Is God's existence necessary?

[prometheus11]

Nope. You're saying it to insult your opponent in spiritual lingo to feel superior and self important. Both of you.

The more amazing thing (than either of you realizing such a simple fact) is that the two of you think others WANT to behave in like you do. Trust me, we don't. Your proselytizing for your own ideas has the opposite effect. You push people away from what you preach.

It's the very definition of cloying, aching pride, and it's disgusting to behold. But it serves as an excellent example of the numbness capable of living for self glorification. Your motives are exactly like Christ's: for the glory set before you.

The difference between me and you is I won't now give you advice. Live in your sickening, revolting hubris all you want to.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

Dah dah......

 

[Rick O'Shez]

I am trying to convey that a mind in the state of duality can never experience enlightenment....

Non-duality is an aspect of enlightenment in some traditions. Right. But what has this got to do with your claim of communion of minds? It's just more side-stepping, changing the subject because you've been caught out in a false claim.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

Most of this stuff isn't even debating/reasoning. It's all attacks on the messengers with opinions rather than substance and focusing on the messages in which people are typing.

Nonsense. People with over-inflated egos are making vague claims of superior knowledge and then getting all evasive and defensive when asked to clarify these claims. And people who challenge them are likened to pigs or told they are narrow-minded fools.

If I want to hear some preaching I'll go to church.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

You are calling your opponents in debate "swine."

Not only evasive but insulting and patronising. Wonderful.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

and what can you substantiate?
the non-existence of God?

I'm not the one pretending to be all superior and making wild claims about mind communion and suchlike. I'm not the one comparing other contributors to pigs.

"Esoteric" my arse!

 

[Robert.Evans]

No, not necessarily. Is your pantheistic God perpetually undergoing change?

He would have to be evolving if everything was God wouldn't he?

 

[Ben Dhyan]

Non-duality is an aspect of enlightenment in some traditions. Right. But what has this got to do with your claim of communion of minds? It's just more side-stepping, changing the subject because you've been caught out in a false claim.

Ok...let's se if we can work through this using a step by step approach....bear with me as we can only progress based on common ground which is yet to be established... So my first question concerns the mind's 'I', do you agree that generally speaking, the 'I' of your mind is what is considered to be you, yes? I mean if you say "I think such and such...", or "I see such and such...". that is you who is thinking or seeing...yes?

 

[Rick O'Shez]

Ok...let's se if we can work through this using a step by step approach....bear with me as we can only progress based on common ground which is yet to be established... So my first question concerns the mind's 'I', do you agree that generally speaking, the 'I' of your mind is what is considered to be you, yes? I mean if you say "I think such and such...", or "I see such and such...". that is you who is thinking or seeing...yes?

I've been doing Buddhist practice for many years and probably understand this non-duality stuff better than you do. And there is plenty of information on non-duality out there for anyone who is interested. In any case I can't see the relevance of non-duality to this discussion.

Either substantiate your claim of mind to mind communion or move on.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

I've been doing Buddhist practice for many years and probably understand this stuff better than you do. In any case it's completely off-topic here. Either substantiate your claim of mind to mind communion or move on.

Your ego mind is so clearly fearful of being exposed as that which prevents union that you are outright refusing to work with me so I can substantiate what I am saying.. If you were not afraid...why would you not proceed methodically to see if what I say can be substantiated or not...what have you got to lose...I am willing..why not you? So once more....do you agree that generally speaking, the 'I' of your mind is what is considered to be you, yes? I mean if you say "I think such and such...", or "I see such and such...". that is you who is thinking or seeing...yes?

 

[Rick O'Shez]

Your ego mind is so clearly fearful of being exposed as that which prevents union that you are outright refusing to work with me so I can substantiate what I am saying..

Nonsense, I've been working with this stuff for many years in a Buddhist context and your fumbling attempts to explain it are just a distraction. If people are interested in finding out about non-duality there is plenty of good material out there to look at.

So, can you substantiate your claim of mind-to-mind communion or not? If you can't just say so and we can move on.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

Nonsense, I've been working with this stuff for many years in a Buddhist context and your fumbling attempts to explain it are just a distraction. If people are interested in finding out about non-duality there is plenty of good material out there to look at.

So, can you substantiate your claim of mind-to-mind communion or not? If you can't just say so and we can move on.

How many times have I tried and you refuse to cooperate.....you have no intention of cooperating because you know it will lead to your exposure of having no serious understanding of union and are but a pearl trampling disbeliever... I shall not waste anymore time on you....squeal all you like...

 

[Rick O'Shez]

I shall not waste anymore time on you....squeal all you like...

That's comes as a relief actually.
So you can't substantiate your wild claims of mind-to-mind communion, that comes as no surprise.

So charming that you refer to your fellow contributors as pigs. It's called being "ultra-spiritual" I believe.

 

[prometheus11]

You know it's such a fantastic posting method. Claim to know more than your opponents with no way to verify it. Claim everybody has to work hard and get some revelation to know as much as you do. Then call all your opponents dirty animals. How smart, appropriate, mature, and spiritual.

 

[Rick O'Shez]

You know it's such a fantastic posting method. Claim to know more than your opponents with no way to verify it. Claim everybody has to work hard and get some revelation to know as much as you do. Then call all your opponents dirty animals. How smart, appropriate, mature, and spiritual.

Indeed, and such behaviour is exactly the opposite you'd expect from somebody with authentic insight.

 

[MARCELLO]

God does not ( may not,cannot,should not ) exist. The meaning of the verb is only true for us.

 

[Thief]

Pearls are wisdom and swine is the animal natured mindset/ego.
Pigs represent the lower mind in us that likes to wrestle in the mud. No worries, we all have been there. The human beings are not swine, the current state of their mind is. The swine minded aren't self aware of what they do.

If wisdom is given to someone, and they attack the messenger and don't listen to the message.... it's actually more wise that the messenger just didn't give the message. Some things are better kept to oneself. . saves the trampling. A wise one will realize they bring it upon themselves. There is a time to speak and a time to remain quiet, and there is always a more positive way to speak when speaking.

Most of this stuff isn't even debating/reasoning. It's all attacks on the messengers with opinions rather than substance and focusing on the messages in which people are typing.

I like the notion of discretion...I come from a bad neighborhood.

but.....the Carpenter didn't cut anyone any slack.
you might have noticed.....when that one women came asking for the life of her child be spared.....
It is not good to give the bread of the children unto dogs.....

It was only for the quick retort on her part....
Even the dogs have scrap from the table of the children.....
THEN the Carpenter relented and gave favor.

Wisdom is dealt to all.
The parable of the Sower demonstrates.
withholding is not allowed among the servants.
we deal unto all.
They who stand in resentment know what they have heard.

if they rail against you.....all you can do is move on.
(in bad neighborhoods....retreat may be a quick item)

 

[Thief]

Indeed, and such behaviour is exactly the opposite you'd expect from somebody with authentic insight.

and the Carpenter looked the Pharisees in the eye when He spoke.....
Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.

and the Pharisees sought to have Him dead.....from that hour forward.

 

[Unification]

Nonsense. People with over-inflated egos are making vague claims of superior knowledge and then getting all evasive and defensive when asked to clarify these claims. And people who challenge them are likened to pigs or told they are narrow-minded fools.

If I want to hear some preaching I'll go to church.

Doesn't make that nonsense, you just added a different element of sense to it.

Likening someone to pigs is likening someone to having over-inflated ego's, as that's what the pig represents.

Challenging the message is great. Clarification is fickle, people see and hear what they're ready for and want to see and hear.

I personally see a big difference between having "superior knowledge" of something and "knowing oneself."

Who doesn't evade and defend? You've said "God's" existence isn't necessary with no substantiated clarification. No clarification of what you abstractly think "God" is and no clarification on why you think it's not necessary.

 

[Unification]

I like the notion of discretion...I come from a bad neighborhood.

but.....the Carpenter didn't cut anyone any slack.
you might have noticed.....when that one women came asking for the life of her child be spared.....
It is not good to give the bread of the children unto dogs.....

It was only for the quick retort on her part....
Even the dogs have scrap from the table of the children.....
THEN the Carpenter relented and gave favor.

Wisdom is dealt to all.
The parable of the Sower demonstrates.
withholding is not allowed among the servants.
we deal unto all.
They who stand in resentment know what they have heard.

if they rail against you.....all you can do is move on.
(in bad neighborhoods....retreat may be a quick item)

Agree, it rains wisdom on the just and unjust.

If wisdom is given and the messenger is attacked, move on. If wisdom is given again to the same person and the messenger is attacked again, the messenger brings the trampling upon themselves.

I may see that differently than you, such as the woman representing the mind and the child being a seed within the mind, and the "Carpenter" being within the human doing the molding and emerging and watering of the seeds within one.