavery etc.; but on balance, the way we have been handling prostitution for centuries isn't working either.

It looks like organized crime, trafficking and drug and controlling STD issues don't magically vanish when a formerly illegal enterprize is decriminalized, but if the overall results are better, then that's the direction we need to go in. When Prohibition of alcohol was instituted in the United States in the late 20's, many....possibly most people stopped drinking....especially working class who would have had trouble affording bootlegged booze. And that's where Mafia and other criminal syndicates really took off in the U.S.....opening "speakeasy's"(illegal bars and taverns) for those who could, and wanted to pay the price, buying the necessary police, city officials, politicians etc. to look the other way, and going to war against rival mobs trying to take over. When liquor was legalized again during the 1930's, organized crime didn't just walk away and give up control! They sought out other blackmarkets that could be developed, and bought legal drinking establishments to launder their money. No doubt the same thing happens when legal brothels are opened, and will happen whenever marijuana is legalized.

It looks like any illegal product or service that has a high demand, is going to result in some black market being established to try to fill the demand. When a society moves in the other direction (like our provincial government is doing now with prostitution), it's almost like they are trying to put the genie back in the bottle when they make it legal. It would be nice if politicians....and the voters who elect them, were smart enough to really try to determine the best solution before these sorts of issues turn into festering sores....but that might be asking too much!

 

[work in progress]

You could be right about that.
Most western countries were one upon a time christian, and some of the old views of what is right and what is wrong may just stick around because no one has bothered to actively do something to change those views.

As I said before I live in a country where prostitition is legal, but that does not mean that people in general think it is 'right'

This is an important distinction to make, because many of us who agree with legalization don't believe it is a nice, respectable business. And although I agree that prostitution may be better as a legal business, it's still not something I like, and will continue to feed social ills....though hopefully to a lesser degree than the present situation.

My argument that it is 'immoral' to buy sex because it is taking advantage of a person in a bad situation only works if you see this as damaging to the prostitute in some way.
That is, that the person who is a prostitute would choose not to be a prostitute if she(or he) had the choice.

Doesn't the transaction of buying a woman for sex turn her into a commodity? Maybe a highly payed product, who will earn more money than the other options she felt were available....but a product nevertheless! I know both married guys and single guys who admit to buying it on occasion. I think both are less likely to be able to establish or maintain any high quality relationships with women, if it's just all about sex.

 

[Trey of Diamonds]

both parties could know beforehand that there would be no further contact or chance of relationship.

both parties may already have partners for instance and just agreed to one night of fun whilst away from home or through too much drink etc..

Could know sure, but you seem to be implying that this is the normal and most often occuring scenario. This is incorrect and misleading. You are using an improbable occurance that can possibly, but rarely does, happen to support your rather twisted view of what prostitution is.

edit: Oops, already replied to this post, oh well, it still fits.