"lazy poor"/"lazy welfare"

[Alceste]

Oh, I'm the same way. I could never work for someone ever again. I come and go as I please, I work 12 hours some days and zero hours others. I try to do most of my work tues thru thur so I can head out to the lake on fridays and return on tuesday. Of course I have to be able to be reached, but sometimes I let folks leave me a message. I'm blessed to have people who handle things for me.

So, given that even making twice as much as I did for half as much work, I still live below the poverty line, would you say my behavior is unacceptable, even though it differs very little from your own? Is all laziness created equal, or is the laziness of the wealthy superior to the laziness of the poor?

 

[Shadow Wolf]

RR why do you assume that people only go on welfare because they are lazy or that people are only poor because they are lazy?

I'd like to know why anyone thinks that. If the AHCA wasn't passed I would have to go on disabilities because in my current condition it is difficult and painful for me to be on my feet for even an hour. I want to work, most of my bosses have held me in very high regards (on I worked for seven years ago still to this day tells people I was one of the best employees she has ever had), but when it takes an extra 20-30 minutes to get out of bed when the winter chills come because your knees are stiff it becomes offensive to be lumped into a lazy crowd. I'm going to school because I know that even once I get my knee fixed I will have a very limited time of being able to work on my feet, but if I wasn't poor I wouldn't be able to go to school so then I would really be in a bad situation.

 

[Mr. Skittles]

My autistic son is 19. He still goes to school to learn job skills and goes on job sites. He collects SSI. He is not lazy.
The few that are actually lazy make the rest who are not lazy but need help look bad.

I mean no offense but what does your son's disability have to do with being on welfare?

 

[Revoltingest]

...welfare makes people dependent on the government and the only people who really use it are lazy people and that the government is enabling these people to be lazy by providing welfare. Also that people are primarily poor because they are lazy and not working hard enough or that there should be no dignity in being poor.

I'd rephrase it as....
Our current welfare system encourages dependency by rewarding dysfunctional activities, & punishing efforts to earn money.
It's not that all people on welfare are one thing or another, but rather that it adversely affects them & their culture....increasing
the percentage of slackers & dependents. Fewer people would depend upon it if welfare were less attractive, & if earning money
were encouraged more.

What is needed to improve things? You need a system design engineer with the following qualifications:
- Cold hearted & uncaring
- Experience with capitalism
- Engineering system design experience
- Political naivete
- No desire to remain in office as a career
- The desire to impose his (or her) will with a titanium fist!

I stand ready to do the job. Now, all we need is a coup to put me in power.

 

[Mr. Skittles]

*Edit*

How is me saying what I said arrogant? I actually went through the procedure as everyone else who was laid off and who had applied for welfare and/or unemployment had to do. My scenario is no different than the millions of Americans who apply for welfare and had to wait for the process for 8 hours.

I'm glad you find it funny...I don't think being on welfare is funny but much like your post in my sports thread I tend to think your ambiguous about a lot of things about life......Stewie


Edit*****

When I say "let me educate you" its my attempt to inform those who do not know the welfare procedure and who, by reasons of conjecture, assume the system breeds laziness and not take into consideration the personalities that apply for this system.

 

[Mr. Skittles]

I'd rephrase it as....
Our current welfare system encourages dependency by rewarding dysfunctional activities, & punishing efforts to earn money.
It's not that all people on welfare are one thing or another, but rather that it adversely affects them & their culture....increasing
the percentage of slackers & dependents. Fewer people would depend upon it if welfare were less attractive, & if earning money
were encouraged more.

What is needed to improve things? You need a system design engineer with the following qualifications:
- Cold hearted & uncaring
- Experience with capitalism
- Engineering system design experience
- Political naivete
- The desire to impose his (or her) will with a titanium fist!

I stand ready to do the job. Now, all we need is a coup to put me in power.

Its impossible to have a system to create laziness because laziness exists in people whether you have a beneficial system or not. The main concern are those who take advantage of the system. I am concerned about the people who sell their EBT cards for profit, or those who lie about their condition just to get more money. Unless there is substantial proof on your end that welfare breeds laziness all we are doing is just giving our opinions.

Let's put it this way, I can sell an EBT card (Although its illegal and one can be prosecuted by law) on the street for $400 even though I may have $300 worth to buy food. Or if I am on W.I.C (Women Infants and Child) I can sell vouchers for just about the same. So I am not concerned about laziness.

 

[Revoltingest]

Its impossible to have a system to create laziness because laziness exists in people whether you have a beneficial system or not.

As counter evidence, I offer up "the projects" where generations of families would be on welfare.
Kids learn by watching those around them, & it altered their culture.

 

[Mr. Skittles]

As counter evidence, I offer up "the projects" where generations of families would be on welfare.
Kids learn by watching those around them, & it altered their culture.

Ok then my counter on several fronts would be:

1) How did they get on welfare?
2) What are the social conditions of the environment?

So for example if someone is on Section 8 (For those who are not familiar with this, is basically a program that supplies housing vouchers which allows you to live in a decent house/apartment for relatively cheap price) are they lazy because they didn't try to get an apartment?


As far mimicking those in the environment if we look at gangs and the many gangs that are all about fast cash and not honorable living I would believe this attitude would also be a contagious one upon those around such individuals. If gang members are opportunist I see no difference to those who live among such conditions to carry this type of attitude when it comes to government assistance.

 

[Revoltingest]

Ok then my counter on several fronts would be:
1) How did they get on welfare?

In my landlording experience, tenants on welfare get on it for a variety of reasons, eg, divorce, single motherhood, laziness, poverty.

2) What are the social conditions of the environment?

The welfare recipients are often grouped in housing together.

So for example if someone is on Section 8 (For those who are not familiar with this, is basically a program that supplies housing vouchers which allows you to live in a decent house/apartment for relatively cheap price) are they lazy because they didn't try to get an apartment?

I'm familiar with Section 8, but would not partake because of onerous legal requirements imposed
upon both landlord & tenant. Whether or not the recipient is lazy would depend upon the individual.

As far mimicking those in the environment if we look at gangs and the many gangs that are all about fast cash and not honorable living I would believe this attitude would also be a contagious one upon those around such individuals. If gang members are opportunist I see no difference to those who live among such conditions to carry this type of attitude when it comes to government assistance.

Both sets of circumstances have a corrupting influence upon culture.

I advocate the dreaded "social engineering". Everything government does has short & long
term consequences, which should be considered in designing the system for optimum outcome.

 

[Sunstone]

It seems to me about half the people living on the streets are mentally ill. At least half. You're not going to get much productive work out of someone who is receiving messages from god through his spoon.

 

[tumbleweed41]

It seems to me about half the people living on the streets are mentally ill. At least half. You're not going to get much productive work out of someone who is receiving messages from god through his spoon.

You saw that guy too?!?!

 

[Alceste]

It seems to me about half the people living on the streets are mentally ill. At least half. You're not going to get much productive work out of someone who is receiving messages from god through his spoon.

My Dad used to work with a charity that helped get mentally ill people off the streets and launch their own businesses. His statistic was n more like eighty percent. That seems in line with my own experience chatting with homeless people. One guy told me all about his buried treasure of gold bullion in the south Pacific. A lady told me she was trying to get hold of her social worker because she was owed interest on a debt from a former life. A guy who used to live under a bridge have me a twenty minute manifesto of totally disorganized thinking on the subject of physics and ethics - twice, verbatim, with more than a year between our encounters. Another guy had fought in Cyprus, came home with PTSD, killed his cheating wife and her lover and spent the next fifteen years in prison.

IMO, all these folks had had more than enough "tough love" to last them a lifetime. Laziness was not an issue for them.

 

[Revoltingest]

Often, the homeless rent storage units at my facility.
The temporarily homeless have difficulties.
The permanently homeless are pretty messed up.

 

[Mr. Skittles]

In my landlording experience, tenants on welfare get on it for a variety of reasons, eg, divorce, single motherhood, laziness, poverty.

The welfare recipients are often grouped in housing together.


I'm familiar with Section 8, but would not partake because of onerous legal requirements imposed
upon both landlord & tenant. Whether or not the recipient is lazy would depend upon the individual.

Both sets of circumstances have a corrupting influence upon culture.

I advocate the dreaded "social engineering". Everything government does has short & long
term consequences, which should be considered in designing the system for optimum outcome.

I see where your coming from and I agree with your ending sentence.

I believe government assistance should be temporary. I believe the case workers that are assisting welfare recipients should do better tracking the progress of those on welfare and should (if they have to) extend assistance for those that are having trouble finding jobs and housing.

 

[Mathematician]

Lazy people exist on all ends of the economic stratum.

 

[Mr. Skittles]

Lazy people exist on all ends of the economic stratum.

True. But when discussing laziness especially the emphasis of laziness 9 times out of 10 its usually because minorities are utilizing government assistance. That is, racial undertones regarding the issue.

 

[ChristineES]

I mean no offense but what does your son's disability have to do with being on welfare?

Because the same who complain about welfare also complain about SSI.

 

[Trey of Diamonds]

In my landlording experience, tenants on welfare get on it for a variety of reasons, eg, divorce, single motherhood, laziness, poverty.

The welfare recipients are often grouped in housing together.


I'm familiar with Section 8, but would not partake because of onerous legal requirements imposed
upon both landlord & tenant. Whether or not the recipient is lazy would depend upon the individual.

Both sets of circumstances have a corrupting influence upon culture.

I advocate the dreaded "social engineering". Everything government does has short & long
term consequences, which should be considered in designing the system for optimum outcome.

How is it that you, of all people, are making sense? :areyoucra

 

[Revoltingest]

How is it that you, of all people, are making sense? :areyoucra

Purely accidental.

 

[Reverend Rick]

So, given that even making twice as much as I did for half as much work, I still live below the poverty line, would you say my behavior is unacceptable, even though it differs very little from your own? Is all laziness created equal, or is the laziness of the wealthy superior to the laziness of the poor?

Great questions. :yes:

Your behavior is fine so long as you make things work for you. The poverty line is just a number. When you grow your own food and use other techniques to stretch a dollar such as coupons, you can live like a queen on very little money.

No all laziness is not created equal. Some of us can afford to be lazy while other cannot.

I don't fear superior, I feel that I have already paid my dues and am enjoying the fruits of my previous labors.