Is MAGA-ism a Religion?

[Kenny]

Otherwise known as "those who can look at it objectively, rather than through the lens of their indoctrination".

Except I received Jesus at 28 which means I looked at it objectively

 

[ratiocinator]

Except I received Jesus at 28 which means I looked at it objectively

This is a joke, yes?

"The way to see by faith is to shut the eye of reason." -- Benjamin Franklin

The first time I read the bible, cover to cover, it was the beginning of the end of my faith, because what I'd been told, just didn't match what I read.

 

[Kenny]

Well, if God thought they were so bad they deserved genocide (even the infants and those evil cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys), why would it then reward them with heaven? Wouldn't exactly be consistent......... oh, right! That fits perfectly with the biblical God, inconsistent, almost like it has dissociative identity disorder.t

Yes, mankind always wants to decide what is what without context or any other possibility. I’m glad that at least you ae in the know

Well, looking at this site, I can see no justification for total genocide. In fact, I can see no justification for total genocide, full stop.

Who Were the Amalekites and Why Were They Enemies of Israel?

The Israelites had many enemies. But what made the Amalekites especially brutal enemies?

www.christianity.com

WOW - you really worked hard! I hope I didn’t exhaust your fingers.

And whatever happened to (for example) Matthew 5:43-48 NIV:

43 “You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ 44 But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, 45 that you may be children of your Father in heaven. He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. 46 If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Are not even the tax collectors doing that? 47 And if you greet only your own people, what are you doing more than others? Do not even pagans do that? 48 Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect.​

Yes… what about it? Jesus is still interceding for the world

Romans 8:34
Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

 

[ratiocinator]

WOW - you really worked hard! I hope I didn’t exhaust your fingers.

As I said before, I can see no excuse for genocide no matter what. There is literally nothing I could find out about them that would lead me to the conclusion that the entire population, and its livestock, should be slaughtered. And, as has been pointed out elsewhere, the Amalekites may well be entirely fictional.

Did the Amalekites ever exist?

In another thread Amalekites were described referring to Biblical references. I consider this site describing the Amalekites more than a bit touched with the Created history of Exodus and Joshua. I will question whether the Amalekites ever existed outside the accounts in the Pentateuch. I have...

www.religiousforums.com

Yes… what about it?

It's a blindingly obvious contradiction. The description of what it's like to "Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect", is pretty much are far away from being genocidal as it's possible to get.

Jesus is still interceding for the world

Romans 8:34
Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

What on earth do you think that's got to do with it?

 

[Kenny]

This is a joke, yes?

"The way to see by faith is to shut the eye of reason." -- Benjamin Franklin

The first time I read the bible, cover to cover, it was the beginning of the end of my faith, because what I'd been told, just didn't match what I read.

So, your took a statement and determined that there are no other viewpoints?

in other words, you “reasoned away” your faith

It is saying that if faith is going to work in your life, you can’t stay in your reasoning. It has nothing to do with not using reason to understand that it is saying. I can reason why faith is a greater force than reason

 

[Kenny]

As I said before, I can see no excuse for genocide no matter what. There is literally nothing I could find out about them that would lead me to the conclusion that the entire population, and its livestock, should be slaughtered. And, as has been pointed out elsewhere, the Amalekites may well be entirely fictional.

So, you are convinced in your mind no matter what the evidence is. With your thinking, you wouldn’t have dropped the atomic bomb and had the war continue with people who had no problem with the rape of Nanking or the slaughter of the Jews.

Did the Amalekites ever exist?

In another thread Amalekites were described referring to Biblical references. I consider this site describing the Amalekites more than a bit touched with the Created history of Exodus and Joshua. I will question whether the Amalekites ever existed outside the accounts in the Pentateuch. I have...

www.religiousforums.com

Yes… you will find sites that can say about anything including

The Flat Earth Society

Welcome to The Flat Earth Society, home of the flat earth forums and the largest library of Flat Earth Society journals, newsletters, interviews, and books.

theflatearthsociety.org

Does that make it true?

It's a blindingly obvious contradiction. The description of what it's like to "Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly Father is perfect", is pretty much are far away from being genocidal as it's possible to get.

That’s because you don’t know the word of God. If you are made in His image, you are perfect - so we are born again into His image and our spirit is perfect even as the Father is perfect.

Has nothing to do with your flat-earth position of Him being genocidal.

What on earth do you think that's got to do with it?

He is praying and living the Matthew verses

 

[ratiocinator]

So, your took a statement and determined that there are no other viewpoints?

I said reading the bible for the first time was the beginning of the end, I read it again. Thought long and hard about it. In the end, my circumstances were such that I took a step back for a while, and it was then I finally decided that it was just self-contradictory and absurd.

I doubt I've never made a better choice in my life.

in other words, you “reasoned away” your faith

And proud of it. I'd been sucked into religion as a very young teen, largely because I wanted it to be true to fit in. That's obvious with hindsight. Most people never escape, which is sad.

It is saying that if faith is going to work in your life, you can’t stay in your reasoning.

Faith just isn't reasonable, and belief in the bible as a literal message from a God is absurd (unless God really has got dissociative identity disorder). It's too riddled with contradictions.

I can reason why faith is a greater force than reason

Oh, I have little doubt it's a greater force for many people, but so are other failures to reason and look at things objectively. Thinking clearly and logically is hard. It's a skill you have to learn, and nobody succeeds all the time. Blind faith is easy, as are other cognitive biases. The brain loves a good narrative, and jumping to quick, simple 'solutions'. Habits of thought, especially ones like religious faith, are incredibly difficult to get yourself out of, especially after you've built a lot of your life around them. I was lucky enough to see the problems while I was still young enough to change and admit I was wrong.

 

[ratiocinator]

So, you are convinced in your mind no matter what the evidence is.

It's not a matter of evidence, it's a matter of morality. Genocide cannot be justified.

With your thinking, you wouldn’t have dropped the atomic bomb and had the war continue with people who had no problem with the rape of Nanking or the slaughter of the Jews.

That wasn't genocide, and was a choice made by people with limited abilities and options. An almighty God has no such excuse.

Yes… you will find sites that can say about anything including

And...? Wiki is pretty accurate most of the time. But please do feel free to bring forward a credible source for actual evidence for the Amalekites actually being historical. It hardly matters to my points here, but you could post it on the other thread.

ETA: Did you even follow the link? It's to a thread on this forum, I posted a link to wiki on it, I wasn't the one to start it. I had no idea about the debate - not my field.

That’s because you don’t know the word of God. If you are made in His image, you are perfect - so we are born again into His image and our spirit is perfect even as the Father is perfect.

Good grief, I could have done better than that when I was a Christian, and only a teenager. Irrelevant, meaningless platitudes.

He is praying and living the Matthew verses

And....?

 

[Magic Man]

Except I received Jesus at 28 which means I looked at it objectively

No, it doesn't. If you had looked at it objectively, you wouldn't have ended up believing in Christianity.

 

[Kenny]

I said reading the bible for the first time was the beginning of the end, I read it again. Thought long and hard about it. In the end, my circumstances were such that I took a step back for a while, and it was then I finally decided that it was just self-contradictory and absurd.

I doubt I've never made a better choice in my life.

I have no problem with that. We both look at the same material and come to different conclusions. God honors our will.

And proud of it. I'd been sucked into religion as a very young teen, largely because I wanted it to be true to fit in. That's obvious with hindsight. Most people never escape, which is sad.

Maybe the difference is that you approached it as a religion and I approach it as a relashionship.

Faith just isn't reasonable, and belief in the bible as a literal message from a God is absurd (unless God really has got dissociative identity disorder). It's too riddled with contradictions.

And I find harmony.

Oh, I have little doubt it's a greater force for many people, but so are other failures to reason and look at things objectively. Thinking clearly and logically is hard. It's a skill you have to learn, and nobody succeeds all the time. Blind faith is easy, as are other cognitive biases. The brain loves a good narrative, and jumping to quick, simple 'solutions'. Habits of thought, especially ones like religious faith, are incredibly difficult to get yourself out of, especially after you've built a lot of your life around them. I was lucky enough to see the problems while I was still young enough to change and admit I was wrong.

Yes, if it is blind faith. I found it to be opened eyed faith using my intellect to build my faith.

But, if you are happy with where you are at, then go for it. Jesus said He came for the sick and not the healthy. I happened to have been sick in my thinking and living and found His healing power that gave me new life. But please look at my signature

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I'm a woke maga most certainly.

I don't know which way to point my pitchfork!!!

 

[SkepticThinker]

I'm not an American but I have been to the US.

I think the Americans tend to worship rich people. The MAGA movement isn't unique. It doesn't matter if they are worshipping rich politicians or Hollywood stars or what. It can be worshipping Trump, the next Democratic candidate, the Kardashians, Elon Musk, or anyone else. This is also a cult behavior from the losing side when Trump became the president.

View attachment 94557

Can you explain how a photo of someone making a face is an example of "cult behaviour from the losing side" .. ?

 

[SkepticThinker]

So, your took a statement and determined that there are no other viewpoints?

in other words, you “reasoned away” your faith

It is saying that if faith is going to work in your life, you can’t stay in your reasoning. It has nothing to do with not using reason to understand that it is saying. I can reason why faith is a greater force than reason

So, throw away your reason and just go with faith?
Eesh, that's some pretty terrible advice, if you ask me.

 

[Kenny]

So, throw away your reason and just go with faith?
Eesh, that's some pretty terrible advice, if you ask me.

This is what I mean when I say “don’t respond with outlandish replies”. Show me where I said “throw out your reason”! And then you accuse me of “coping out”?

No… show me where I said that and if you can’t find it don’t accuse me of ”coping out”

 

[SkepticThinker]

This is what I mean when I say “don’t respond with outlandish replies”. Show me where I said “throw out your reason”! And then you accuse me of “coping out”?

Which is just another cop out response.

What's outlandish about what I said in relation to what you said? Point it out or something. Explain yourself.

No… show me where I said that and if you can’t find it don’t accuse me of ”coping out”

It's in your post that I was responding to. That I quoted.


"in other words, you “reasoned away” your faith

It is saying that if faith is going to work in your life, you can’t stay in your reasoning. It has nothing to do with not using reason to understand that it is saying. I can reason why faith is a greater force than reason"

 

[Kenny]

Which is just another cop out response.

What's outlandish about what I said in relation to what you said? Point it out or something. Explain yourself.

It's in your post that I was responding to. That I quoted.


"in other words, you “reasoned away” your faith

It is saying that if faith is going to work in your life, you can’t stay in your reasoning. It has nothing to do with not using reason to understand that it is saying. I can reason why faith is a greater force than reason"

So there you have it! I didn’t say “throw it out” but rather faith is a greater force

I’ve explained before but I realize when someone really doesn’t care what you respond… I don’t waste my time.

It is saying that if faith is going to work in your life, you can’t stay in your reasoning. It has nothing to do with not using reason to understand that it is saying. I can reason why faith is a greater force than reason

So, don’t cherry pick your highlights and read into it what isn’t there.

 

[Soandso]

This is also a cult behavior from the losing side when Trump became the president.

Ah yes, the one screaming lady from almost a decade ago when Hillary lost against Trump. Let's see how MAGA responds when Trump lost to Biden

Oh God...

 

[SkepticThinker]

So there you have it! I didn’t say “throw it out” but rather faith is a greater force

if faith is going to work in your life, you can’t stay in your reasoning. I

Did you?

How? Why? Just stating that faith is a greater force than reasoning doesn't make it so. It also flies in the face of reality.

So, don’t cherry pick your highlights and read into it what isn’t there.

I've cherry picked nothing. What I did, was respond to what you said in your post.

And as usual, instead of responding on topic, you attack my integrity instead. This is your M.O. with me.

 

[Kenny]

if faith is going to work in your life, you can’t stay in your reasoning. I

Did you?

How? Why? Just stating that faith is a greater force than reasoning doesn't make it so. It also flies in the face of reality.

I've cherry picked nothing. What I did, was respond to what you said in your post.

And as usual, instead of responding on topic, you attack my integrity instead. This is your M.O. with me.

You cherry picked and inserted your thinking. As usual, you resort to insults.

But to answer your question:


reasoned; reasoning ˈrēz-niŋ
ˈrē-zᵊn-iŋ
intransitive verb
1
: to use the faculty of reason so as to arrive at conclusions

One can use their reason to understand and conclude that faith is a higher power than just reason. Understanding that reality or truth, reasoning, when pushed to its limits, will help you achieve the faith where simple reasoning would say to be impossible. As I said, you don’t throw out reasoning, you use it achieve faith. Once you are in faith, you can’t stay in the simple reasoning of “impossibilities”.

 

[ratiocinator]

One can use their reason to understand and conclude that faith is a higher power than just reason.

Go ahead then, let's see the actual reasoning.......