LeftyLen
Active Member
even LIBERAL Bill Mahar agrees https://www.realclearpolitics.com/v..._revolution_and_maos_cultural_revolution.html
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Is Woke a religion?
- Thread starter LeftyLen
- Start date
LeftyLen
Active Member
N.C. college professor who left China raises alarm over woke politics
Lei Zhang says he moved from his home country for a reason, and it wasn’t a trivial one. Lei was born in China in 1966. It's a historically significant year because it marks the beginning of Chinese Communist Party Chairman Mao Zedong’s notorious Cultural Revolution, a campaign to reinvigorate...
Magic Man
Reaper of Conversation
Maher isn't really liberal, especially when it comes to "wokeism". On this subject he's barely better than Fox News.
LeftyLen
Active Member
Threat of Woke & Lessons from Mao's Cultural Revolution - Catalyst Ministries
The Church must awake to the threat of Woke and understand what is behind the cultural revolution taking place in the West.
catalystmin.org
Magic Man
Reaper of Conversation
Please stop with the copy-and-pastes. Just answer the question. What exactly is "woke"? Specifically, not with buzzwords.
Also, you've provided two examples of people from China in the 60s being anti-woke. Now you just need at least 1,998 more. Lastly, it's not uncommon for this kind of thing. Jumping on the "anti-woke" bandwagon and gaining money, prestige, fame or some combination, is a thing that happens with these immigrants sometimes. There are a few examples of immigrants from China and North Korea glomming onto the conservative narrative to make personal gains. It doesn't mean their criticisms are accurate, fair or true.
Also, you've provided two examples of people from China in the 60s being anti-woke. Now you just need at least 1,998 more. Lastly, it's not uncommon for this kind of thing. Jumping on the "anti-woke" bandwagon and gaining money, prestige, fame or some combination, is a thing that happens with these immigrants sometimes. There are a few examples of immigrants from China and North Korea glomming onto the conservative narrative to make personal gains. It doesn't mean their criticisms are accurate, fair or true.
LeftyLen
Active Member
So the rejection is based on some vague ad hominem assertion. That woke has so much in common with Maos cultural revolution as to its ideology, as even Bill Mahar a liberal notes the similarity (assuming you watched the video) As woke derives as articulated from the Frankfort school of Marxism and several links to articles on the matter. Rationally no one deny woke is cultural marxism, Woke is a secular religion, a form of 'secular fundamentalism' As I hold to the Horeshoe theory i will end with this, like i have here both the Woke and fundamentalists deny Woke and fundamentalism even exist. The existence of fundamentalism, over a hundred years old is often denied by the fundamentalists,- they claiming to be just, ‘Christians,’ and nothing more. They openly state all others are, ‘cults-heretics-reprobates-evolutionists.’ The comprehensive declaration of all others as being ‘cults-heretics-reprobate-evolutionists’ include all sectarians as well, designated as adversarial entities, according to the fundamentalists. ‘Christianity is not a religion,’ fundamentalists often declare, thus all not them, all Christian religions are therefore not Christian, summarily dismissed with a hand wave.
The Woke online see themselves as Social Justice Warriors exclusively defining Woke as the hundred year old Afro-American definition, nothing more, the actual dogmatic cultural Marxist stances they hold to, dismissed with a handwave.
If woke and fundamentalist agendas were applied in the real world what would ensue would be nothing short of a comprehensive totalitarianism agenda. History has clearly displayed what religious tyrannies have done in Europe. ‘Fundamentalist theocracies’ (generically called medieval Christianity) Catholic or protestant for seventeen hundred years produced in their long history a line of corrupt theocracies with a body count that cannot be denied with a hand wave. The hundred plus years of socialism as demonstrated with its repression and body count leaves no question as to its merits. In totalitarian socialist countries anything standing in the way of the progressive march of socialism in action or thought was labeled by socialists as ‘reactionary’ or ‘bourgeois.’ For the Marxists all material goods were to be redistributed to the proletariat, all divergent ‘bourgeois ‘ thought repressed, counter-revolutionary heretics reeducated or killed. The Marxists believed real family structures, religious, social traditions and science were obstacles to the collectivist state – atavism's to be overcome and ultimately dismantled, we saw this in the Soviet Union. Today the woke claim, ‘hetero-normative family structures are inherently misogynistic thus oppressive.’ What is ironic about the woke rhetoric is it sounds almost the same as what was implemented in former totalitarian states, in particular Mao's cultural revolution with its own massive body count. If unleashed in America the devastation from both extremes, considering their collective histories is unquestionable.
LeftyLen
Active Member
How ‘Wokeness’ Is a Product of Marxism
Wokeness has not been limited to just a handful of activists. It’s becoming a dominant mindset in the American workplace.
Augustus
…
Like many words it entirely depends on the context.
It can just mean someone who is affectedly and performatively adopting the fashionable/faddish causes and vernacular in vogue among tertiary educated middle-class Progressives.
In a British context, basically the kind of person who has been mocked as a “guardianista” for decades. The opposite of a gammon.
Lampooning political stances has been going on since at least classical antiquity so it is hardly a novel development that portends the destruction of language. All kinds of vague and highly subjective language is in common normal and political usage. Terms like "far right/left" also don't have any meaning absent context.
In another sense it can be the ideological view that differences between these socio-demographic groups (race, gender, etc) are entirely due to discrimination and with the right set of policies can be removed with social engineering. Morover the very existence of these differences is, by definition, racism, sexism, etc. so any not supporting whatever faddish DEI initiatives are currently popular is racist, etc. in itself.
Ibrahim X Kendi summed it up: "The only remedy to racist discrimination is antiracist discrimination. The only remedy to past discrimination is present discrimination. The only remedy to present discrimination is future discrimination."
I would say someone who supported efforts to create a more equal society, could reasonably find many reasons why that approach is morally problematic, completely impractical and unworkable, and also has a good chance of being counterproductive (of course, others could reasonable find reasons to support such policies. Any complex problem has a wide range of plausible solutions or intensifiers).
Of course, in another context "woke" simply a means of dismissing any progressive-ish policy or opinion that the speaker disagrees with.
Many people in this thread seem to have adopted the position that the last meaning is the only one that exists outside of the positive, original definition. To me that makes them guilty of the same game too many people like to play, ignoring what people actually mean in context and instead using the ambiguities of language to apply the worst possible, most bad faith interpretation of their "enemy's" words.
Augustus
…
It is also much more than that. While he is being disingenuous, he isn't really wrong in a basic sense.
There are "Marxist" approaches to all kinds of things: politics, economics, literary and art criticism, historiography, cultural studies, etc.
This is completely uncontroversial, or at least was until US Republicans started to bandy around terms like "cultural Marxism", which made some people reflexively deny any link.
While the term 'cultural Marxism' is often the equivalent of Hitler-ing someone by creating connotations of Stalin et al., there is obviously a Marxist/Marxian influence on these things.
Critical Theory certainly was influenced by Marxism, and underpins much of the Progressive ideology currently faddish. Ditto the field of cultural studies which has been massively influential
Can look at the history yourself, for example: Centre for Contemporary Cultural Studies - Wikipedia
Obviously there are many more influences and it is reductive to simply see it as a continuation of totalitarian Communism (much of it evolved among the more anti-authoritarian Marxist intellectuals).
I don't think calling it cultural Marxism is either helpful or operating in good faith, but denying that it has been influenced by "the study of culture through a Marxist lens" seems wilfully obtuse.
Obviously polemical, it is both misleading and very roughly correct (although has acquired numerous exaggerations and fabrications that border on conspiracy theory territory that are not roughly correct).
IndigoChild5559
Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
Sorry but having a transcendent utopian vision does NOT make something a religion. I have no idea where you even get this idea from.
All a transcendent means with regards to society, is to create a society that is better than the one in which we currently live in. Utopian similarly means an ideal society. You will find that idealists on both the right and the left envision a transcendent utopia, and in neither case is it a religion.
I did some research, and found that "Cultural Marxism" is yet another right wing conspiracy theory. I'm not at all surprised. As I said in my last post, it is very common for right wingers to throw around the ad hominem of "Communist."
Wokism is basically a political philosophy, not a religion.
You are probably not aware of this, but Judaism encourages the idea of making the world a better place. We are not nearly as focused on the afterlife as Christians. We have an expression, "Tikkun Olam," which means repair of the world. It is a major component of our ethics. I say this to let you know that your portrayal fixing things in society as somehow an evil thing, is basically falling on deaf ears.
Viker
Your beloved eccentric Auntie Cristal
Exactly what rhetoric is almost identical? Are there documented testimonies from any of these survivors?
LeftyLen
Active Member
I posted them over and over to individuals, how to post generically i am not sure how here
LeftyLen
Active Member
The Frankfort school of marxism reflects woke values, as does the old Fabian socialism
LeftyLen
Active Member
I wrote this a year ago, "
That woke has so much in common with Maos cultural revolution as to its ideology, as even Bill Mahar a liberal notes the similarity (assuming you watched the video) As woke derives as articulated from the Frankfort school of Marxism and several links to articles on the matter. Rationally no one deny woke is cultural marxism, Woke is a secular religion, a form of 'secular fundamentalism' As I hold to the Horeshoe theory i will end with this, like i have here both the Woke and fundamentalists deny Woke and fundamentalism even exist. The existence of fundamentalism, over a hundred years old is often denied by the fundamentalists,- they claiming to be just, ‘Christians,’ and nothing more. They openly state all others are, ‘cults-heretics-reprobates-evolutionists.’ The comprehensive declaration of all others as being ‘cults-heretics-reprobate-evolutionists’ include all sectarians as well, designated as adversarial entities, according to the fundamentalists. ‘Christianity is not a religion,’ fundamentalists often declare, thus all not them, all Christian religions are therefore not Christian, summarily dismissed with a hand wave.
The Woke online see themselves as Social Justice Warriors exclusively defining Woke as the hundred year old Afro-American definition, nothing more, the actual dogmatic cultural Marxist stances they hold to, dismissed with a handwave.
If woke and fundamentalist agendas were applied in the real world what would ensue would be nothing short of a comprehensive totalitarianism agenda. History has clearly displayed what religious tyrannies have done in Europe. ‘Fundamentalist theocracies’ (generically called medieval Christianity) Catholic or protestant for seventeen hundred years produced in their long history a line of corrupt theocracies with a body count that cannot be denied with a hand wave. The hundred plus years of socialism as demonstrated with its repression and body count leaves no question as to its merits. In totalitarian socialist countries anything standing in the way of the progressive march of socialism in action or thought was labeled by socialists as ‘reactionary’ or ‘bourgeois.’ For the Marxists all material goods were to be redistributed to the proletariat, all divergent ‘bourgeois ‘ thought repressed, counter-revolutionary heretics reeducated or killed. The Marxists believed real family structures, religious, social traditions and science were obstacles to the collectivist state – atavism's to be overcome and ultimately dismantled, we saw this in the Soviet Union. Today the woke claim, ‘hetero-normative family structures are inherently misogynistic thus oppressive.’ What is ironic about the woke rhetoric is it sounds almost the same as what was implemented in former totalitarian states, in particular Mao's cultural revolution with its own massive body count. If unleashed in America the devastation from both extremes, considering their collective histories is unquestionable."
LeftyLen
Active Member
I wrote this a year ago, "
That woke has so much in common with Maos cultural revolution as to its ideology, as even Bill Mahar a liberal notes the similarity (assuming you watched the video) As woke derives as articulated from the Frankfort school of Marxism and several links to articles on the matter. Rationally no one deny woke is cultural marxism, Woke is a secular religion, a form of 'secular fundamentalism' As I hold to the Horeshoe theory i will end with this, like i have here both the Woke and fundamentalists deny Woke and fundamentalism even exist. The existence of fundamentalism, over a hundred years old is often denied by the fundamentalists,- they claiming to be just, ‘Christians,’ and nothing more. They openly state all others are, ‘cults-heretics-reprobates-evolutionists.’ The comprehensive declaration of all others as being ‘cults-heretics-reprobate-evolutionists’ include all sectarians as well, designated as adversarial entities, according to the fundamentalists. ‘Christianity is not a religion,’ fundamentalists often declare, thus all not them, all Christian religions are therefore not Christian, summarily dismissed with a hand wave.
The Woke online see themselves as Social Justice Warriors exclusively defining Woke as the hundred year old Afro-American definition, nothing more, the actual dogmatic cultural Marxist stances they hold to, dismissed with a handwave.
If woke and fundamentalist agendas were applied in the real world what would ensue would be nothing short of a comprehensive totalitarianism agenda. History has clearly displayed what religious tyrannies have done in Europe. ‘Fundamentalist theocracies’ (generically called medieval Christianity) Catholic or protestant for seventeen hundred years produced in their long history a line of corrupt theocracies with a body count that cannot be denied with a hand wave. The hundred plus years of socialism as demonstrated with its repression and body count leaves no question as to its merits. In totalitarian socialist countries anything standing in the way of the progressive march of socialism in action or thought was labeled by socialists as ‘reactionary’ or ‘bourgeois.’ For the Marxists all material goods were to be redistributed to the proletariat, all divergent ‘bourgeois ‘ thought repressed, counter-revolutionary heretics reeducated or killed. The Marxists believed real family structures, religious, social traditions and science were obstacles to the collectivist state – atavism's to be overcome and ultimately dismantled, we saw this in the Soviet Union. Today the woke claim, ‘hetero-normative family structures are inherently misogynistic thus oppressive.’ What is ironic about the woke rhetoric is it sounds almost the same as what was implemented in former totalitarian states, in particular Mao's cultural revolution with its own massive body count. If unleashed in America the devastation from both extremes, considering their collective histories is unquestionable."
LeftyLen
Active Member
I wrote this a year ago, "
That woke has so much in common with Maos cultural revolution as to its ideology, as even Bill Mahar a liberal notes the similarity (assuming you watched the video) As woke derives as articulated from the Frankfort school of Marxism and several links to articles on the matter. Rationally no one deny woke is cultural marxism, Woke is a secular religion, a form of 'secular fundamentalism' As I hold to the Horeshoe theory i will end with this, like i have here both the Woke and fundamentalists deny Woke and fundamentalism even exist. The existence of fundamentalism, over a hundred years old is often denied by the fundamentalists,- they claiming to be just, ‘Christians,’ and nothing more. They openly state all others are, ‘cults-heretics-reprobates-evolutionists.’ The comprehensive declaration of all others as being ‘cults-heretics-reprobate-evolutionists’ include all sectarians as well, designated as adversarial entities, according to the fundamentalists. ‘Christianity is not a religion,’ fundamentalists often declare, thus all not them, all Christian religions are therefore not Christian, summarily dismissed with a hand wave.
The Woke online see themselves as Social Justice Warriors exclusively defining Woke as the hundred year old Afro-American definition, nothing more, the actual dogmatic cultural Marxist stances they hold to, dismissed with a handwave.
If woke and fundamentalist agendas were applied in the real world what would ensue would be nothing short of a comprehensive totalitarianism agenda. History has clearly displayed what religious tyrannies have done in Europe. ‘Fundamentalist theocracies’ (generically called medieval Christianity) Catholic or protestant for seventeen hundred years produced in their long history a line of corrupt theocracies with a body count that cannot be denied with a hand wave. The hundred plus years of socialism as demonstrated with its repression and body count leaves no question as to its merits. In totalitarian socialist countries anything standing in the way of the progressive march of socialism in action or thought was labeled by socialists as ‘reactionary’ or ‘bourgeois.’ For the Marxists all material goods were to be redistributed to the proletariat, all divergent ‘bourgeois ‘ thought repressed, counter-revolutionary heretics reeducated or killed. The Marxists believed real family structures, religious, social traditions and science were obstacles to the collectivist state – atavism's to be overcome and ultimately dismantled, we saw this in the Soviet Union. Today the woke claim, ‘hetero-normative family structures are inherently misogynistic thus oppressive.’ What is ironic about the woke rhetoric is it sounds almost the same as what was implemented in former totalitarian states, in particular Mao's cultural revolution with its own massive body count. If unleashed in America the devastation from both extremes, considering their collective histories is unquestionable."
IndigoChild5559
Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
Spot on.
LeftyLen
Active Member
wrongly conservatives are more and more fallaciously conflating liberals and leftists.
IndigoChild5559
Loving God and my neighbor as myself.
These are using "worship" FIGURATIVELY. They are no different than the example I myself gave, "I worship the very ground you walk upon."