Is the term "Judeo-Christian" in describing America's values simply political correctness?

[Revoltingest]

Isn't Xianity's Old Testament still Jewish dogma?
And Jews + Israel figure strongly in Xian prophecy. (So my fundie friends tell me.)
Also, Xians were involved in founding the country, & it was & still is the dominant religion.
"Judeo-Xian values" seems an apt description of the country, but I prefer "Judeo-Xian-secular values".

 

[Levite]

Isn't Xianity's Old Testament still Jewish dogma? Jews figure strongly in Xian prophecy.

Christianity's Old Testament is its own deeply biased reading of often questionable translations of Jewish texts. And their Old Testament is incomplete, as it fails to take account of the Oral Torah.

And whoever figures in Christian prophecy, it's no concern of Judaism, and nothing to do with actual Jewish people.

 

[Revoltingest]

Christianity's Old Testament is its own deeply biased reading of often questionable translations of Jewish texts. And their Old Testament is incomplete, as it fails to take account of the Oral Torah.
And whoever figures in Christian prophecy, it's no concern of Judaism, and nothing to do with actual Jewish people.

It all still looks inter-related, even if you don't personally concern yourself with Xian prophecy about you.
They sure pay a lot of attention to you.
So I'll still lobby for the "Judeo-Xian-secular values" label.
"Revoltifarian values" would be better, but society is far from being that advanced.

 

[gnomon]

You have to understand that if the assertion in the OP about term "Judeo-Christian" is correct, then it represents an attempt to rewrite the history books to include something that wasn't originally a factor in this country. My family has been in this country a very long time. You can't try to rewrite somebody's history and expect no pushback.

My family goes back in this country a long way as well. More than 300 years. I know that includes both Protestants and Jews. There were a number of Jewish settlers into Georgia when the colony was established. Most of my ancestry keeps coming back to this State.

I find every use of the term Judeo-Christian to be absurd. It's primarily a tool of political conservatives since the mid-20th century to attempt historical revisionism along with the idea of the Protestant work ethic, throwing "In God we Trust" out there as the official motto and inserting God in the pledge. To use one of these falsehoods to falsely accuse Jews of rewriting history is laughable.

 

[-Peacemaker-]

So which is it?

Do you fear Jews?
Or hate them?

I believe I possess some fears/suspicions of some of the Jews that wield significant influence upon our country which surely amounts to a minute fraction of the population. I believe it's a self-evident truth that we are made in the image of God and that there is nothing inherently defective about how we're made. I have some suspicions/fears of the MOTIVES of a miniscule amount of people. I remain committed to loving all my enemies, whoever that may be. I pray that by the grace of God I can do that. When it comes to a man's heart, a simple glance of the eye is not sufficient enough to make a judgement. The only self evident truth regarding our hearts is that we should always maintain a healthy amount of distrust towards them. For in man's heart war to opposing desires, one evil and one good. It's important to note that having fear is not a character flaw. It's acting on those fears in an unhealthy way which is evil. Fear is often the product of ignorance. I'm always happy to see ignorance remedied in my own life.

 

[tumbleweed41]

I believe I possess some fears/suspicions of some of the Jews that wield significant influence upon our country which surely amounts to a minute fraction of the population. I believe it's a self-evident truth that we are made in the image of God and that there is nothing inherently defective about how we're made. I have some suspicions/fears of the MOTIVES of a miniscule amount of people. I remain committed to loving all my enemies, whoever that may be. I pray that by the grace of God I can do that. When it comes to a man's heart, a simple glance of the eye is not sufficient enough to make a judgement. The only self evident truth regarding our hearts is that we should always maintain a healthy amount of distrust towards them. For in man's heart war to opposing desires, one evil and one good. It's important to note that having fear is not a character flaw. It's acting on those fears in an unhealthy way which is evil. Fear is often the product of ignorance. I'm always happy to see ignorance remedied in my own life.

Thank you for confirming what was "self evident" in your OP.

 

[Flankerl]

Calling the Mossad right now. You should probably move to a different town.


I also just stole all your money from your bank account.




:ninja:

 

[Quagmire]

I'm not really interested in discussing this,

Then you never should have posted in this thread to begin with.

I said what I had to say.

Sorry, it doesn't work that way. You don't get to "say what you have to say" and then declare the conversation over. That isn't debating, that's preaching and propagandizing.

 

[Quagmire]

Fear and hatred are two very different things

No, they really aren't. Which is why if you scratch a bigot you'll find a coward.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Then you never should have posted in this thread to begin with.

Sorry, it doesn't work that way. You don't get to "say what you have to say" and then declare the conversation over. That isn't debating, that's preaching and propagandizing.

I never made any case for what might the conclusion of what the status of Jewish people is now. That wasn't my intent, and I'm simply not interested in talking about it. I do not have to talk about something that I do not want to talk about. Especially since I already answered on the subject. The person wanted proof of what I said, and I gave it to them. What they wish to make of it is not my concern.

So, yes - I do get to "say what I want to say". If the other person wants to carry it on, that's their business. But if they do, I don't necessarily have to respond to it. It depends. I don't see the other person carrying it on, anyway.

 

[Revoltingest]

No, they really aren't. Which is why if you scratch a bigot you'll find a coward.

That's just too glib.
Hate & fear are different, although I can see one leading to the other (but not inexorably).
Plus, bigotry is a separate trait from hatred or fear. Benign bigots don't hate or fear their inferiors.

Btw, giggety.

 

[Quagmire]

I never made any case for what might the conclusion of what the status of Jewish people is now.

Not sure what to do with that sentence. Was it supposed to be a haiku?

That wasn't my intent, and I'm simply not interested in talking about it.

Again: then you never should have posted in this thread.

I do not have to talk about something that I do not want to talk about.

Again: then you never should have posted in this thread.

Especially since I already answered on the subject. The person wanted proof of what I said, and I gave it to them. What they wish to make of it is not my concern.

So, yes - I do get to "say what I want to say".

No, again: you don't get to "say what you have to say" and then leave. Keep that up for a while and see what it gets you.

If the other person wants to carry it on, that's their business. But if they do, I don't necessarily have to respond to it. It depends.

It depends on whether you're here to discuss/debate/and compare ideas, or just here to spray graffiti on our threads.

 

[Quagmire]

That's just too glib.

It's a fact of human psychology. Hatred isn't just the result of fear, it's actually a manifestation of it.

Hate & fear are different,

In the same way that a hand and a fist are different.

although I can see one leading to the other (but not inexorably).
Plus, bigotry is a separate trait from hatred or fear. Benign bigots don't hate or fear their inferiors.

Btw, giggety.

Scratch a benign bigot, ie, just someone who's been misinformed, and they're less likely to remain bigoted.

 

[fantome profane]

So which is it?

Do you fear Jews?
Or hate them?

In the words of the great master:

Fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate...

I actually think this is very true.

(And frubals to the first person who identifies the great master I am quoting.) (well, a frubal anyway)

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Not sure what to do with that sentence. Was it supposed to be a haiku?



Again: then you never should have posted in this thread.



Again: then you never should have posted in this thread.



No, again: you don't get to "say what you have to say" and then leave. Keep that up for a while and see what it gets you.



It depends on whether you're here to discuss/debate/and compare ideas, or just here to spray graffiti on our threads.

I'm not sure what your point is here. I didn't want to talk about something, because I quite simply didn't have anything to say about that particular inquiry. Is that a crime or something? Why are you trying to force me to talk about something I have nothing to say about? You're basically demanding me to argue about something that I don't have an opinion on. Wtf.

 

[Quagmire]

I'm not sure what your point is here. I didn't want to talk about something, because I quite simply didn't have anything to say about that particular inquiry. Is that a crime or something? Why are you trying to force me to talk about something I have nothing to say about? You're basically demanding me to argue about something that I don't have an opinion on. Wtf.

You said that Jews were "over-represented". Regardless of what statistics you present, the phrase "over-represented" implies representation beyond what's been earned or what's deserved.

The person replying to your post asked you to explain that, ie., why you think or feel it to be undeserved. That's the main point of this thread: (from the OP) "Judeo-Christian" simply an attempt to appease the small but very powerful Jewish minority in America?

You didn't just present data, you implied a conclusion based on that data that seemed intended to support what's being said in the OP.

Basically, you posted your opinion and then said "and I don't want to talk about it".

again: if you didn't want to talk about it, why even post in this thread?

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

You said that Jews were "over-represented". Regardless of what statistics you present, the phrase "over-represented" implies representation beyond what's been earned or what's deserved.

The person replying to your post asked you to explain that, ie., why you think or feel it to be undeserved. That's the main point of this thread: (from the OP) "Judeo-Christian" simply an attempt to appease the small but very powerful Jewish minority in America?

You didn't just present data, you implied a conclusion based on that data that seemed intended to support what's being said in the OP.

Basically, you posted your opinion and then said "and I don't want to talk about it".

again: if you didn't want to talk about it, why even post in this thread?

I meant "overrepresented" in terms of their numbers. As in "disproportionate". I already said that.

 

[-Peacemaker-]

No, they really aren't. Which is why if you scratch a bigot you'll find a coward.

The root of fear is distrust, not hate. Do you hate everybody you distrust?

 

[Quagmire]

I meant "overrepresented" in terms of their numbers.

Uh, yeah. And?

As in "disproportionate". I already said that.

I know what you meant. That isn't the problem. What you're trying to say with it is what people are trying to get you to discuss.

Look: here's what you said earlier:

It's the same as saying they're "disproportionately represented". Don't tell me that you don't find it at least a little bit odd that such a tiny group of people with their history of victimization has had and has so much success and control in so many fields, especially recently. It's not a big mystery why many people wonder about this stuff.

"Don't tell me that you don't find it at least a little bit odd ".

There are what seem to me to be some pretty obvious implications in that statement.

If you aren't up to talking about those, I guess nobody can make you. But personally I think dropping hints and insinuations in a thread and then refusing to discuss those openly is pretty dishonest. It's more like gossiping than debating.

 

[Quagmire]

The root of fear is distrust, not hate. Do you hate everybody you distrust?

The root of fear is insecurity.

edit: and I never said hatred was the "root" of fear.

Do you misquote everyone you hate?