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Judaism

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Byjayfzv

Member
dantech said:
So... Another one of those "let me disprove your religion in one sentence" threads. Well, I'm sold. I'm leaving Judaism forever. What exactly have you gained from this?
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Well nobody gave a proper answer to the question. The atheist and the Jew. So you're right didn't gain much at all.
If either of the answers were adequate enough, I would have deeper insight to the reasons of Jewish beliefs regardless if I can or want to disprove it or not.
 
rosends

rosends

Well-Known Member
Byjayfzv said:
Well nobody gave a proper answer to the question. The atheist and the Jew. So you're right didn't gain much at all.
If either of the answers were adequate enough, I would have deeper insight to the reasons of Jewish beliefs regardless if I can or want to disprove it or not.
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what is a "proper" answer? Are you looking for someone to say something which speaks specifically to your ideas or preconceived notions? Is it possible that a "proper" answer exists but you don't recognize it because you are looking for and expecting something else?

Here is more reading on the subject

hashkafah philosophy - How can we be sure that Judaism is the truth? - Mi Yodeya
 
paarsurrey

paarsurrey

Veteran Member
paarsurrey said: ↑
Judaism

Moses did not found Judaism and name it as such, he also did not name his followers as Jews.
Regards

RabbiO said:
I take it that now that you have arrived we can look forward to more of your patented "Judaism is a crock" diatribes
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Aren't the above facts. If so, why not admit them simply?

Regards
 
rosends

rosends

Well-Known Member
paarsurrey said:
Judaism


Moses did not found Judaism and name it as such, he also did not name his followers as Jews.
Regards
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That's true. I'm not sure of its relevance though. The name developed and was applied to people who already existed and who had been known already as distinct but by other names.
 
paarsurrey

paarsurrey

Veteran Member
metis said:
One thing that is characteristic about religion in general is that it is pretty much unfalsifiable, which is one reason why there are so many. No one can in reality prove one right or prove one wrong.
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This is because the religions belong to another realm; the ethical, moral and spiritual realms. In these realms the things are decided, right or wrong, on basis of Word of Revelation, nevertheless these are rational.

Regards
 
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Byjayfzv

Member
rosends said:
what is a "proper" answer? Are you looking for someone to say something which speaks specifically to your ideas or preconceived notions? Is it possible that a "proper" answer exists but you don't recognize it because you are looking for and expecting something else?
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Did you see any of the previous posts above? That's what I was referring to. And thank you for the link. Very helpful.
 
rosends

rosends

Well-Known Member
Byjayfzv said:
Did you see any of the previous posts above? That's what I was referring to. And thank you for the link. Very helpful.
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I read all the posts but I still wonder if the answer is unsatisfying because it doesn't really exist -- certain aspects are based in faith, not rational proof.
 
paarsurrey

paarsurrey

Veteran Member
rosends said:
what is a "proper" answer? Are you looking for someone to say something which speaks specifically to your ideas or preconceived notions? Is it possible that a "proper" answer exists but you don't recognize it because you are looking for and expecting something else?

Here is more reading on the subject

hashkafah philosophy - How can we be sure that Judaism is the truth? - Mi Yodeya
Click to expand...

The link given by you discusses the "Torah’s Divine origin" or the Revelations made to Moses by G-d, that would be a separate subject. What has it to do with Judaism or Jews that Moses never established or named? These are more based on the thoughts of the clergy rather than being based on the Original Word Revealed on Moses.

Regards
 
rosends

rosends

Well-Known Member
paarsurrey said:
The link given by you discusses the "Torah’s Divine origin" or the Revelations made to Moses by G-d, that would be a separate subject. What has it to do with Judaism or Jews that Moses never established or named? These are more based on the thoughts of the clergy rather than being based on the Original Word Revealed on Moses.

Regards
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That, too, is a matter of faith. According to Judaism, there was more revealed to the masses at Sinai than the simple written text. If I said it had to do with the "children of Israel" woud that make a difference to you? Different label, same group, same content.
 
paarsurrey

paarsurrey

Veteran Member
rosends said:
According to Judaism, there was more revealed to the masses at Sinai than the simple written text
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It is true that G-d conversed with Moses directly at Sinai and elsewhere but there was nothing conversed by G-d with the masses directly. In the sense that the Message to Moses as a leader or representative of the masses could be described being addressed to the masses not otherwise. Please correct yourself, it is a wrong concept that there was any Converse of G-d in group form to masses.

Regards
 
B

Byjayfzv

Member
paarsurrey said:
It is true that G-d conversed with Moses directly at Sinai and elsewhere but there was nothing conversed by G-d with the masses directly. In the sense that the Message to Moses as a leader or representative of the masses could be described being addressed to the masses not otherwise. Please correct yourself, it is a wrong concept that there was any Converse of G-d in group form to masses.

Regards
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Check out Exodus chap.19 verses 9 - chap20 verse 20
 
Flankerl

Flankerl

Well-Known Member
paarsurrey said:
I pointed out facts.
Even you cannot ignore those facts. Why engage indirectly? Have a heart to engage directly, there is no compulsion however whatsoever.
Regards
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Okay I'll do your work for you so that we have time for more important things.

Blablabla Judaism is a false Religion
Blablabla AHMADIYYA ISLAM FTW
Blablabla your scribes are liars
Blablabla follow Ahmadiyya Islam

What did I forget?
Perhaps I'd engage you if you weren't how you are.
Also shouldn't you get your prioritises straight? While you show them Jews how wrong they are your brothers and sisters are murdered by Sunnis and Shias alike.
 
rosends

rosends

Well-Known Member
paarsurrey said:
It is true that G-d conversed with Moses directly at Sinai and elsewhere but there was nothing conversed by G-d with the masses directly. In the sense that the Message to Moses as a leader or representative of the masses could be described being addressed to the masses not otherwise. Please correct yourself, it is a wrong concept that there was any Converse of G-d in group form to masses.

Regards
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There was a public revelation -- the people all saw God's presence. Then he spoke (the simple text of Ex 20:1 says "God spoke all these statements, saying:") and afterwards the people reacted by saying in verse 16 "you speak to us."

Note, their statement was AFTER God spoke to them. You should correct your error.
 
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