Israeli Duty to Warn? What unmitigated gall (chutzpah)

[jbg]

And as I predicted, Israel has already killed more than Hamas killed:

Israel-Hamas war: Death toll climbs in Gaza airstrikes as Blinken visits region

More than 1,200 people have been killed in Israel, including 27 Americans, and over 1,500 have been killed in Gaza, according to officials.

www.cbsnews.com

Go after the leaders of Hamas. Imprison them for the rest of their lives and limit their ability to communicate for at least the first ten years. But there already were 950 dead, 140 of them children from Israeli counterstrikes at the time of that article and almost 10,000 hospitalized. It is time for both sides to call a cease fire. The number of Palestinian deaths will continue to grow due to the wounded alone. And more dead will be found.

Why can't the people of Gaza rise up and take down Hamas? If they were I'd have some sympathy. Not until then.

 

[jbg]

They were fooled. We elected Trump. He is not much better. People make mistakes. And now they have suffered for it. But the people to punish are those that misled them and broke international law. Imprison them. Don't harm civilians. And especially not children who had nothing to do with the decision making process.

No side is innocent here. I do not want Israel to become the monster that Hamas currently is.

Maybe time to call a new election. But I think we know the result.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Why can't the people of Gaza rise up and take down Hamas? If they were I'd have some sympathy. Not until then.

Because once Hamas was in power they essentially became a dictatorship. The people have no voice.

 

[Bthoth]

The majority of GAZA are civilians. Many are christian and Jewish people that live and work there.

I watched a doctor on TV last night within a hospital answer the question if they are getting warnings to leave and she said 'NO' that she has had no such warnings.

I believe it was a BBC online interview with an explosion happen during the feed that made the lady jump about 2 inches out of her chair.

It it inhumane to retaliate indiscriminately as that is the very atrocity that the HAMAS fighters did with the plague of murders that they committed.

 

[Dimi95]

He took the risk, on behalf of the Palestinian people? How noble of him.

There is nothing noble in the prize they paid for their actions just as there is nothing noble in what Israel is doing.

 

[Mock Turtle]

There is nothing noble in the prize they paid for their actions just as there is nothing noble in what Israel is doing.

When you start a dirty war expect dirt back.

 

[Bthoth]

There is nothing noble in the prize they paid for their actions just as there is nothing noble in what Israel is doing.

Unmitigated retaliation is no better than what Hamas did.

I understand the pain being experienced but that does not warrant indiscriminate destruction and violence.

The UN is now explaining that assistance to GAZA must be allowed. Let's see how that works.

 

[Wandering Monk]

There are 2 million Palestinians contained in 140 square miles. The sea at their back, closed borders on the other three sides with Israel and Egypt. Where are the innocent civilians supposed to go to escape military action? I suspect most of them are prisoners of Hamas as well.

 

[Dimi95]

Unmitigated retaliation is no better than what Hamas did.

I understand the pain being experienced but that does not warrant indiscriminate destruction and violence.

The UN is now explaining that assistance to GAZA must be allowed. Let's see how that works.

What Israel is doing is war crime under the Forth Geneva Convention.Nobody is taking sides , i said that response is needed.
Palestinian people need assistence to survive just as Israel needs assestence to stop this madness.
2.2 milion people live in Gaza

 

[Rachel Rugelach]

@jbg, I don't know what you hoped to accomplish with this thread. Frankly, I'm sick to death with each new thread being put up on this forum, each more inflammatory than the last.

I'm taking a break from this forum. I honestly cannot bear it anymore.

 

[Sargonski]

So how do you weigh that against the fact that Palestinians voted in leaders whose stated charter is the total destruction of Israel?

It seems to me that that changes the conversation about what ought to constitute war crimes - at least to some degree?

Has nothing to do with what I think - nor about the Palestinians who don't like Israeli's - nor about the Israeli's who don't like Palestinians .. claiming they are on the level of Animals .. Dropping 1000 lb bombs on apartment blocks crowded with civilians is a war crime.. just as nasty and illegal as the Hamas freakazoids killing all those people in the disco .. .. Would you think differently if Hamas had sent in a suicide bomber and the 100 people killed that way ? all of a suggen no longer an act of terrorism .. or dropped by the bomb from a Drone .. or an F-35.

Nothing you mentioned changes the conversation in the slightest of measures ?? You cry out "Bad intent" .. which terrorist doesn't have bad intent ? .. intent so bad .. Israeli Pilots banded together and refused to fly the terrorist missions given them by their Evil Zionist Overlords.

You know what Zionist means aye mate ? "Hell bent on the total eradication of the Unclean peoples"

There is no "Right Side" in a blood fued .. .. and picking one side over the other only serves to prolong. Harsh measures should be taken against both sides .. Draconian Style .. eye for eye .. tooth for tooth .. measure for measure.

Or at minimum .. maintaine the international rule book .. the Occupied have the right to violent self defense against the Occupier .. .. completely legal according to the rule book .. We armed the Ukrainians against an Occupying force .. We should be arming the Palestinians against the Occupying force.

Or do you favor our current "Do as we say , Not as we do" foreign policy -- and all inherent hypocrisy and violations of rules .. cause we are the only game in town .. and everyone will cow tow to us. OH .. but wait .. sorry .. I forgot .. that was back in the good old days When we were the only game in town .. all we had to is whisper our desires into the ear of some nation to have them running on bended knee .. begging to comply . cause we were the only economic game in town . and everybody wanted to play.

Cept .. things have changed .. Sole World Economic Hegimon no more .. and Do as we say - not as we do .. now comming back to bite .. they (Russia) now doing as we do. We threw out the rule book .. but now want it back for Russia .. too bad so sad. Sanctions only work if the vast majority of the world is on board .. most of the world rejected the sanctions .. now working on a competitor to US Dollar Hegemony. Thanks to our rash actions .. using the Economic Nuclear Option .. weaponizing the privilege we were granted "Sole currency of international trade" against the nations who gave us that privilege ... This was Trumps biggest blunder .. a move on the geopolitical chessboard he likely wishes he could take back...

When Biden pushed the button .. all he heard was a pphhhhhhhttttt.. and that is really bad .. both that he pushed the button to begin with and that it didn't work

 

[Bthoth]

There are 2 million Palestinians contained in 140 square miles.

Is that less than a sliver?

The sea at their back, closed borders on the other three sides with Israel and Egypt.

And millions living in that concentration camp.

Where are the innocent civilians supposed to go to escape military action?

Back home in the west bank, golan (trump heights) and jerusalem

But israel could not let that happen as then palestinians could vote the wingnuts out of the knessett.

I suspect most of them are prisoners of Hamas as well.

a very good possibility as the HAMAS gang are pretty nasty

 

[Bthoth]

What Israel is doing is war crime under the Forth Geneva Convention.

Dont need a convention to see the crimes being committed by both sides

Nobody is taking sides , i said that response is needed.

Sure there is, just watch the media. Only the BBC has been showing examples or opinions from both sides.

Palestinian people need assistence to survive just as Israel needs assestence to stop this madness.

Israel already gets about 3-5 billion a year from US every year. The focal assistance that I could appreciate is many need psychological help

2.2 milion people live in Gaza

Yep concentration camp GAZA is not much better than a prison.

 

[icehorse]

Many? No. Only countries with which Gaza shares borders, and Israel is the one with the most control over Gaza's supply of basic needs as evidenced by the fact that it has been able to halt the supply of electricity, fuel, and food to Gaza.

For example, Jordan "got theirs" a few decades before Israel was established. And Palestinians lived on lands now called "Jordan" for centuries. So why is only Israel deemed to be occupying Palestinian lands. It seems to me that you have to - quite arbitrarily - start the historical clock at a particular point in time for the "Israel is the occupier" claim to stand up, correct?

Or, just maybe, Islam is a big part of this equation.

 

[icehorse]

But don't get involved in senseless massacre of innocent Palestinians who, after all (as Golda Meier once said of Israel's Jews) have "nowhere else to go."

How about Jordan or the Sinai peninsula? Palestinians lived in those places for centuries.

 

[Bthoth]

So why is only Israel deemed to be occupying Palestinian lands.

Because the UN created the lines and israel continues to annex more land. For example: Jerusalem is not israel per the majority on the earth

It seems to me that you have to - quite arbitrarily - start the historical clock at a particular point in time for the "Israel is the occupier" claim to stand up, correct?

"Illegal" occupier of golan, west bank and jerusalem

Or, just maybe, Islam is a big part of this equation.

Has nothing to do with the religions of islam. (plural)

The annexation of Jerusalem is 50% based on religion and 50% based on retribution/retaliation. 67' land grab.

 

[icehorse]

Because the UN created the lines and israel continues to annex more land. For example: Jerusalem is not israel per the majority on the earth

"Illegal" occupier of golan, west bank and jerusalem

Has nothing to do with the religions of islam. (plural)

The annexation of Jerusalem is 50% based on religion and 50% based on retribution/retaliation. 67' land grab.

So when do you think the historical clock should begin ticking? 3000 years ago? 1000? 120 years? 80? 60 years?

And why do you pick that starting point?

 

[England my lionheart]

I didn’t vote but it would have been better if the Germans had warned my mum and dad that their house wouldn’t be there after their wedding night,war sucks,wars don’t get won by telling your enemy where you’ll strike.

 

[Bthoth]

So when do you think the historical clock should begin ticking? 3000 years ago? 1000? 120 years? 80? 60 years?

And why do you pick that starting point?

I prefer, the current generation or right now.

For example: right now UN Res 476,478, and 2334 are still outstanding and clear about the wrong. Illegal occupation and flagrant abuse of international agreement.

 

[Debater Slayer]

For example, Jordan "got theirs" a few decades before Israel was established. And Palestinians lived on lands now called "Jordan" for centuries. So why is only Israel deemed to be occupying Palestinian lands. It seems to me that you have to - quite arbitrarily - start the historical clock at a particular point in time for the "Israel is the occupier" claim to stand up, correct?

By "illegal occupation," I mean that it is illegally occupying territories outside the borders that the UN officially recognizes as Israel's under international law. A two-state solution would require mutual recognition of borders, not illegal annexation and expansion by one of the involved parties or a charter from one of them stating that the other should be completely destroyed.

Or, just maybe, Islam is a big part of this equation.

I think you keep coming at this subject from that ideological viewpoint and drawing conclusions that fit it rather than considering the full picture.

I don't really have much time or energy right now to engage in a discussion about that, especially when I have reasons to doubt that it would be useful or productive.

Feel free to have the last word. It doesn't matter to me.