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Less than 1% of the over 250 million cars are EV's

exchemist

Veteran Member
I don't compile em o write em, partner..It was all I found in a short search...;) I do understand the point you are making.....:)
OK, but here's a link to a chart for the US for 2021: EIA projects that renewable generation will supply 44% of U.S. electricity by 2050
According to this, renewables last year contributed 21%. The chart on the right breaks it down by type. Most of the growth seems to have been in wind and solar rather than hydro.

So it is changing, fairly rapidly.
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
OK, but here's a link to a chart for the US for 2021: EIA projects that renewable generation will supply 44% of U.S. electricity by 2050
According to this, renewables last year contributed 21%. The chart on the right breaks it down by type. Most of the growth seems to have been in wind and solar rather than hydro.

So it is changing, fairly rapidly.

Hydro is a limited resource that is likely to shrink due to ecological concerns. There are still many many areas where we can put up wind farms and solar collectors. I abhor the "We can't fix it overnight so why bother?" attitude that some have. Oddly enough that usually comes from groups that tend to claim that they are "prolife" in the US.
 

sun rise

The world is on fire
Premium Member
But I notice that peak demand in the US is NOT overnight at present. On the contrary, that is when electricity is cheapest.

The cost to recharge my PHEV at night is a little over $1/gallon equivalent. During peak times it's closer to $4.50/gallon. My car is set to automatically recharge at night for that reason.

Exactly. Range is a major factor.

Today. That is rapidly changing as new battery tech comes online with better range and much faster charging.

Todays EVs are perfectly suited to be second cars and only cars for those who don't travel long distances.

Beyond that, with more and more solar tech being installed on houses and with battery storage, the demand on the grid will go down.

It is to me thus a complex question needing a wide perspective.
 

exchemist

Veteran Member
The cost to recharge my PHEV at night is a little over $1/gallon equivalent. During peak times it's closer to $4.50/gallon. My car is set to automatically recharge at night for that reason.



Today. That is rapidly changing as new battery tech comes online with better range and much faster charging.

Todays EVs are perfectly suited to be second cars and only cars for those who don't travel long distances.

Beyond that, with more and more solar tech being installed on houses and with battery storage, the demand on the grid will go down.

It is to me thus a complex question needing a wide perspective.
Indeed. EVs have only been around for a decade or so on any significant scale and they are improving rapidly, as is the infrastructure to support them. But the challenge of climate change is going to be just as big an upheaval and the first appearance of electricity was at the end of the c.19th.

Many aspects will have to be rethought, not least the extent to which it makes sense for everyone to want their own car. With driverless cars on the way, improvements in public transport and more IT-enabled working from home, people in built up areas may in future see no need for their own transport at all.
 

ADigitalArtist

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
EVs aren't a plausible reality for millions of Americans. Not only because they're more expensive, (**** Tesla in particular, for being overpriced and poorly made at the same time) but because most of us live in apartments. We don't have garages or external outlets to connect our cars. We don't have the infrastructure to make EV the norm yet.
 

Audie

Veteran Member
American car companies will not make good, reliable, inexpensive EVs. Neither will the major foreign companies. But there are a few smaller foreign companies that do, and their cars get good reviews. Unfortunately, they are not available in most of the US. Big oil sees to it. Just as they see toit that we have way too many laws and restrictions against other forms of small gas and electric personal transportation.
Yes, I've seen how Big oil has suppressed the secret of running cars on water.
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
Texas has its own power company, not under the regulations most are.
I know. It is an indication of how federal oversight is often better than state oversight. I forgot how many major power grids there are in the US, but they all need updating Texas needs theirs updated even more urgently than the rest of the country.
 

The Hammer

Skald
Premium Member
Exactly. Range is a major factor.

Plus when I fuel, I'm gone in about 5 to ten minutes. I can also carry fuel if I accidentally run out.

Evs you wait, and wait, and wait for the damm thing to charge, cold weather affects the battery, and you are screwed if you lose the charge in the middle of nowhere.

So convenience is more important then environmental protection? You can't be that screwed losing power. My wife's car can run (albeit slowly), on just battery when the hybrid runs out of gas, with just the power returned from breaking for quite a distance (enough for a service station).
 

sun rise

The world is on fire
Premium Member
Texas has its own power company, not under the regulations most are.
Texas has its own power grid not connected to the rest of the states. There are multiple power companies in Texas.

The lack of connection was one reason for the last big blackout.
 

exchemist

Veteran Member
EVs aren't a plausible reality for millions of Americans. Not only because they're more expensive, (**** Tesla in particular, for being overpriced and poorly made at the same time) but because most of us live in apartments. We don't have garages or external outlets to connect our cars. We don't have the infrastructure to make EV the norm yet.
That's coming. Where I live in London street charging points are springing up. But I agree that eventually we may need one outside almost every house. That's quite do-able. I've seen a design for a point recessed in the pavement that you open with a key and it rises up into a small pillar with an outlet on it. The challenge I think will be upgrading the capacity of the cables under the streets to handle the extra amps.

Nobody suggests this will all be done overnight. But we must get on with it, because the climate is not waiting for us. 40C prjoected for London next week, which is off the scale. And it will get worse.
 

PureX

Veteran Member
Yes, I've seen how Big oil has suppressed the secret of running cars on water.
They don't have to suppress any secrets, they can just bribe our legislators to pass laws making the use of small, lightweight, gas and electric powered personal transportation illegal. And they've been doing it for so long that our city planning has completely ignored these as a functional possibility. It's cars and only cars all across the country. And the cars are all wildly over designed and over build so they'll cost huge amounts of money to buy and maintain. Most Americans could do everything they do with a $40k car just as well with a modified golf cart. But we aren't allowed to drive golf carts on any of our roads.
 

Audie

Veteran Member
They don't have to suppress any secrets, they can just bribe our legislators to pass laws making the use of small, lightweight, gas and electric powered personal transportation illegal. And they've been doing it for so long that our city planning has completely ignored these as a functional possibility. It's cars and only cars all across the country. And the cars are all wildly over designed and over build so they'll cost huge amounts of money to buy and maintain. Most Americans could do everything they do with a $40k car just as well with a modified golf cart. But we aren't allowed to drive golf carts on any of our roads.
They don't need to suppress, so they suppress.
If Americans wanted simple cars they'd buy them.
If you can't drive a golf cart in the highway, go join the big trucks with a little Kawasaki.
 

ADigitalArtist

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
That's coming. Where I live in London street charging points are springing up. But I agree that eventually we may need one outside almost every house. That's quite do-able. I've seen a design for a point recessed in the pavement that you open with a key and it rises up into a small pillar with an outlet on it. The challenge I think will be upgrading the capacity of the cables under the streets to handle the extra amps.

Nobody suggests this will all be done overnight. But we must get on with it, because the climate is not waiting for us. 40C prjoected for London next week, which is off the scale. And it will get worse.
There's EV stations at grocery stores here, but nobody is going to want to hang around for hours at a grocer while it charges. It needs to be broadly available at homes and workplaces.

You'd also have to pass legislature requiring apartments to do the upgrades, or funding for the city to do it. And real incentives for the public to buy well made practical EVs instead of luxury mobiles or gutless wonders which won't work as family cars.

I'm not opposed to EVs, they just need to actually be practical. And a lot of the solutions for environmental crisis we've been pushing through barely make a dent in actual numbers because we only look at home use and not the much bigger problems of goods and services. E.g. manufacture and shipping, food waste, point of origin power still being dirty, etc. Shutting down Amazon would do more for the environment than getting everyone in EVs.
 

Wu Wei

ursus senum severiorum and ex-Bisy Backson
Less than 1% and yet they are already asked to not charge during peak times.
They need to greatly improve our electric grids so that they can handle more if they expect to keep up when EV's sales climb.

"Less than 1% of the 250 million cars, SUVs and light-duty trucks on the road in the United States are electric."

The long road to electric cars in the U.S.

Note: on average an EV is 750 lbs heavier that an IC Engine car. That is an average so some only weigh a little more, some weigh a lot more (see Mercedes)
 

TransmutingSoul

One Planet, One People, Please!
Premium Member
Imagine 100 million EV's charging at night along with heat and air. It will create a new peak demand time.

What is peak demand time and what causes it?

"Peak demand is the time when consumer demand for electricity is at its highest; this can be by day, season or year. Peak periods tend to be in the morning during winter months (when lots of heating is occurring) and in the afternoon during summer months (lots of cooling)."

Peak Demand - Advanced Energy.

Imagine living in remote Australia where one drives 600Km to go to the city for a day trip, a 1200km round trip.

The current idea of battery cars, with the current technology is not sustainable, nor practicable.

Regards Tony
 
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