Let's not talk about the Big Bang

[Ben Dhyan]

You need to drop the strawman argument. No one can answer your question properly as asked, Here is an example of what you are demanding. It is not a serious accustion:

"Answer yes or no, have you quit beating your wife yet?"

Childish, stop your whining.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Look, you don't like truth I get it, let it go.

It is rather strange. If your claims were "the truth" why are you having such a difficult time supporting them?

 

[John53]

You didn't say where you thought existence came from!

That's right I didn't. I asked you for evidence that BBT claims something came from nothing.

I have no idea where existence comes from which is why I'm asking you. Like I said BBT fries my brain.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Childish, stop your whining.

LOL! Oh my, now that is some first class projection. You have been whining all along because people will not play your silly games.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

He does not have to. In fact since you are on corrections only due to your behavior no one needs to. No one has made that claim. You have merely misinterpreted what was said.

BBers have a blind spot, they do not want to look at the source of the theoretical BB, no-existence.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

That's right I didn't. I asked you for evidence that BBT claims something came from nothing.

I have no idea where existence comes from which is why I'm asking you. Like I said BBT fries my brain.

If you have studied BBT as long as you said, you should know, why is it you don't?

 

[Subduction Zone]

BBers have a blind spot, they do not want to look at the source of the theoretical BB, no-existence.

And that too is projection. You are assuming that t has to come from nonexistence. Which is why others keep telling you that they do not claim that . You are the one with a huge burden of proof. It is best to just admit that you do not know either.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

It is rather strange. If your claims were "the truth" why are you having such a difficult time supporting them?

People of understanding get it, for those who lack true understanding are lost.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

LOL! Oh my, now that is some first class projection. You have been whining all along because people will not play your silly games.

It is no game, existence can not come from no-existence, it is impossible in all eternity.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

And that too is projection. You are assuming that t has to come from nonexistence. Which is why others keep telling you that they do not claim that . You are the one with a huge burden of proof. It is best to just admit that you do not know either.

Where did existence come from then if not no-existence?

 

[John53]

If you have studied BBT as long as you said, you should know, why is it you don't?

Barely studied it at all because I don't understand it. I was answering your question about being late to the thread, I have been reading it since day one, the thread that is.

So please point me in direction of your evidence that BBT claims something can come from nothing. I'm very interested in this.

 

[YoursTrue]

That's not the way it work, YoursTrue.

Every galaxies and stars, including our star system, with Earth, including life on earth, only exist in this universe.

That's where all the evidence lies.

There are no evidence that any can exist outside of the universe, not even space and time. And we have only technology to observe the OBSERVABLE UNIVERSE.

Anything existing "outside of the universe" is pure conjectures, and most likely something you can never test & verify, and therefore can never "know".

Anyone can make up all sort if claims, and lot of these claims cannot be verified, and "knowing" & "knowledge", requires evidence.

Believing isn't the same as knowing. Knowing requires verification, believing don't.

If you believe in concept that there are something beyond this universe, that "existence" can exist "outside of the universe", then by all mean, show evidence to support your claim/belief, because the burden of proof would be upon you.

OK, gnostic, insofar as I have read and discern, there is no evidence to support the idea that matter was always there. It's like saying you or I have always been there. In other words, since we weren't there, we really don't know. About the universe. But I go by the statement that says, "In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth." (Genesis 1:1) That, along with the fact that no scientist can say what was 'there' at the beginning, leads me to believe that neither you nor I nor any scientist can say with certainty if matter was always there. That's how I see it now. Thank you for your considerate attitude.

 

[Subduction Zone]

It is no game, existence can not come from no-existence, it is impossible in all eternity.

And once again you make an argument using terns that you cannot define or justify and claim that you cannot support. Hitchens' Razor tells us that we can dismiss your claims.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

Barely studied it at all because I don't understand it. I was answering your question about being late to the thread, I have been reading it since day one, the thread that is.

So please point me in direction of your evidence that BBT claims something can come from nothing. I'm very interested in this.

There was no existence before the BB, that is a given. Understanding is not believing what other people say, read it and find out for yourself.

 

[Subduction Zone]

OK, gnostic, insofar as I have read and discern, there is no evidence to support the idea that matter was always there. It's like saying you or I have always been there. In other words, since we weren't there, we really don't know. About the universe. But I go by the statement that says, "In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth." (Genesis 1:1) That, along with the fact that no scientist can say what was 'there' at the beginning, leads me to believe that neither you nor I nor any scientist can say with certainty if matter was always there. That's how I see it now. Thank you for your considerate attitude.

That is not what is claimed the Big Bang Theory either.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Because there was no existence before the BB. Understanding is not believing what people say.

And what is South of the South Pole?

 

[Ben Dhyan]

And once again you make an argument using terns that you cannot define or justify and claim that you cannot support. Hitchens' Razor tells us that we can dismiss your claims.

You can do what you like, but existence can not come from no-existence.

 

[John53]

There was no existence before the BB, that is a given. Understanding is not believing what other people say, read it and find out for yourself.

It's a fairly simple question I asked about 10 posts back. Can you show evidence for your claim that BBT claims something came from nothing?

At this point I'm assuming you can't or you would have answered sensibly to my first post.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

And what is South of the South Pole?

The finite is not the same as the infinite, do you understand?

 

[YoursTrue]

That's not the way it work, YoursTrue.

Every galaxies and stars, including our star system, with Earth, including life on earth, only exist in this universe.

That's where all the evidence lies.

There are no evidence that any can exist outside of the universe, not even space and time. And we have only technology to observe the OBSERVABLE UNIVERSE.

Anything existing "outside of the universe" is pure conjectures, and most likely something you can never test & verify, and therefore can never "know".

Anyone can make up all sort if claims, and lot of these claims cannot be verified, and "knowing" & "knowledge", requires evidence.
I n
Believing isn't the same as knowing. Knowing requires verification, believing don't.

If you believe in concept that there are something beyond this universe, that "existence" can exist "outside of the universe", then by all mean, show evidence toI support your claim/belief, because the burden of proof would be upon you.

I don't know if anything in the form of matter exists outside of the universe. I imagine it does not since the Bible account says that God created the heavens and the earth in the beginning.