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Is it true the Kabbha was a Hindu temple?

Surya Deva

Well-Known Member
Well,

As Hacyon has revealed above, he did not write the Quran, he was illiterate so he spoke the Quran and his followers would write it for him. Now how did he reveal the Quran? Apparently he had what looked like epilectic fits(his followers would cover him with a cloth) and they became revelations(although I don't think all his revelations were fits) and he progressively revealed the Quran on what he said. What was curious about his revelations, they tended to be about what happening in his life at the time. When he commited adultery against his wife and she got upset, he felt guilty and then he had a revelation to the effect of at the top of my head "You should not feel guilty, she was wrong"

When his follower Abdulla and his troupe on a mission to spy on caravan passing by, Abdulla apprehended them, killed the men and captured their loot, but one escaped and sounded the alarm. This killing took place in the holy of month of the Arabs and when news spread Mohammed and his followers were held in contempt. Mohammed distanced himself from the act and reprimanded Abdulla, and demoted him and claimed that he would not take his share of the loot, despite being entitled to a third of it according to his previous revelation. A few days later Mohammed had another revelation saying it was OK what Abdulla had done and for Mohammed to take his share. So Mohammed reinstated Abdulla and took his share.

One could also see the life and times of Mohammed reflected in the Quran. When he was in Mecca and his followers were weak, his revelations were about keeping peace with the Meccans. When his followering were strong enough to lay seige on Mecca his revelations were "slay all"

Another very interesting story. I will quote from Wiki:

According to Baidawi in Tafsir “Anwar al-Tanzil wa Asrar al-Ta'wil”, Muhammad dictated verses starting at (Qur'an 23:12) that says;
"We created man of an extraction of clay" and when Muhammad reached the part that says, "... thereafter We produced him as another creature (23:14)", Abdullah said, "So blessed be God the fairest of creators!" in amazement at the details of man's creation.
The prophet said, "Write it down; for thus it has been revealed." Abdullah doubted and said, "If Muhammad is truthful then I receive the revelation as much as he does, and if he is a liar, what I said is a good as what he said." After this incident, Abdullah repudiated Islam, left Medina and went to Mecca, spreading his belief that Muhammad composed the Qur'an himself without divine intervention.
Following the conquest of Mecca in 629 CE, Muhammad ordered that Abdullah should be executed but Uthman protected him. When conditions calmed, he was presented to Muhammad seeking pardon and offering the oath of loyalty. However, Muhammad withheld his hand and maintained silence. Uthman begged him to pardon Abdullah and on the third attempt Muhammad accepted Abdullah's oath of loyalty, effectively pardoning him.
Nevertheless, as soon as Abdullah had left, Muhammad turned to the Muslims who were in the room and asked: “Was not there a wise man among you who would stand up to him when he saw that I had withheld my hand from accepting his allegiance, and kill him?” The companions, aghast, responded: “We did not know what you had in your heart, Apostle of Allah! Why did you not give us a signal with your eye?” Muhammad said: “It is not advisable, for a Prophet to play deceptive tricks with the eyes.”

The Meccan accused Mohammed of fabricating verses. They invited him to debates to argue his claims, when Mohammed failed to convince, he had revelations to not participate in any debates. When Mohammed threatened the Meccans of divine retribution for their insolence, they told him to bring about a rain of hellfire on them and prove it. Mohammed then had another revelation that hellfire will only come at an appointed time.

When Mohammed challenged the Meccans to produce revelations like him. Al Nadar(a meccan) accepted and produced revelations much better than him, which apparently really angered Mohammed. When Mohammed laid seige on Mecca, he had Al-Nadar executed in front of him.

So as you can see, not very impressive....
 
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Surya Deva

Well-Known Member
This is not rewritten history; this is history. I am not slandering anyone, I am simply answering a valid question by a member and citing history. If that sounds like slander to you, then that's your problem, not mine. The truth .lava, non-mulims are not obliged to see Mohammed like Muslims see him. They will ask questions and criticise as much as they would with any historical figure, nobody is exempt. I wouldn't mind if you questioned or criticised any Hindu historical figures... in fact go right ahead(in another thread though) in fact earlier on Muslims were doing just that with Rama and Krishna.
 
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.lava

Veteran Member
This is not rewritten history; this is history. I am not slandering anyone, I am simply answering a valid question by a member and citing history. If that sounds like slander to you, then that's your problem, not mine. The truth .lava, non-mulims are not obliged to see Mohammed like Muslims see him. They will ask questions and criticise as much as they would with any historical figure, nobody is exempt. I wouldn't mind if you questioned or criticised any Hindu historical figures... in fact go right ahead(in another thread though) in fact earlier on Muslims were doing just that with Rama and Krishna.

not accepting him is not equal telling lies about him. things you say about history does not match history as it happened.


.
 

Surya Deva

Well-Known Member
Lava, this is all recorded in Muslim sources themselves. I am sorry .Lava but Mohammed wasn't a very good man according to those sources . I can see you have a problem with the history, and I am sure like me and many other reading that about him, you too are not very impressed with Mohammed as he is shown. However, while you have the option of not believing it, or reinterpreting it because your believe he is perfect and great, I and others who are not Muslims do not have that option and have no compulsion to take it.
 
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Gharib

I want Khilafah back
Lava, this is all recorded in Muslim sources themselves. I am sorry .Lava but Mohammed wasn't a very good man according to those sources . I can see you have a problem with the history, and I am sure like me and many other reading that about him, you too are not very impressed with Mohammed as he is shown. However, while you have the option of not believing it, or reinterpreting it because your believe he is perfect and great, I and others who are not Muslims do not have that option and have no compulsion to take it.

by whom is he shown that way, who has decribed him as a bad man please share your resources with the rest of us. every story has two sides and i think you find it easier to believe the wrong (false) side than the true (real) side. tell me this who am i to believe about your religion a non hindu ar a hindu, which of them would be telling the truth and which of them would be telling lies
 

syringa28

New Member
by whom is he shown that way, who has decribed him as a bad man please share your resources with the rest of us. every story has two sides and i think you find it easier to believe the wrong (false) side than the true (real) side. tell me this who am i to believe about your religion a non hindu ar a hindu, which of them would be telling the truth and which of them would be telling lies

Yup, I agree with you. We just hold what we think the real and the truth. What I see, I can't find the truth in another religion. Like Hindu, why do you worship the statue even the statue even can't move and moreover the statue has been created by your own hand.
 

Gharib

I want Khilafah back
Yup, I agree with you. We just hold what we think the real and the truth. What I see, I can't find the truth in another religion. Like Hindu, why do you worship the statue even the statue even can't move and moreover the statue has been created by your own hand.

dear friend instead of allowing someone else to say this to you i think it's better if i said it. go to this forum if you want to know why hindus worship the idols
Hinduism: ask your question. i personally am not a hindu, i'm a muslim but if you have any questions to ask about the hindu religion i think it is best to do it there.

all the best wishesh.
 

syringa28

New Member
dear friend instead of allowing someone else to say this to you i think it's better if i said it. go to this forum if you want to know why hindus worship the idols
Hinduism: ask your question. i personally am not a hindu, i'm a muslim but if you have any questions to ask about the hindu religion i think it is best to do it there.

all the best wishesh.

Ok, it's ok..thanks a lot, eselam.
 

K.Venugopal

Immobile Wanderer
Simply, what can I explain, I proclaim that I bear witness that Allah is the only God. If there is two God or more, it can be equal as a ship with two captain and the ship will sink. Even a husband and a wife has fought to guide a family, so do if God is two or more. If there is two God, this universe simply collapse because of different thought, grip and many more.

I bear Mohammad is the last prophet as Mohammad is the one who bring the right thought; Islam. Islam is the way of life. Everything decided by Islam; Islam rules and etc; are the guide for human to own a better life. But, a Muslim also has been examined by Allah with many obstacles to know how strong they are, how strong their belief. And the heaven is the immortal reward.
You say, "I bear witness that Allah is the only God and Mohammad is his last prophet." Can you explain how you became a witness to the phenomenon of Allah being the only God and Mohammad being his last prophet?
 

Gharib

I want Khilafah back
You say, "I bear witness that Allah is the only God and Mohammad is his last prophet." Can you explain how you became a witness to the phenomenon of Allah being the only God and Mohammad being his last prophet?

dear friend i hope you do not mind if i answer this question for you for i too have bear witnessed that.

first of all i do tend to offend people a lot unintenitonaly or end up making a rude statement so please i ask in advance forgive me if i do that.

i have bear witnessed that Allah is the only god because of the Kur'an, the Kur'an is Allah's word and everything in it is true. i say that Allah is the only god because nothing is equal to him in any way. if you look around then you will se that everything exists because of him, he knows the future and he knows the past. in the Kur'an there are many verses that tell us of our future and of our past. it says that there will come a time when there will be no more water and do you see what is happening ( now please do not start with global warming it proves nothing). then there are the small signs of judgment day. ( don't say that Muhammed (saws) has come up with them he isn't god and therefore doesn't know the future he may now some things about our future because afterall he is the messenger of Allah).
the small signs of judgment day are these: men will become like women and women will become like men ( i'm reffering to homosexuals). the earth will become dry. then there are others yet to come such as muslims ruling this world, and many others ( i hope thats enough reasons why i have bear witnessed that the is no god but Allah)

then i also have witnessed that Muhammed (saws) is the last mesenger of Allah. Muhammed is the last prophet because there are no others, if there are any why haven't i heard of them.. where are they. He was a man of honnor and a man of words (always spoke the truth), he had no reason to lie and make a new religion ( if you say he did then please tell us what was his reason) and i also witness that he is the last prophet because Allah says so in the Kur'an.

now if you dessagre with me then tell me this
"Can you explain how you became to not witness the phenomenon of Allah being the only God and Mohammad being his last prophet"
 

anders

Well-Known Member
I'm an atheist, so I have no stakes in the fight for which religion can claim to be originator of the Ka'ba. But from my outsider's view, I'm fairly convinced that there wasn't even a Hindu near it when it was built. Sorry, people, not Adam or Noah either. There is no Shiv ling there. Not all stones are lingams.
 

Surya Deva

Well-Known Member
Anders,

With all due respect I think you are biased to the notion that Arabia was based on the Semitic tradition, when the evidence I have cited for you recently clearly indicates Hindu influence is very strong.

I do think it is dogmatic to claim that Hindu had no influnence over or did not migrate to the west. The historical evidence completely refutes that.
 

Gharib

I want Khilafah back
hey suraj can you reply to my questions that i have made to you in page 11 of this thread
 

anders

Well-Known Member
Anders,

With all due respect I think you are biased to the notion that Arabia was based on the Semitic tradition, when the evidence I have cited for you recently clearly indicates Hindu influence is very strong.

I do think it is dogmatic to claim that Hindu had no influnence over or did not migrate to the west. The historical evidence completely refutes that.
I am sufficiently biased in favour of Indian culture. My favourite historic period is the amazing Indus-Saravati culture. India, past and present, is marvellous enough that it hasn't any need for unproven assertations and general silliness. I have studied Indian languages for some two years and counting, and travelled the country for so far four months. In Religious studies, I'm specializing in South Asia. I have only studied Arabic for one year, and never set foot in the Middle East. How's that for bias?

You say you have provided evidence. You should look up that word, along with 'proof', in a dictionary. I have only found unfounded views and assertations. I would be quite happy if you found something concrete, not only hot air, to back you up.

And before you try the Mitanni treaty, let me tell you that the mentioning of a few Indo-Iranian gods doesn't prove that an Indian religion was practiced in Anatolia. Perhaps they were mentioned to suit one of the treaty parties, or it might have been influence from Zoroastrism.
 

.lava

Veteran Member
You say, "I bear witness that Allah is the only God and Mohammad is his last prophet." Can you explain how you became a witness to the phenomenon of Allah being the only God and Mohammad being his last prophet?

you can witness things. there is a level in Islam named Ul'ul ElBab which means 'owner of secrets. but of course one could not get there just like that. first you should wish to reach God, that would be first taqwa and after you make that wish God takes control of your life. you witness how it works and you'd be sure it could only be done by God. please don't ask me my experience. everyone has unique path. that is something between you and your Rab. if you did not ask God, then you can't blame anyone for not having an answer. yes, you can ask God personally. an answer like that comes from God, not from weak people like ourselves. so let me know in case you sincerely want to know if Mohammad (PBUH) was his messenger and last of Prophets and i'd give you recipe of one single salaat.

.
 

.lava

Veteran Member
I do think it is dogmatic to claim that Hindu had no influnence over or did not migrate to the west. The historical evidence completely refutes that.

that is unavoidable. there were and there still are people even religious leaders who's inspired by demonic sources. their wicked knowledge can never damage religion of God. it damages societies and invites people to paths with deadlines.

.
 
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