Islam will dominate!

[gnostic]

To christians and muslims it is not as much as fear. The only entity we fear is that of the majistic creator.

To our good friend christians friends they found that they have been robbed of their way of life after it was too late.

Atheisim was the necleus charge required to initiate secularism. Now it is the turn of secularisim to pay with interest of 246 years back to athisim.

You are crazy and ignorant.

I'm sorry but you are.

There is a great need to separate politics from religion, laws from religion, education from religion and science from religion.

I admired Muslim scientists who could separate what they discovered and learned, from what they believe.

One of these scientists is Abu 'l-Walid Muhammad ibn Ahmad ibn Rushd, or more better known as Ibn Rushd. Ibn Rushd is without doubt, religious, but he understood the idea of separating science from religion, long before T. H. Huxley actually separated science from theology. Ibn Rushd understood that science should be based on fact and evidences, and not be influenced by religious belief. It didn't affect his belief in Islamic teaching, but he was quite influential in the area of science.

The Qur'an, on the other hand, is useless as science textbook. The Qur'an may have value as spiritual guide, setting standard for morality and code of conduct, but explain nothing about nature and it prove nothing, hence it has no scientific values.

If you were to teach in science class that god created man out of clay, you would be laughed off as being a creationist, who is totally without logic and ignorant in science.

Can you prove that man were ever created out of clay?

It is the same thing with politics. A cleric may know his Qur'an, but it matter of governing, he is most likely a horrible leader. Leadership required more than reciting the Qur'an.

 

[Muffled]

The Vishnu Purana (Book Four, Chapter 24) explains that, "When the practices taught in the Vedas and institutes of law have nearly ceased, and the close of the Kali age shall be nigh, a portion of that divine being who exists of His own spiritual nature, and who is the beginning and end, and who comprehends all things, shall descend upon earth. He will be born in the family of Vishnuyasha, an eminent brahmana of Shambhala village, as Kalki, endowed with eight superhuman faculties."

This obviously is a prophecy but the question is whether this prophet ever had anything come true? It is impossible to tell whether unfulfilled prophecy is valid or not but if the person had a history of fulfilled prophecy then he would be more credible.

The concept that God has "portions" is incorrect. Incarnations can appear to be portions but they are not.

 

[Muffled]

Indeed these happened in a secular nation however you can also find these in other, non-secular nations.

The only reason I am for secularity is because I don't quite like god being "pushed" my way but I can level with the ones who do. Perhaps if we had a government that took ALL dieties into account, or at least put an S in parentheses after the word god any time it is mentioned for the polytheists(It would essentially be "god(s)") as not everyone is monotheistic or athiest. If everybody got equal representation I would have absolutely no problem with a non-secular state as long as I am still able to have religious freedom.

Freedom of religion is not the same thing as freedom from religion. It would be nice if I didn't have to be bombarded by seclularized bastardizations of the truth but that will not happen outside of a religious community and even within there are those who have misconstrued the truth.

All you can hope for is that your convictions can stand up in the light of day.

 

[YmirGF]

Freedom of religion is not the same thing as freedom from religion. It would be nice if I didn't have to be bombarded by seclularized bastardizations of the truth but that will not happen outside of a religious community and even within there are those who have misconstrued the truth.

All you can hope for is that your convictions can stand up in the light of day.

But "truth" is relative to the understanding at hand, Muffled. It's an ever changing beast that should never be pinned down.

 

[Muffled]

But "truth" is relative to the understanding at hand, Muffled. It's an ever changing beast that should never be pinned down.

Truth is not relative. If the sun is shining it is not the truth to say it is nighttime. Of course it is the truth to say it is nighttime somewhere in the world but that is a separate truth. With the physical world there are mutable truths depending on time and space but with God there are immutable truths because He is immutable.

 

[darkendless]

Freedom of religion is not the same thing as freedom from religion. It would be nice if I didn't have to be bombarded by seclularized bastardizations of the truth but that will not happen outside of a religious community and even within there are those who have misconstrued the truth.

All you can hope for is that your convictions can stand up in the light of day.

Sadly we have to deal with Chrstianity, Islam and all those painful "in your face" religions.

Secularization keeps the playing field fair.

If you wana be christians be christian, but i shouldn't have to conform to your fairytales in a fair society right?

 

[LuisDantas]

Freedom of religion is not the same thing as freedom from religion.

Why, of course it is, and it must be. Religion must be allowed, but one should be protected from its excesses as well.

It would be nice if I didn't have to be bombarded by secularized bastardizations of the truth but that will not happen outside of a religious community and even within there are those who have misconstrued the truth.

Is that even a real problem, let alone a significant one?

All you can hope for is that your convictions can stand up in the light of day.

That is not a problem.

 

[YmirGF]

Truth is not relative. If the sun is shining it is not the truth to say it is nighttime.

My dear Muffled and I do mean that sincerely, not snottily. If the sun is shining it is most certainly a relative observation based on a relative viewpoint.

Of course it is the truth to say it is nighttime somewhere in the world but that is a separate truth. With the physical world there are mutable truths depending on time and space but with God there are immutable truths because He is immutable.

They are relative truths based on the observation and requisite understanding. Change anything and the "truth" bends. I reject, out of hand, the concept that anything is beyond change. It is little more than specious assertion to claim otherwise.

 

[301ouncer]

Some have to submit more than others.

Daughters have to submit to their father. Wife have to submit to their husband. Women in some Muslim communities have to cover their head, including their faces. And in some countries, they can't go unescorted. Their view is that men are stronger than women, so deserve more rights than women.

Submit lol. Try telling that to my european muslim revert wife which to many she turned very serious about the Quran. More then me.

lol. Try telling submission to a red head and you will see where you will get with that. I give 1 hour to get your shekels and pack up your torn out jeans.

Some european reverts woman which I personally know have actually kiked their secular men to the kerb for not adhering or liestening to them to change their dreadfull secular ways.

PS. She has her own driving licence and latest model car to go where ever she likes.

We know how to treat our woman. They love it and they wish they never to return/ or be involved with any secular man in the first place. They had enough of the abuse of this beacon of hope.

I would understand if a woman want to wear headscarf, but for government or bunch of archaic clerics to enforce a law, where women get "arrested" for not covering all or some part of their head, then you have to wonder what rights women really have in such society. They call it "protection"; I'd call this "oppression".

a mere Sex objects come to mind here.

In a secular society, it doesn't dictate if a woman should or should not wear headscarves. The choice to wear one should be the women, and not some governments or clerics.

Have you heard of the saying " Men don't rape but mini-skirts do".

 

[YmirGF]

Have you heard of the saying " Men don't rape but mini-skirts do".

I certainly have never heard it. My guess is that only an utter moron would say it.

 

[Eliot Wild]

Submit lol. Try telling that to my european muslim revert wife which to many she turned very serious about the Quran. More then me.

lol. Try telling submission to a red head and you will see where you will get.

PS. She has her own driving licence and latest model car to go where ever she likes.

We know how to treat our woman. They love it and they wish they never to return/ or be involved with any secular man in the first place.

What nonsense here.



a mere Sex objects come to mind here.



Have you heard of the saying " Men don't rape but mini-skirts do".

Wow, a driver's license. How cultivated and cosmopolitan. Of course, you know what that leads to . . . Next, she'll want the right to choose her own clothes and then maybe even the right of sufferage. Then she'll be demanding other basic human rights as well, like the freedom to express herself without fear of reprisal and then maybe even the right to pick and choose her own religion . . . Then all madness could ensue. You're living on the edge, man.


And of course men shouldn't be held responsible for criminal rape when women dress so enticingly . . . That's crazy talk. How am I supposed to control myself when a chick wears a mini-skirt in my presence? And Allah forbid if women wear bikini's . . . that could actually rip a giant phallic rift through the fabric of space-time.

 

[301ouncer]

I certainly have never heard it. My guess is that only an utter moron would say it.

Actually I was surprised when I heard it. It came from a nonmuslim scandanavian who I hired to work for me. Very sensible guy he is and Very close and good friend too who is in constant discussion with me on many topics and becoming interestingly very close to my line of intellectual reasoning and logic. I would give him 1 or 2 months at most.

 

[301ouncer]

Wow, a driver's license. How cultivated and cosmopolitan. Of course, you know what that leads to . . . Next, she'll want the right to choose her own clothes and then maybe even the right of sufferage. Then she'll be demanding other basic human rights as well, like the freedom to express herself without fear of reprisal and then maybe even the right to pick and choose her own religion . . . Then all madness could ensue. You're living on the edge, man.

That is your wishfull thinking.

And of course men shouldn't be held responsible for criminal rape when women dress so enticingly . . . That's crazy talk. How am I supposed to control myself when a chick wears a mini-skirt in my presence? And Allah forbid if women wear bikini's . . . that could actually rip a giant phallic rift through the fabric of space-time.

Unfortantly it is the secular system beleive and thought system that is first and main cause. The rest of mankind follow this beacon of hope.

 

[Kerr]

Have you heard of the saying " Men don't rape but mini-skirts do".

They do? How? To my knowledge mini-skirts do not even have penises.

 

[301ouncer]

Indeed these happened in a secular nation however you can also find these in other, non-secular nations.

Greetings and good day my satanical distant brother. :yes:

I have never disagreed with what you say here. The global export and globlisation of secularisim of the east and the two poles have contaminated both spheres. The Godly has been brutally attacked to be brain washed to walk and act like a walking and behaving like living zombies.

Still nothing in comparison to the dwarfing darkness coming from secular states backed up by strong evidence and proofs.

Will come back to respond to your last para. later on tonight.

As my four kids take alot of my time and I also need to earn a living for them.

Peace. :yes:

 

[Kilgore Trout]

Why do misogyny and organized religion (particularly Abrahamic religions) so often go hand-in-hand? And, does the religion cause it, or is merely a rationalization for despising and suppressing women?

 

[Breathe]

Good question, ATS.

I think it's because they come from a time where misogyny was widespread: women were effectively cattle they could have sex with, and people feared other people, effectively, "using their property"..

Such religions have effectively made stamping it out even more difficult, because when you think your God sees women in a bad light, who are you to question him?

That's a major problem with religions: they often have solidified culture, and it can be very difficult to remove culture from religion.

 

[Eliot Wild]

Why do misogyny and organized religion (particularly Abrahamic religions) so often go hand-in-hand? And, does the religion cause it, or is merely a rationalization for despising and suppressing women?

It's probably a little bit of both, but I still personally hold the individual responsible for their own backward thinking.

Children who are born into a particularly misogynistic religion develop warped perspectives and settle into deviant behavioral patterns under the influence of centuries-old beliefs about the "proper" roles for men and women.

But, as well, I personally believe these misguided religions provide a perfect cover for sicko's looking for malformed rationalizations to justify their hateful and oppressive behavior.

 

[YmirGF]

Actually I was surprised when I heard it. It came from a nonmuslim scandanavian who I hired to work for me. Very sensible guy he is and Very close and good friend too who is in constant discussion with me on many topics and becoming interestingly very close to my line of intellectual reasoning and logic. I would give him 1 or 2 months at most.

Oh, the irony.

 

[nameless]

Very sensible guy he is and Very close and good friend too who is in constant discussion with me on many topics and becoming interestingly very close to my line of intellectual reasoning and logic.

surely, much interesting discussion it would be .....