I think it's due medicine and advancement in entertainment. People are less afraid of death so think less of the next world and prefer this world to next or delay thinking about it, and find more meaning in entertainment.
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Is Science The Top Reason People Abandon Spiritual Pursuits?
- Thread starter Jimmy
- Start date
Daemon Sophic
Avatar in flux
When I was 14 to 15, I tried to go to church (Catholic) with my Dad. I took classes; attended weekly (and then some) with him; read the Bible; etc..etc...
For me, it was the errors, and the hypocrisy that made me eventually have to tell him that I didn't want to attend any more.
In particular, on the last day I attended, we all were singing (a feature of mass that I really enjoyed; along with all the shaking hands and saying, "Peace be with you."). The song we were singing was titled "By our love", for which the refrain is "They will know we are Christians by our love".
And all the time I was singing it, I felt sick, since I knew (and still know) that Christianity is marked down in history for the Crusades; and The Inquisition; and for "Fire & Brimstone" fear mongering; and wars; and denying & turning back knowledge/truth; and for pain, hatred, and death.
I know that those nice people in the church with me weren't personally responsible for all of the undeniable horrors that Christianity has historically (and currently) been known for. And the priests in my Dad's church (where he was the usual 'reader/speaker') never used their pulpit to encourage hatred or fear..... But the smiling-faced, happy-happy-joy-joy was not syncing with my knowledge of the world and of the world's history.
I couldn't live the lie.
Jimmy
King Phenomenon
Living a lie isn’t a good idea. I tried recently and failed.When I was 14 to 15, I tried to go to church (Catholic) with my Dad. I took classes; attended weekly (and then some) with him; read the Bible; etc..etc...
For me, it was the errors, and the hypocrisy that made me eventually have to tell him that I didn't want to attend any more.
In particular, on the last day I attended, we all were singing (a feature of mass that I really enjoyed; along with all the shaking hands and saying, "Peace be with you."). The song we were singing was titled "By our love", for which the refrain is "They will know we are Christians by our love".
And all the time I was singing it, I felt sick, since I knew (and still know) that Christianity is marked down in history for the Crusades; and The Inquisition; and for "Fire & Brimstone" fear mongering; and wars; and denying & turning back knowledge/truth; and for pain, hatred, and death.
I know that those nice people in the church with me weren't personally responsible for all of the undeniable horrors that Christianity has historically (and currently) been known for. And the priests in my Dad's church (where he was the usual 'reader/speaker') never used their pulpit to encourage hatred or fear..... But the smiling-faced, happy-happy-joy-joy was not syncing with my knowledge of the world and of the world's history.
I couldn't live the lie.
Jimmy
King Phenomenon
The purpose of religion is to introduce our children to spirituality imo. There’s many good hearted secure people in the world who follow a religion.
And what's the purpose of introducing our children to spirituality? Why is it desirable? What is spirituality, anyway?
Many good-hearted people do not follow a religion. Are all religions even spiritual?
wellwisher
Well-Known Member
Science seeks the truth in nature and then applies these Science truths, to make life better. I tend to think politics is what did it. All the fake news, lies, deception, mudslinging, etc., sort of makes you soiled, until religion starts to feel like too clean of a place, for your dirty clothes. It get hard to justify the hypocrisy. The Progressive religion has done all type of things, since the 1960's to undermine religion, picking up the deserters as followers of their religion. Fake news and bearing false witness are not acceptable to most religions, and since this ia. Liberal must do each day, you feel too dirty to go to clean church. Some may fear bursting into flames.
The DNC sort of reminds me of a secular religion, loosely based on the Catholic Church, but a version of the Catholic Church from the past, that liked centralized control, all the pomp, prestige, dogmatic and corrupt. They cannot be reasoned with and all they touch goes to crap and they still will not listen. Their concept of white guilt is like a plagiarized knock off of the concept of original sin; guilt for something you did not do. That dogma has no basis in science so it is part of a religion.
The Catholic Church does not vote for Pope in a Democratic way, but rather only the insiders in the power structure; Cardinals, vote and appoint, like Liberal Church did with Harris. Liberals are so busy going to fake news mass, they do not have time for a real religion.
Climate Change is like their version of Armageddon. Human, via fossil fuel sins, have made the gods of the earth angry. They have an angry goddess; Mother Nature that science explores. If the rest of the glaciers melt, and there is a world flood, they can morph Armageddon with Noah's Ark.
I believe people have been practicing religion so long it is engrained in the human DNA. You can take people out of a religion, but not the religion out of the people. People who leave a standard world religion will morph into a different secular style of religion. Back in the 1960-70's the Liberal hippie generation went back to the roots of religion, which was nature worship by learning about the ways of the Indigenous People of the USA. These secular religions appear to be evolving, following a similar path of history, based on their instinctive religion roots.
Wandering Monk
Well-Known Member
Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false, and by the rulers as useful. - Seneca
I Am Hugh
Researcher
Do you think people turning from organized religion as you've described it leads more to individual spirituality or more secular interests?
Jimmy
King Phenomenon
It’s a part of peoples life like a lot of things. Spiritual paths lead people to all kinds of discoveries about oneself, about existence and all kinds of good qualities and things.
Jimmy
King Phenomenon
I’m all for a major change in religion.
Dissatisfaction with religious teachings and actions being the main reason. Abuse by religion taught as scriptural truth. It's not science that leads people to leave but emotion and then it gets justified by science.
Twilight Hue
Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
I think religion serves a purpose in terms of an oasis or a place of refuge even if it doesn't apply to the waking world in any way.
I think the proper way to accommodate religion would be with one's Inner space where that particular religion , whatever it is, is alive and well for that person.
OK. It's part of life. But WHY? Wouldn't an education lead to all kinds of discoveries about ourselves and how the world works, as well?
Religion doesn't promote generalized spirituality. Religion focuses it on a specific doctrine and mythology, and as often as not, the doctrine preached is unjust or exploitative. Religion has been used as a justification for all kinds of abuses. It brings out bad qualities as well as good, and this is facilitated by the retarded morality of those who've come to rely on a religious crutch rather than actually think about actions and consequences.
Interesting. What sort of changes did you have in mind?
Jimmy
King Phenomenon
Thread 'Let’s Play The Devil’s Advocate'
Let’s Play The Devil’s Advocate
I’d like to see the church start to teach this.
Jimmy
King Phenomenon
People obviously enjoy it.
PureX
Veteran Member
I think most people become oblivious to the realm of spirituality because they are mesmerized by the pretty trinkets and gadgets the capitalists use to enslave them.
Madsaac
Active Member
No you are right science can't do everything but it is continually helping us live better lives, so less need for religion.
If you want your cancer to be cured you can either pray to god or visit your doctor.
Or if your not sure if it's going to rain and spoil your picnic you can go to your weather app or ask god?
Or if you want to know if its better for you to eat vegetables or red meat, you can ask a scientist or god?
If you want to know why you continually wake up feeling down you can visit a psychologist or pray to god.
If you want to try and understand the hypocrisy of rich Christians, you can ask a professional philosopher or ask god? (This one makes me smile)
If you want to know why Larry the murderer is killing people, you can ask the experts or ask god?
If you want to know why your homosexual uncle is not welcomed in parts of society you can ask god?
I could write 50,000 of these examples.
And it ten years, I'll be able to write 100,000 etc. So sometime in the near future there will be no need for religion, except for the spiritual parts of it
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A little to simplistic. Yes science plays a role in ones understanding of their assessment of belief in Gods, and the ancient religions that have variable ancient world views concerning the existence of their God.
It is true that science is intentionally neutral to the questions of subjective religious beliefs and belief in God. The path to atheism and and agnosticism is often more relates to the problematic ancient cultural views of the nature of our objective reality without science, and the conflicting beliefs in anthropomorphic Gods.
Though I do not believe it is accurate to equate the rejection of ancient religious beliefs and Gods with the reject of 'spiritual pursuits." There are many spiritual pursuits like meditation disciplines that are not rejected by scientists,