Is multiculturalism a good or a bad thing ?

[Massimo2002]

Multiculturalism is inevitable. I say that because of multiracial/biracial relationships.

I know but I still don't like it anyway.

 

[We Never Know]

I know but I still don't like it anyway.

There are many things I don't like but its life.

 

[Massimo2002]

There are many things I don't like but its life.

Indeed.

 

[sun rise]

As a personal example, we've had a next door neighbor for decades. She just turned 85 and her extended family threw a surprise birthday party for her. We were invited and went. They are from India by way of Fiji. My wife commented that Indian women's clothing was MUCH nicer than typical American women's tends to be. I did not think to take a picture but found this which is the standard quite a few women met

We had tasty "real" Indian food, listened to a mash-up of Indian and Western music and soaked up the multicultural atmosphere. People from monocultures or areas where the standard culture vastly overwhelms others don't realize how much fun it is to experience the richness of diversity.

 

[We Never Know]

As a personal example, we've had a next door neighbor for decades. She just turned 85 and her extended family threw a surprise birthday party for her. We were invited and went. They are from India by way of Fiji. My wife commented that Indian women's clothing was MUCH nicer than typical American women's tends to be. I did not think to take a picture but found this which is the standard quite a few women met

We had tasty "real" Indian food, listened to a mash-up of Indian and Western music and soaked up the multicultural atmosphere. People from monocultures or areas where the standard culture vastly overwhelms others don't realize how much fun it is to experience the richness of diversity.

In those countries that's real gold they always wear.
Here only Mr T and rappers wear that much gold.

 

[Audie]

Well, if you're saying that overshoot is a real problem, created by humans, then we're agreed.

In the main if not the details.

 

[Hermit Philosopher]

I think homogeneity as an end goal can be just as destructive as purity as an end goal.

There needs to be a proper balance or harmony as well where cultures and races are dutifully preserved, but not alienated as well.

Hmm… "dutifully preserved".
Ancestral duty, or what do you mean by this?

Civilisations change; alway have done and shall continue to do so, whether certain individuals like it or not. Sure, change is quicker now than historically speaking which is why individuals experience and must accustom to more changes in a lifetime. But this idea of “multiculture” wrongly insinuates that there is anything other than precisely that to start with. There has never in practice been such things a “pure” cultures (to “dutifully preserve”).

Humbly,
Hermit

 

[danieldemol]

In this century weather we like it or not the world has become more multicultural and connected but I don't think that this is a good thing because too many different races and cultures in a small space creates tension and some of these immigrants don't assimilate into the Broder culture of the host country. But they bring with them more work which boosts the economy which is a good thing.

I think it's generally a good thing, however I'm constantly reminded of the tolerance paradox in my view;

Paradox of tolerance - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[icehorse]

Okay, that makes a lot more sense - you were not talking about religion in general, but specific cases of cultural hegemony that can occur regardless of whether or not the label "religion" is slapped on things or not. Attempts to strongarm cultural hegemony happen more because a small fraction of individuals in a society can't play nice with others. They never succeed, because diversity is more or less baked into the universe itself, but that doesn't stop the tiny fraction from obsessing over their power and control fantasies in vain.

Hundreds of millions of people want to spread theocracy. Hundreds of millions of people want to propagate religiously based misogyny and/or homophobia. This is not a small fraction.

As a personal example, we've had a next door neighbor for decades. She just turned 85 and her extended family threw a surprise birthday party for her. We were invited and went. They are from India by way of Fiji. My wife commented that Indian women's clothing was MUCH nicer than typical American women's tends to be. I did not think to take a picture but found this which is the standard quite a few women met

We had tasty "real" Indian food, listened to a mash-up of Indian and Western music and soaked up the multicultural atmosphere. People from monocultures or areas where the standard culture vastly overwhelms others don't realize how much fun it is to experience the richness of diversity.

And this is awesome and wonderful. Because I would say you all had shared, core values.

If multiculturalism is bad news, then maybe all people here not of Amerindian descent should pack up leave and go to where they came from.

But all of the tribes Europeans encountered when they got to the Americas were also living on land they took from other tribes. EVERYONE on the planet is living on stolen land.

==

Zooming out, I have a question: It seems we're all supportive of blending cultures in peaceful ways, through cuisine, and fashion, and music and such, correct? So what's up with the cries of "cultural appropriation"?

 

[Twilight Hue]

Hmm… "dutifully preserved".
Ancestral duty, or what do you mean by this?

Civilisations change; alway have done and shall continue to do so, whether certain individuals like it or not. Sure, change is quicker now than historically speaking which is why individuals experience and must accustom to more changes in a lifetime. But this idea of “multiculture” wrongly insinuates that there is anything other than precisely that to start with. There has never in practice been such things a “pure” cultures (to “dutifully preserve”).

Humbly,
Hermit

It's important to preserve culture not only for hindsight but for foresight as well.

 

[Hermit Philosopher]

It's important to preserve culture not only for hindsight but for foresight as well.

Have you an example of when that’s been achieved @Twilight Hue?
Also; how was the example you give achieved? And; what about its achievement would you say is the bit of “importance”? Anything in particular?

Humbly,
Hermit

 

[Twilight Hue]

Have you an example of when that’s been achieved @Twilight Hue?
Also; how was the example you give achieved? And; what about its achievement would you say is the bit of “importance”? Anything in particular?

Humbly,
Hermit

I'll go Godwin.

Nazi philosophy and those combating it.

Without insight into the minds of evil and good men and women it suffices to say things have a habit of repeating itself as people who don't study preserved history and traditions won't recognize the warning signs.

Also Native American Identity is incredibly important as we see what the forced loss of culture and tradition has done to the nation's.
There's literally a massive wall of text I could write about it.

 

[Hermit Philosopher]

I'll go Godwin.

Nazi philosophy and those combating it.

Without insight into the minds of evil and good men and women it suffices to say things have a habit of repeating itself as people who don't study preserved history and traditions won't recognize the warning signs.

Also Native American Identity is incredibly important as we see what the forced loss of culture and tradition has done to the nation's.
There's literally a massive wall of text I could write about it.

Could you have misread my questions, because your reply addresses non of them.

I’ll break them down:
a) Have you an example of a “non-multi” culture?
b) Have you an example of a “non-multi” culture that has been “preserved”?
c) If so, how was that culture successfully “preserved” as “non-multi”?
d) Finally; what about that culture having successfully been “preserved” as “non-multi” would you say is the bit of “importance”?

Humbly,
Hermit

 

[Twilight Hue]

Could you have misread my questions, because your reply addresses non of them.

I’ll break them down:
a) Have you an example of a “non-multi” culture?
b) Have you an example of a “non-multi” culture that has been “preserved”?
c) If so, how was that culture successfully “preserved” as “non-multi”?
d) Finally; what about that culture having successfully been “preserved” as “non-multi” would you say is the bit of “importance”?

Humbly,
Hermit

Yes. The Sentinelese people come to mind as a non multi-culture group with their traditions and customs unaltered.

It remains a protected people for both health reasons and their cultural exclusiveness which is defended by the tribe.

It's important so they are not tainted by outside influences for which is greeted usually by hostility by the indigenous nation.

 

[sun rise]

And this is awesome and wonderful. Because I would say you all had shared, core values

I have no idea what their core values are. They've been great neighbors so maybe that's a core value or reflects one. We've never discussed politics or religion.

Zooming out, I have a question: It seems we're all supportive of blending cultures in peaceful ways, through cuisine, and fashion, and music and such, correct? So what's up with the cries of "cultural appropriation"?

What's up with it? To me ... this: While cultural appropriation harms marginalized communities by perpetuating stereotypes or commodifying their culture, cultural appreciation, on the other hand, seeks to empower and uplift these communities by recognizing their contributions.

 

[sun rise]

Especially for @Audie - she's a wonderful example of multiculturalism in action Wu Man, Pipa Virtuoso - check out her discography

 

[Hermit Philosopher]

Yes. The Sentinelese people come to mind as a non multi-culture group with their traditions and customs unaltered.

It remains a protected people for both health reasons and their cultural exclusiveness which is defended by the tribe.

It's important so they are not tainted by outside influences for which is greeted usually by hostility by the indigenous nation.

Thank you for rereading and addressing my questions correctly @Twilight Hue.

Though I agree in the value of keeping good record of cultures that have disappeared and of those that are on their way out for the purpose of study, etc., I very much disagree with attempting to isolate them and artificially “freeze them in time” in order to maintain them "untainted”.
Cultures are after all the customs, perspectives and lifestyles of people; not that of endangered species locked away from the changing world in zoos for others to look at.

Humbly,
Hermit

 

[McBell]

Thank you for rereading and addressing my questions correctly @Twilight Hue.

Though I agree in the value of keeping good record of cultures that have disappeared and of those that are on their way out for the purpose of study, etc., I very much disagree with attempting to isolate them and artificially “freeze them in time” in order to maintain them "untainted”.
Cultures are after all the customs, perspectives and lifestyles of people; not that of endangered species locked away from the changing world in zoos for others to look at.

Humbly,
Hermit

Even if it is THEM who want said isolation?

In November 2018, John Allen Chau, an American missionary, was killed by members of the Sentinelese tribe while trying to convert them to Christianity. His illegal attempt at contact could have wiped out the entire tribe through introducing new diseases such as flu to which the Sentinelese have no immunity.​

​

In 2006, two Indian fishermen, Sunder Raj and Pandit Tiwari, who had moored their boat near North Sentinel to sleep after poaching in the waters around the island, were killed when their boat broke loose and drifted onto the shore. Poachers are known to fish illegally in the waters around the island, catching turtles and diving for lobsters and sea cucumbers.​

​

The Sentinelese have made it clear that they do not want contact.​

​

Sentinelese

The Sentinelese are an uncontacted tribe living on an island in the Indian Ocean. They reject all contact with outsiders.

www.survivalinternational.org

 

[Banach-Tarski Paradox]

In this century weather we like it or not the world has become more multicultural and connected but I don't think that this is a good thing because too many different races and cultures in a small space creates tension and some of these immigrants don't assimilate into the Broder culture of the host country. But they bring with them more work which boosts the economy which is a good thing.

Multiculturalism is a thing.

I’m not sure where anybody got the notion that it’s a new thing.

 

[wellwisher]

In this century weather we like it or not the world has become more multicultural and connected but I don't think that this is a good thing because too many different races and cultures in a small space creates tension and some of these immigrants don't assimilate into the Broder culture of the host country. But they bring with them more work which boosts the economy which is a good thing.

Many people immigrate from one country to another, since they envision the new destination country as an upgrade. Immigration is not done to downgrade your lifestyle. This goal of an upgrade, could mean more jobs and opportunities, more freedom, and even less Government, military, and even mafia cartel, Big Brother. The problem is if you do not assimilate into the new, you tend to carry these old problems to the upgrade; old habits, until it is not a full upgrade; second world pockets. This is like a virus invading a healthy cell, making it less healthy.

There is a difference between legal and illegal immigration. The legal immigrant has to go through a process and even jump through hoops and do exercises which encourages assimulation. One is rewarded with citizenship, based on this hazing and its merit. It is like courting a spouse for marriage, doing what is required, while keeping that goal in mind. Illegal immigration is more like getting something for nothing; barroom pickup, which psychologically sets up a wall both ways, making it harder to assimilate.

Legal immigrants do not have to live in the shadows, as do the illegal immigrants, who are like uninvited guests waiting for a day in court. The uninvited guests tend to flock; ethnic groupings, that are only half way there. There the dark side of their original cultural, that many run away from; ethnic mafia, soon follows. These predator people fight to keep them separated, since they are an easier target like in the old country. They may even undermine their trust in the new country. "If you say anything to the police you will be departed."

A good example are many Muslims come to Europe seeking more religious and personal freedom. However their old school theo-mafia follows and tries to recreate their homeland, in the new country, in a way that maintains their own control. Better vetting is achieved in the legal immigration process and through the immigrant sponsors, who help them navigate the process of assimilation and the fulfillment of their original dream.

The Liberals appears to be encouraging illegal immigration, all while knowing the downside. This is part of their overall MO; modus operandi, which is to isolate people and then make them dependent. For example, who knew about transgender a few years ago. It was an isolation scam. This is how they grow government, which means to grow their own power. Legal immigration makes people more self sufficient, via assimilation, while self sufficiency, offers no excuse for growing government.

The Liberals and the Liberal Department of Education, got a two for one when they decided to teach illegal immigrants in their native tongue rather than give them the benefits of the common language. In the USA, if you know English, you can live anywhere. But if you only know an immigrant language your future is limited. This pretend to care tactic, meant more Teacher Union jobs and a way to make it harder to assimilate, beyond the ethnic pockets of large Liberal cities. They creating new perpetual dependency groups, which is scam for votes, and way to skim tax dollars, though their preferred middlemen mediators; kickbacks.