Is feminism still needed in the U.S.

[dust1n]

Again, I would be happy to adress your misconceptions in a relevant thread made by you or by pm messages

I am very willing to educate you on that that I haveeen educated on, but this is not the medium for that.

No need. Thanks though.

 

[Me Myself]

Well, if we are going to continue to discuss branding (and I know that you did not bring it up this time). deconstructing branding is being aware that we are susceptible to this process, so we must focus on the product and not the brand or make sure that the we are choosing a brand based on product and not name or image alone. as an advertiser would you reach your children to focus on who has a better brand or who has a better product? The point is that while branding does have a real effect, feminism is in part about deconstructing brands. This is not the same as demolishing brands, rather it is about understanding our own socialization and making better choices based on content.

Oh well, maybe I understand you better now. Sure, feminism is about deconstructing brands, but specific brands. It is also about establishing is own brand: equality.

People, if you dont want to talk about this, dont, I am continually telling you you can make a new thread about it if you want.

 

[Me Myself]

No need. Thanks though.

No prob

 

[Curious George]

Again, I would be happy to adress your misconceptions in a relevant thread made by you or by pm messages

I am very willing to educate you on that that I haveeen educated on, but this is not the medium for that.

Well crap. Pretend my post I just made was a pm. Because you are right, the OP clearly states that the thread was not for brand. My apologies for putting you in an awkward situation, and to the OP for derailing the thread.:sorry1:

 

[dust1n]

Make a thread if you wish, you are selling


2persuade someone of the merits of:
he sold the idea of making a film about Tchaikovsky
he could get work but he just won’t sell himself

You are selling the value of equality to the masses.

Oh, I see... the OED (and entirely not sourced) is only viable when you use it.

 

[Me Myself]

Oh, I see... the OED (and entirely not sourced) is only viable when you use it.

It is also viable when you used it. I explained you how the definition in the OED includes my definition. You said you didnt wnt further explanations.

If you have changed your mind you are very welcome to do the thread or reach me by pm

 

[Me Myself]

Well crap. Pretend my post I just made was a pm. Because you are right, the OP clearly states that the thread was not for brand. My apologies for putting you in an awkward situation, and to the OP for derailing the thread.:sorry1:

To be fair I started it

I am just trying to end it now.

Sorry about the problems, but please re send me your post as a pm so I can adress it properly

 

[Alceste]

Ok, thanks for responding. A few thoughts....

There being an equal number of men and women in leadership position politically and economically would be the result of successful campaigning for women's right is a unfortunately a complete and utter myth. There is absolutely no study to back this up at all, in fact, it is a proven fact that more men vie for leadership positions than women. Even if there were the exact same number of men and woman applying for leadership positions, why should it be 50-50? The world is not symmetric, to suggest that 50% of business need to be lead by women or 50% of the Senate must be women is just laughable. The only policies that would lead to that result would be draconian laws curbing freedom to vote for whomever you want and freedom to hire who you want etc. There would need to be complete economic and political central planning. You cannot have both freedom and also insist on 50% of leadership positions held by woman at the same time, you're trying to have your cake and eat it too.

Equal pay for equal work I agree. But women do not do equal work as men some or sometimes all of the time. I don't really want to talk about boring stuff such as work flexibility or maternity, let's talk about more fun things like sports and tennis. Women do NOT do the same work as men in tennis. Men play much longer than women on court and yet feminists still insist on equal prize money. That's not an equal right, that's a SPECIAL right, because they're not doing the SAME work.

Ok, do you think boys should be allowed to enter girls toilets? You cannot have one law for one person and a different law for another. If one person with a penis enters girls toilets, ALL persons with penis should be allowed in, that my friend, is EQUAL rights.

Pakistan are of course a war-torn country, they get droned to shreds, as well as the Taliban having bases there blowing people up left right and centre in its savage war against the Pakistani govt. Pakistan is a nation at war yes.

Here is a map representing the representation of women in politics. Note that in some countries (Scandinavia), women have equal political representation already, while others have very little (dark green). Taking my own country as a case study, we are approaching equal representation. Do keep in mind that when I was born, the number of female MPs and premieres in Canada was very low. There were no female premieres, and there never had been. Now there are six (out of fourteen). When my grandmother was born, it was actually ILLEGAL for women to hold political office at all. They were not legally considered "people". So in two short generations we have gone from ZERO political representation to NEARLY EQUAL political representation. That seems to indicate that when cultural, legal and ideological obstacles to female participation in politics are destroyed, women will VERY rapidly take hold of the opportunity to do so. This implies that where participation is low, legal, cultural or ideological obstacles remain to be destroyed.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...ernment_Participation_by_Women_compressed.jpg

I think you're phoning in the rest of your arguments. They don't address the points I already made, so I'll just reiterate them. Equal pay for equal work is obviously right. It shouldn't be a big deal if a little boy thinks he's a little girl, regardless of where he pees. Pakistan is not at war, and their issues with brutality toward women predate the US drone campaign. Besides, Pakistan is not the only Islamic country with serious issues relating to women's rights, so zeroing in on that single country is a red herring.

 

[Me Myself]

I must say I love how Ecuador is better off than US on this while staying pro life

Even though I have changed my min about the taking of legal measures for such issue.

 

[dust1n]

It is also viable when you used it. I explained you how the definition in the OED includes my definition. You said you didnt wnt further explanations.

If you have changed your mind you are very welcome to do the thread or reach me by pm

Right... and I explained to you that the definition you provided does not fall under the definitions provided by the OED.

You then just said I still had misconceptions and if I wanted to PM you or start a new thread, I could. I did not say I "didn't want further explanations."

 

[Me Myself]

Right... and I explained to you that the definition you provided does not fall under the definitions provided by the OED.

You then just said I still had misconceptions and if I wanted to PM you or start a new thread, I could. I did not say I "didn't want further explanations."

Exactly, you think that my definition is outside of the OED but you dont want those misconceptions cleared either by pm or by another thread and I already told you I wont answer in this thread.

 

[ignition]

Here is a map representing the representation of women in politics. Note that in some countries (Scandinavia), women have equal political representation already, while others have very little (dark green). Taking my own country as a case study, we are approaching equal representation. Do keep in mind that when I was born, the number of female MPs and premieres in Canada was very low. There were no female premieres, and there never had been. Now there are six (out of fourteen). When my grandmother was born, it was actually ILLEGAL for women to hold political office at all. They were not legally considered "people". So in two short generations we have gone from ZERO political representation to NEARLY EQUAL political representation. That seems to indicate that when cultural, legal and ideological obstacles to female participation in politics are destroyed, women will VERY rapidly take hold of the opportunity to do so. This implies that where participation is low, legal, cultural or ideological obstacles remain to be destroyed.


I think you're phoning in the rest of your arguments. They don't address the points I already made, so I'll just reiterate them. Equal pay for equal work is obviously right. It shouldn't be a big deal if a little boy thinks he's a little girl, regardless of where he pees. Pakistan is not at war, and their issues with brutality toward women predate the US drone campaign. Besides, Pakistan is not the only Islamic country with serious issues relating to women's rights, so zeroing in on that single country is a red herring.

But you haven't addressed anything I've said, I was tackling your 50-50 argument, not the fact that being a woman shouldn't be an obstacle, we agree unanimously on that. But what you want is 50-50, you cannot obtain 50-50 without some type of central planning, it's just not going to happen.

No I didn't, but you keep ignoring my argument, should a woman be paid equally for doing LESS work, yes or no? Simple question. Should a man get to spend the same time with his new born baby as a woman, yes or no? Should a man have access to the same flexible work arrangements as women, yes or no? These questions, amongst many others, are relevant when it comes to discerning those who want special rights from those who want equal rights. Yes, but you talked about girls being murdered for going to school, that's a very serious allegation against Islamic countries, so it is better to be specific and say it happens in Pakistan and Afghanistan than to label all Muslim countries as being sharpshooters of girls heading to education.

 

[Me Myself]

I didn't buy feminism, nor have I bought anything regarding feminism. In fact, no money whatsoever has left my wallet regarding feminism, nor have I ever, EVER, been encouraged to do so.

Therefore, feminism is not a product.

Again, anyone wondering about this issue can have their explanations given if they truly care, either by pm or by making a thread about it.

 

[Me Myself]

But you haven't addressed anything I've said, I was tackling your 50-50 argument, not the fact that being a woman shouldn't be an obstacle, we agree unanimously on that. But what you want is 50-50, you cannot obtain 50-50 without some type of central planning, it's just not going to happen.

No I didn't, but you keep ignoring my argument, should a woman be paid equally for doing LESS work, yes or no? Simple question. Should a man get to spend the same time with his new born baby as a woman, yes or no? Should a man have access to the same flexible work arrangements as women, yes or no? These questions, amongst many others, are relevant when it comes to discerning those who want special rights from those who want equal rights. Yes, but you talked about girls being murdered for going to school, that's a very serious allegation against Islamic countries, so it is better to be specific and say it happens in Pakistan and Afghanistan than to label all Muslim countries as being sharpshooters of girls heading to education.

When taking all the thought out factors in consideration I understand there is a gap of around 7% , 2% of which can be of simple "not perfect fifty fifty ever" and five percentage that could be because of gender discrimination or by some other unknown factor.

If you have a source to a study that says that there is ABSOLUTELY NONE unexplained gap between the, trust me I would love to read it!

Pass it up

 

[dust1n]

Exactly, you think that my definition is outside of the OED but you dont want those misconceptions cleared either by pm or by another thread and I already told you I wont answer in this thread.

Okay, then. Then I will leave knowing that I used the OED correctly. Thanks.

 

[Me Myself]

Okay, then. Then I will leave knowing that I used the OED correctly. Thanks.

Yes, we both did. Have a good day sir

 

[Alceste]

But you haven't addressed anything I've said, I was tackling your 50-50 argument, not the fact that being a woman shouldn't be an obstacle, we agree unanimously on that. But what you want is 50-50, you cannot obtain 50-50 without some type of central planning, it's just not going to happen.

No I didn't, but you keep ignoring my argument, should a woman be paid equally for doing LESS work, yes or no? Simple question. Should a man get to spend the same time with his new born baby as a woman, yes or no? Should a man have access to the same flexible work arrangements as women, yes or no? These questions, amongst many others, are relevant when it comes to discerning those who want special rights from those who want equal rights. Yes, but you talked about girls being murdered for going to school, that's a very serious allegation against Islamic countries, so it is better to be specific and say it happens in Pakistan and Afghanistan than to label all Muslim countries as being sharpshooters of girls heading to education.

Please explain to me the central planning that resulted in Scandinavian women achieving equal political representation, or Canada (and Ecuador) fast approaching it.

I never said equal pay for less work. I said equal pay for equal work. And yes, I support equal rights for either gender when it comes to parental leave etc.

As far as Islamic countries are concerned, Wahhabism is prevalent throughout the Arab world, and presents different issues in different countries. Afghanistan and Pakistan have issues with murdering or disfiguring schoolgirls. Iran would rather let them burn to death than escape a fire without their hair covered. Saudi Arabia only recently started to consider whether or not women should be allowed to drive. Egypt has an endemic sexual assault issue. African Islamic nations hack off the clitorises of their female children. Honour killings are prevalent throughout these cultures, and rape victims often can not report their assaults because they may be murdered by the state for doing so.

 

[Curious George]

But you haven't addressed anything I've said, I was tackling your 50-50 argument, not the fact that being a woman shouldn't be an obstacle, we agree unanimously on that. But what you want is 50-50, you cannot obtain 50-50 without some type of central planning, it's just not going to happen.

No I didn't, but you keep ignoring my argument, should a woman be paid equally for doing LESS work, yes or no? Simple question. Should a man get to spend the same time with his new born baby as a woman, yes or no? Should a man have access to the same flexible work arrangements as women, yes or no? These questions, amongst many others, are relevant when it comes to discerning those who want special rights from those who want equal rights. Yes, but you talked about girls being murdered for going to school, that's a very serious allegation against Islamic countries, so it is better to be specific and say it happens in Pakistan and Afghanistan than to label all Muslim countries as being sharpshooters of girls heading to education.

In the u.s. Feminists were instrumental in men acquiring paternity leave.

 

[Alceste]

In the u.s. Feminists were instrumental in men acquiring paternity leave.

Have I already mentioned that you're awesome?

 

[ignition]

Please explain to me the central planning that resulted in Scandinavian women achieving equal political representation, or Canada (and Ecuador) fast approaching it.

I never said equal pay for less work. I said equal pay for equal work. And yes, I support equal rights for either gender when it comes to parental leave etc.

Who gives a **** about Scandinavia? Am I a Scandinavian? I don't care what they do, they can do whatever the hell they want. All I'm asking is, why do you want to force the issue in the US or other countries when they clearly do not have 50-50 representation? My local member of parliament is case in point. We had a man in the same seat for something like 30-40 years. What right does ANYONE have to force a woman in that seat, or look down on us for voting in a man?