Let's talk about Hell

[outhouse]

Hell is not a place, but a state of being in which you suffer from being away from God. To describe such a condition, the Pope said the Bible uses symbolic language.

 

[Beta]

Hell is not a place, but a state of being in which you suffer from being away from God. To describe such a condition, the Pope said the Bible uses symbolic language.

When in hell or grave you are more than just being away from God.
You are even away from yourself ,your own consciousness . The dead know not anything Eccl.9v5

 

[outhouse]

When in hell or grave you are more than just being away from God.
You are even away from yourself ,your own consciousness . The dead know not anything Eccl.9v5

I quoted and showed the source.

Hell is just mans imagination, nothing more. it started out in the OT as grave and evolved into the devil lol

I agree when your dead you know not anything.

 

[look3467]

Hell no >>>outhouse

Hell as in 24/7 burning and short lived as what ever it is that has burned, has no come to an end, there fore, you might have a thought to now believe in God?

Or, do you mean it as forever, as in hell lasting forever, as in "Never in hell, or hell no?

Wouldn't you say that you are not really defining "Hell no" as to how long it is that you would hold to that attitude?

Get my point?

I'm taking your hell no as forever, right?

But yet, you are arguing that hell has no forever meaning, as in the spiritual sense.

So, hell then ends with our death right?

No hereafter life?

Did not the Pharaohs believe in an after life? Not being christian?

Has not human history have images erected to what they deemed a god of sorts, giving rise to the notion that they had some sense of a higher being?

Blessings, AJ

 

[outhouse]

Get my point?

NO your reaching for belief in the face of logic and commomon sense as well as throwing history out the window.

Hell as in 24/7 burning and short lived

the bible would be labeled as a LIE but you cant label fiction that way. If the bible is not fiction it is a LIE.

you can see exactly how the fiction of hell progressed over a 1700 year history. from grave or pit to the red devil himself. hell is mythological. Hades used in the bible is a well know myth.

funny there was no fire or burniong hell before gehenna's use, afterwords there are plenty of refferences.

please go backand read through the links I posted so you understand what your really talking about.

 

[look3467]

please go backand read through the links I posted so you understand what your really talking about.>>> outhouse

If the bible is not a creditable book detailing the scope of the works of God in the lives of mankind, then why make any references to it as if were?

God's explanation to us of who He is, how this world came about, who we are with respect to Him, and how we can beat the odds stacked against us from the get go.

If anybody can understand what our capabilities are, our been given the power to have free will, most certainly understands our every day thoughts because of His ability to read the intents and purposes of our hearts........ is God.

So, the scope of the whole of His bible is what His relationship with mankind is!

Now, if you want to stay, remain, for argument sake on the definition of how hell is used, then you shall have your wish until your blue in the face.

But, if you should decide to try to understand the scope of God's work, you shall see that the definitions of hell are made on non effect by God's Son Jesus.

Here is a scripture that indicates that God ended the prison, the holding place, given to all to understand as hell, exaggerated to mean all sorts of things, missing out on the true nature of God's work.

Rev 6:8 And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth.

Jesus, by proper name, had become for us death and hell, nailing them both to the cross, as an end of them.

Now, that is the final cut in the works of God in behalf of mankind's destiny.

Because God had :Rom 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

So, the only hell left to us is what we catch and or what we make of this life.

If we should repent, meaning have a change of mind, heart, and seek God's wisdom in this whole arena of life, we should become victorious over the things which would tend to destroy us spiritually.

Blessings, AJ

 

[Clear]

I like Outhouse’ specific point that the term “hell” is a non-specific term and doesn’t tell us what "hell" is being referred to. It doesn’t tell us if it refers to Jewish Sheol, or early Jewish Hades or later historical descriptions of Hades. Are they referring to the earlier historical Christian “hell” or a different, more modern version of a Christian “Hell”. For example, the Opening Post describes a more modern theory of hell but it is not the ancient version described by early Judeo-Christian textual worldviews.

I also like TheQueenCats’ comment that at least one aspect of “hell” is the psychological aspects, such as intense regret and a conscience that cannot be soothed. For example, the prophet Ezra describes TheQueenCats’ sort of psychological torment when describing Hades : Now, concerning death, the teaching is: When the decisive decree has gone forth from the Most High that a man shall die, as the spirit leaves the body to return again to him who gave it, first of all it adores the glory of the Most High. And if it is one of those who have shown scorn and have not kept the way of the Most High, and who have despised his Law, and who have hated those who fear God – 80 such spirits shall not enter into habitations, but shall immediately wander about in torments, ever grieving and sad, in seven ways. The first way, because they have scorned the Law of the Most High. The second way, because they cannot now make a good repentance that they may live. (regret) The third way, they shall see the reward laid up for those who have trusted the covenants of the Most High. (knowledge of what they are denied...) The forth way, they shall consider the torment laid up for themselves in the last days. (more regret) The fifth way, they shall see how the habitations of the others are guarded by angels in profound quiet. (knowledge of what they are denied...) The sixth way, they shall see how some of them will pass over into torments. The seventh way, which is worse than all the ways that have been mentioned, because they shall utterly waste away in confusion and be consumed with shame, and shall wither with fear at seeing the glory of the Most High before whom they sinned while they were alive, and before whom they are to be judged in the last times.” (The Fourth Book of Ezra 7:75-87);


The point is that TheQueenCats’ concept of guilt and regret and the feelings of a searing moral conscience is very consistent with early descriptions of “Hell”.


Clear
τωφινεειδρω

 

[arthra]

I hadn't noticed this thread before and it's interesting it's been "resurrected" after five years or so... We don't talk that much about "hell" in the Baha'i Faith but I'll share a few excerpts here from the Baha'i Writings and maybe it will be a hint as to what we believe about it.

Hell has something to do with the "self":

They say: 'Where is Paradise, and where is Hell?' Say: 'The one is reunion with Me; the other thine own self, O thou who dost associate a partner with God and doubtest.'

~ Baha'u'llah, Epistle to the Son of the Wolf, p. 132

Annoyance and hostility are close to hell:

Be ye a rich treasure to every indigent one; consider love and union as delectable paradise, and count annoyance and hostility as the torment of hell-fire.

~ Abdu'l-Baha, Tablets of Abdu'l-Baha v1, p. 37

Enmity and discord are associated with hell:

Those who believed in Him likewise sacrificed life, honor, possessions, family, everything, that this human world might be released from the hell of discord, enmity and strife.

~ Abdu'l-Baha, The Promulgation of Universal Peace, p. 7

Hell is distance from our Beloved... God:

suffering because of distance from the beloved to hell-fire. And, of course, this is the Bahá'í definition of hell -- existential distance from the divine beloved.

(Qasídiy-i-Varqá'íyyih, Baha'u'llah's Notes on Qasidiyyih-Varqaiyyih - Cole)

I'll stop there... for now.

 

[look3467]

Hell was separation. arthra (#887) mentioned the word "distance". Which is the space of separation.
For purposes of understanding Gods works, verses the definition of hell given by mankind, I would point out that in the process of creation mankind became lost.
Lost in the sense that gods in the flesh (us) became separated from God due to intellectual ability to reason, thus becoming independent entities as the word in the lower case g designates, gods.
I would rather understand the works of God over the works of man in the whole of the bible.
Prison is a means of separation where departed souls went due to the fact that prior to Jesus there was no payment for the redemption of the human race.
That is why, the works of God, in His redemption plan, included Jesus as the ones and for all human sacrifice for the whole of mankind. In other words.....universal salvation.
Jesus visited the souls in prison and set the captives free to effect a no longer means of separation.

Hell was instituted by the Catholic church in its earliest days due to the issue of universal salvation.
An article written by one of the early top Catholic theologians, concerning the issue of universal salvation, wrestled with it after a timely agonizing period.
He concluded that if everyone believed in universal salvation they would cease from trying to be good. After all, saved anyway. So, He decided to instill the fear of hell damnation knowing full well that that was not the truth.
Can't remember the name of the theologian. Perhaps some one does?

Blessings, AJ

 

[Deeje]

Hell was separation. arthra (#887) mentioned the word "distance". Which is the space of separation.

There are several words that are translated "hell" in some Bibles. "Sheol", "hades", "gehenna" "tartarus".... But not one of them means eternal conscious torment anywhere.
"Sheol" is the common grave of mankind...there is no conscious existence in this place (Ecclesiastes 9:5, 10) ...in fact we all "go to hell".

Even Jesus went to hell when the Romans executed him. He was dead in his tomb for three days, then God resurrected him.
The Greek word "hades" corresponds to the Hebrew "sheol", so hades too is simply the grave. Revelation says that those in hades are released. (Revelation 20:13)

"Gehenna" is the place where Jesus said that the Pharisees were headed, but it is simply a symbol for everlasting death. A death from which no one returns.

There is no teaching about an immortal soul in the Bible. The soul is mortal and it dies with the body, (Ezek 18:4) so when we die, we "sleep" until God's time to awaken the dead. Jesus will call all the dead from their graves in a resurrection, just like he did for Lazarus. (John 11:11-14)

I would rather understand the works of God over the works of man in the whole of the bible.
Prison is a means of separation where departed souls went due to the fact that prior to Jesus there was no payment for the redemption of the human race.

Hmmmm....where will I find this teaching in the Bible?

In Israel, there were no prisons. The only incarceration there was for the crime of unintentional manslaughter was confinement in a "city of refuge" but there was no actual incarceration. The person found guilty of accidental killing was free to live in one of these cities until the death of the High Priest. Then he was free to go.
Premeditated murder carried the death penalty as did other 'capital' crimes. A thief had to work to pay his victim back more than what he stole, so in God's justice system, there was no imprisonment, and there was no physical torture of any sort. The concept of hell goes against everything God's justice stands for.....compensation, rehabilitation and forgiveness.
Those who carried out a heinous crime, never lived to offend again.

Forgiveness of sins in Israel was by means of temporary animal sacrifices which was part of Israel's worship. No Israelite could approach God in worship unless he had cleansed himself according to the law.

That is why, the works of God, in His redemption plan, included Jesus as the ones and for all human sacrifice for the whole of mankind. In other words.....universal salvation.
Jesus visited the souls in prison and set the captives free to effect a no longer means of separation.

The Bible does not teach universal salvation. According to scripture most of humanity alive at the time of judgment will perish because they had not accepted the sacrifice of Christ and brought their lives into harmony with the will of God. (2 Thessalonians 1:6-9; Matthew 7:13-14; Matthew 24:37-39 )

Hell was instituted by the Catholic church in its earliest days due to the issue of universal salvation.
An article written by one of the early top Catholic theologians, concerning the issue of universal salvation, wrestled with it after a timely agonizing period.
He concluded that if everyone believed in universal salvation they would cease from trying to be good. After all, saved anyway. So, He decided to instill the fear of hell damnation knowing full well that that was not the truth.
Can't remember the name of the theologian. Perhaps some one does?

Since the Bible does not teach either universal salvation or hell , and "few" are said to be saved, it begs the question as to how we qualify for everlasting life at all?

 

[Muffled]

Hell is not a place, but a state of being in which you suffer from being away from God. To describe such a condition, the Pope said the Bible uses symbolic language.

I believe the Bible refers to it as a place. The Pope is right that the Bible uses symbolic language but that does not mean that it does when speaking of Hell.

 

[look3467]

There are several words that are translated "hell" in some Bibles. "Sheol", "hades", "gehenna" "tartarus".... But not one of them means eternal conscious torment anywhere.

I believe that this was misunderstood as eternal torment-Rev_20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.
The lake of fire gives the impression that it is forever.

Hmmmm....where will I find this teaching in the Bible?

Without the help of the Holy Spirits guidance the works of God can not be seen. The meanings in metaphors, multiplications, numbers, times, stories, similitude's in the coming of the Messiah....the Christ.

Forgiveness of sins in Israel was by means of temporary animal sacrifices which was part of Israel's worship. No Israelite could approach God in worship unless he had cleansed himself according to the law.

Absolutely right. Figuratively, the decapitation of Isreal's head, meaning cutting off on the procedure you just quoted above, Jesus made the following statement: Joh_14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

Israel, based on Moses law, could not listen to any other message, about their relationship to the Father, for fear of being stoned to death. Joh_10:33 The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.

Jesus had to be offered up by His own people in order for salvation to come to all the world. Luk_9:22 Saying, The Son of man must suffer many things, and be rejected of the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be slain, and be raised the third day.
Mat_16:21 From that time forth began Jesus to shew unto his disciples, how that he must go unto Jerusalem, and suffer many things of the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and be raised again the third day.

One could say...Jesus was a "marked man". One who slew His brother as in Cain killing Abel. A similitude. A picture of what was to become of Jesus.

The Bible does not teach universal salvation. According to scripture most of humanity alive at the time of judgment will perish because they had not accepted the sacrifice of Christ and brought their lives into harmony with the will of God. (2 Thessalonians 1:6-9; Matthew 7:13-14; Matthew 24:37-39 )

Jesus came to save "that" which was lost. The question is.....what is "that" which was lost? Does that mean the whole of mankind? The righteous only? The rest of mankind had/have no chance?
God teaches us that by His grace and not by the law are we saved. Our own righteousness is as like filthy rags. So how could any righteous person make it as compared to an unrighteous one?
Amo_5:7 Ye who turn judgment to wormwood, and leave off righteousness in the earth,

Mat_3:15 And Jesus answering said unto him, Suffer it to be so now: for thus it becometh us to fulfil all righteousness. Then he suffered him.
Now, was then, the day of judgment. Jesus was judged for all the sins of the world and sentenced to death for His righteous sake, and for the redemption of all "that was lost".

This are the works of God and His central theme, point and His salvation: Luk_19:10 For the Son of man is come to seek and to save that which was lost.

If one concentrates on seeing the works of God in the span of all humanity, God will see to it that we shall see His glorious works above all that man may say about what they think of Him.

Blessings, AJ

 

[Deeje]

I believe that this was misunderstood as eternal torment-Rev_20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.
The lake of fire gives the impression that it is forever.

Like "gehenna", "the lake of fire" is forever.....it is the opposite of everlasting life.....which is everlasting death.
Since the OT clearly teaches that man does not "have" a soul, but actually "is" a soul, there is nothing immaterial that survives the death of the body. The ancient Jews had no teaching of an immortal soul...they believed in a physical resurrection...the kind that Jesus performed on Lazarus. Where was Lazarus before Jesus called him out of his tomb?
Jesus said he was "sleeping" (John 11:11-14) He was in "sheol" (hades) or the grave. (Ecclesiastes 9:5; 10)

Without the help of the Holy Spirits guidance the works of God can not be seen. The meanings in metaphors, multiplications, numbers, times, stories, similitude's in the coming of the Messiah....the Christ.

It is true that without the holy spirit the truth about everything is clouded, but it is not revealed to just individuals to run with and interpret as they wish. If the holy spirit works like that, then how is it possible to know the truth? If there is one spirit...there is also one truth. We all know that there is little consensus in the divided churches of Christendom.(1 Corinthians 1:10) The truth eludes her because of her disunity.

Figuratively, the decapitation of Isreal's head, meaning cutting off on the procedure you just quoted above, Jesus made the following statement: Joh_14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

So we must all come to the Father "through" the son. He is the way to the Father and the Father is the way to the son. (John 6:44) No one is said to come to the holy spirit or through it to come to the Father.

Israel, based on Moses law, could not listen to any other message, about their relationship to the Father, for fear of being stoned to death. Joh_10:33 The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.

Jesus had to be offered up by His own people in order for salvation to come to all the world. Luk_9:22 Saying, The Son of man must suffer many things, and be rejected of the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be slain, and be raised the third day.
Mat_16:21 From that time forth began Jesus to shew unto his disciples, how that he must go unto Jerusalem, and suffer many things of the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and be raised again the third day.

One could say...Jesus was a "marked man". One who slew His brother as in Cain killing Abel. A similitude. A picture of what was to become of Jesus.

Jesus was the fulfillment of Genesis 3:15....to be dealt a "heel" wound by the devil, (from which he would recover) but ultimately dealing him a fatal head wound.
He was mentioned in Eden as the solution to the dilemma created by Adam's sin. Yet the fact remains, that if Adam had refused to join his wife in rebellion, Christ's sacrifice would not have been needed and no human would ever have gone to heaven....and no one would have died.

Jesus came to save "that" which was lost. The question is.....what is "that" which was lost? Does that mean the whole of mankind? The righteous only? The rest of mankind had/have no chance?
God teaches us that by His grace and not by the law are we saved. Our own righteousness is as like filthy rags. So how could any righteous person make it as compared to an unrighteous one?[/quote]

God is our repurchaser who provided the price demanded under the law to redeem fallen mankind. (the lost) We didn't become lost through any fault on our part, so God had to set up a rescue mission for us.
A (sinless) life for a (sinless) life was paid so that all desiring to obey the Christ could live.
The everlasting life that God offers us is not unconditional, and if we fail to endure in faith to the end, we could lose our salvation altogether. (2 Peter 2:20-22)

This are the works of God and His central theme, point and His salvation: Luk_19:10 For the Son of man is come to seek and to save that which was lost.

If one concentrates on seeing the works of God in the span of all humanity, God will see to it that we shall see His glorious works above all that man may say about what they think of Him.

The Bible is one story from Genesis to Revelation. God formulated a way to get back what Adam forfeited for his children, within the parameters of his perfect law.
Jesus came to save obedient humanity by offering his life in exchange for ours.....but there are conditions placed on continuing life now, just as there was in Eden....
Obey and live...disobey and die. God gives us a choice between life and death...not heaven or hell.

 

[Clear]

The Opening post was directed at the Christian interpretation of hell that creates the injustice of eternal burning torture that is out of proportion to the typical degree of sins one commits in life. Multiple posters expressed similar difficulties with the injustice of this theory of eternal punishment as well.

Such criticisms are not particularly about “Hitlers” or “stalins”, or “super criminals” per se, but concern, in the main, typical individuals who are not “super sinners” but are, instead, trying to live fairly good lives and the punishment of individuals who did not have knowledge of and thus were unable to “accept” the Christian message in this life (which has been theorized as necessary for salvation). The O.P. seems to ask why the doctrine of an eternal torture was created and what purpose it serves.

Though I did not read all of the posts, the common complaint is unjustness and non-proportional punishment for various types of moral imperfection in this specific Christian theory of a "burning, torturous hell".

For examples :

Justwondering2 post #6 “I have a question. If the only way to avoid going to Hell is through belief in Jesus as Christ, as the Christians believe. What happens to the folks scattered across the Earth that have no knowledge of Christ or of Christianity? Is their fate sealed as well just because of ignorance? If so that seems very unfair of God!”

Blackout in post #8 “Your "god" is an evil tyranical ... I can't even find the words...
cruel, heartless, psycopath.”

No-body in #45 said : “A permanent punishment for a temporary life is disgusting and does not denote a higher being.”

Jmvizanko #58 “We give it so much thought because we cannot fathom how anybody could stand by a belief that entails something as illogical as the existence of hell, let alone that it is just. Hell personally represents the biggest reason why I can safely say I will never be a Christian or a Muslim.”


A consideration of the more ancient, and different, Historical models of Hades adds important considerations to such discussions.


For example, Rainbow Mage reminds us (post #35) that there were different models held by earlier (older) Christian movements that are different than the interpretations and models of the modern Christian movements (i.e. the more modern movements that insist on eternal torture for minor sins)

Rainbow Mage explained : post #35 : “In the earliest view, which the Eastern Orthodox still believe, no one goes to heaven or hell. They all go to Hades, the Greek netherworld. The wicked go to Tartaroo, a sort of prison, and the righteous go to Abraham's bossom, like paradise.”

The point is that the earlier models of Judeo-Christianity described in early Judeo-Christian literature were different than the later interpretations and theories concerning Hades. The early Judeo-Christian interpretations of Hades were not places of "torture" and thus, did not have the same burden of justification for unjust punishment since earlier versions of Hades were not the same model or interpretation as the later Christian “Hell” described in the Opening Post. That is, the earlier interpretations and versions of Hades did not simply torture the spirits of mankind.

Clear
τωφυειτωειω

 

[djhwoodwerks]

The Bible does not teach universal salvation. According to scripture most of humanity "alive" at the time of judgment will perish because they had not accepted the sacrifice of Christ and brought their lives into harmony with the will of God. (2 Thessalonians 1:6-9; Matthew 7:13-14; Matthew 24:37-39 )

All mankind should hope to die before judgment day, so we can be acquitted from our sin and be resurrected with a clean slate, if only people that are "alive" at judgment day have no hope.

*** bh p. 214 par. 3 Judgment Day—What Is It? ***
According to the apostle John’s vision, “scrolls were opened,” and “the dead were judged out of those things written in the scrolls according to their deeds.” Are these scrolls the record of people’s past deeds? No, the judgment will not focus on what people did before they died. How do we know that? The Bible says: “He who has died has been acquitted from his sin.” (Romans 6:7) Those resurrected thus come to life with a clean slate, so to speak.

 

[djhwoodwerks]

"Sheol" is the common grave of mankind...there is no conscious existence in this place (Ecclesiastes 9:5, 10) ...in fact we all "go to hell".

Only the deceived person will believe this nonsense,

If, "in fact we all go to hell", why did Jesus warn us "against" being sent to hell?

Mark 9:43-48 (ESV Strong's) 43 And if your hand causes you to sin, cut it off. It is better for you to enter life crippled than with two hands to go to hell, to the unquenchable fire. 45 And if your foot causes you to sin, cut it off. It is better for you to enter life lame than with two feet to be thrown into hell. 47 And if your eye causes you to sin, tear it out. It is better for you to enter the kingdom of God with one eye than with two eyes to be thrown into hell, 48 ‘where their worm does not die and the fire is not quenched.’

Why would He warn us about being thrown into hell, if we are "all" going there anyway?

 

[Deeje]

All mankind should hope to die before judgment day, so we can be acquitted from our sin and be resurrected with a clean slate, if only people that are "alive" at judgment day have no hope.

*** bh p. 214 par. 3 Judgment Day—What Is It? ***
According to the apostle John’s vision, “scrolls were opened,” and “the dead were judged out of those things written in the scrolls according to their deeds.” Are these scrolls the record of people’s past deeds? No, the judgment will not focus on what people did before they died. How do we know that? The Bible says: “He who has died has been acquitted from his sin.” (Romans 6:7) Those resurrected thus come to life with a clean slate, so to speak.

Lets take this quote for starters......

What amuses me about your take on our literature is that you read it through your own lens according to your own beliefs.....to say you read it wrong would be an understatement.

The apostle Paul told us about the meaning of death.

Romans 6:3-7:
"Or do you not know that all of us who have been baptized into Christ Jesus have been baptized into His death? 4 Therefore we have been buried with Him through baptism into death, so that as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, so we too might walk in newness of life. 5 For if we have become united with Him in the likeness of His death, certainly we shall also be in the likeness of His resurrection, 6 knowing this, that our old self was crucified with Him, in order that our body of sin might be done away with, so that we would no longer be slaves to sin; 7 for he who has died is freed from sin." (NASB)

Speaking as one with the "heavenly calling" (Hebrews 3:1) Paul was saying that death means being freed from sin. There are no sinners in heaven. Remember also that 'the wages sin pays is death', so at death our past sinfulness ends. The sins we have committed are forgiven, thanks to Christ's sacrifice.

When the resurrection takes place, Jesus the King calls the dead from their graves. (John 5:28-29) But this is not the "first resurrection" experienced by the anointed who will rule with Christ. (Revelation 20:6) The resurrection that Jesus performs is calling human beings forth from their graves (John 5:28-29) where they have been "sleeping" just as Lazarus was before Jesus woke him up. (John 11:11-14)

There are two resurrections.....a "first" to heaven, and then logically a second to follow on earth. The "first resurrection" is for those who "died in Christ", being "baptized into his death" and it means giving up their mortal flesh and being raised as spirit beings to dwell in the presence of God. It means immortality in a spiritual body for those chosen for that role. They do not choose themselves, but it is God who anoints them for a heavenly inheritance. They then will act as kings and priests for those who survive the great tribulation and Armageddon, and those who come back in the resurrection on earth. Having paid sins wages, the dead are now washed clean to start a new life with a clean slate. For many who were formerly "unrighteous", it will mean a judgment period where they are given ample opportunity to change their ways.

Those who are alive today are living in a judgment period where the good news is being preached "in all the inhabited earth for a witness to all the nations" so those who do not know God or do not obey the good news will perish (2 Thessalonians 1:6-9)....if they have taken no note of the good news, and they lose their life before the end comes, in all likelihood, they will have disqualified themselves from a resurrection.
It is the "righteous and the unrighteous" who will be brought back to life....the willfully wicked go to "gehenna". If your Bible translates "gehenna" as "hell", then you are using a lousy translation. There should at least be a footnote indicating that this is "gehenna", not "hades".

Only the deceived person will believe this nonsense,

If, "in fact we all go to hell", why did Jesus warn us "against" being sent to hell?

Mark 9:43-48 (ESV Strong's) 43 And if your hand causes you to sin, cut it off. It is better for you to enter life crippled than with two hands to go to hell, to the unquenchable fire. 45 And if your foot causes you to sin, cut it off. It is better for you to enter life lame than with two feet to be thrown into hell. 47 And if your eye causes you to sin, tear it out. It is better for you to enter the kingdom of God with one eye than with two eyes to be thrown into hell, 48 ‘where their worm does not die and the fire is not quenched.’

Why would He warn us about being thrown into hell, if we are "all" going there anyway?

Oh dear....here we go again.....'gehenna" is not "hell". Did you see the footnote in the ESV.

What is the difference between "gehenna" and "hades"....do you have any idea?

 

[Ingledsva]

Only the deceived person will believe this nonsense,

If, "in fact we all go to hell", why did Jesus warn us "against" being sent to hell?

Mark 9:43-48 (ESV Strong's) 43 And if your hand causes you to sin, cut it off. It is better for you to enter life crippled than with two hands to go to hell, to the unquenchable fire. 45 And if your foot causes you to sin, cut it off. It is better for you to enter life lame than with two feet to be thrown into hell. 47 And if your eye causes you to sin, tear it out. It is better for you to enter the kingdom of God with one eye than with two eyes to be thrown into hell, 48 ‘where their worm does not die and the fire is not quenched.’

Why would He warn us about being thrown into hell, if we are "all" going there anyway?

He doesn't. He warns about being thrown onto the fires of Gehenna. A real place where trash and the bodies of criminals were burnt. In other words, - don't sin, and you won't end up a criminal, discarded on the burning trash heap.

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[Ingledsva]

All mankind should hope to die before judgment day, so we can be acquitted from our sin and be resurrected with a clean slate, if only people that are "alive" at judgment day have no hope.

*** bh p. 214 par. 3 Judgment Day—What Is It? ***
According to the apostle John’s vision, “scrolls were opened,” and “the dead were judged out of those things written in the scrolls according to their deeds.” Are these scrolls the record of people’s past deeds? No, the judgment will not focus on what people did before they died. How do we know that? The Bible says: “He who has died has been acquitted from his sin.” (Romans 6:7) Those resurrected thus come to life with a clean slate, so to speak.

You are reading Romans 6:7 wrong. Read the whole thing in context.

Romans 6:7 For he that is dead is freed from sin. --

This verse is talking about being one in Jesus' DEATH - as the previous verses say. It does not mean everyone that dies is acquitted of sin, - Or that live people are in trouble.


Before 6:7 it says this -

Rom 6:3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?

Rom 6:4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

Rom 6:5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:

Rom 6:6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.

Romans 6:7 For he that is dead is freed from sin.

In other words - those baptized into his DEATH are freed from sin.

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[djhwoodwerks]

You are reading Romans 6:7 wrong. Read the whole thing in context.

Romans 6:7 For he that is dead is freed from sin. --

This verse is talking about being one in Jesus' DEATH - as the previous verses say. It does not mean everyone that dies is acquitted of sin, - Or that live people are in trouble.

Thank you for validating what I have been trying to show witnesses all along. Witnesses are taught, and believe, that when they die they are acquitted of their sin, "on the basis of Jesus' sacrifice".

*** bh p. 214 pars. 2-3 Judgment Day—What Is It? ***
During that thousand-year period, Jesus Christ will “judge the living and the dead.” (2 Timothy 4:1) “The living” will be the “great crowd” that survives Armageddon. (Revelation 7:9-17) The apostle John also saw “the dead . . . standing before the throne” of judgment. As Jesus promised, “those in the memorial tombs will hear [Christ’s] voice and come out” by means of a resurrection. (John 5:28, 29; Acts 24:15) But on what basis will all be judged?
According to the apostle John’s vision, “scrolls were opened,” and “the dead were judged out of those things written in the scrolls according to their deeds.” Are these scrolls the record of people’s past deeds? No, the judgment will not focus on what people did before they died. How do we know that? The Bible says: “He who has died has been acquitted from his sin.” (Romans 6:7) Those resurrected thus come to life with a clean slate, so to speak. The scrolls must therefore represent God’s further requirements. To live forever, both Armageddon survivors and resurrected ones will have to obey God’s commandments, including whatever new requirements Jehovah might reveal during the thousand years. Thus, individuals will be judged on the basis of what they do during Judgment Day.

They teach that since Jesus sacrificed Himself, "OUR" death frees us from sin. Jesus' sacrifice wasn't enough, we have to die also to be acquitted from sin.