[LHP only] What is left hand path?

[Mindmaster]

So it has the biggest defining trait of the RHP but is somehow magically LHP?

No, the definition of the RHP method is asceticism which has nothing to do with it. But, if you had two sticks to rub together you could realize the goal of the RHP and LHP are the same thing. The practical differences are the only difference.

The RHP and LHP are methods not results. The results ultimately are the same...

Re-read this post and take a moment to reflect. http://www.religiousforums.com/threads/what-is-left-hand-path.182111/page-5#post-4608692

 

[Satans_Serrated_Edge]

I only went back a few pages, but here's a bunch of unaddressed stuff. Do you think you'll get to me by having the support of a user who has proven time and time again he has no idea what he is talking about?

Wow man. I had suspected that you don't actually read the things you respond to, but I guess now it's confirmed. I rejoined each of those statements. Try reading them?

 

[Satans_Serrated_Edge]

Do you think you'll get to me by having the support of a user who has proven time and time again he has no idea what he is talking about?

Get to you? Is that what I am doing? The thickness of your skin, or lack thereof, is none of my concern. You are just words on a screen that happen to set off my bull**** alarm on the regs.

As for MM, well, it would be more surprising if you did like the guy as he is obviously drawing from the same LHP you are trying so frantically to retcon.

 

[1137]

Wow man. I had suspected that you don't actually read the things you respond to, but I guess now it's confirmed. I rejoined each of those statements. Try reading them?

Actually, these were your only "responses".

It is very telling that you liken the laws and customs of man to 'physiological processes', as if they were somehow wired into the universe. That pretty much says it all.

Never even said that.

OK, only none of that has anything to do with anything. Or, alternatively, 'responsibility' doesn't mean what you think it does.

I have plenty of money, a nice place, all the clean water I can drink(beer too!), and 'spooky' is about the last word I'd use to describe myself. I do find it interesting that your go to response to everything is 'you're trying to be edgy and spooky!' though. I would say that says far more about you than it does about others. Wouldn't you agree?

Deflection, it's what's for dinner.

I suppose you won't be addressing anything I have said directly. I probably wouldn't in your tenuous position either.

Completely avoided the argument.

QED

Spoofy troll.

You'll notice these don't actually address anything in the previous quotes. But then again you're probably too cool to follow the rules of debate.

 

[EtuMalku]

No, the definition of the RHP method is asceticism which has nothing to do with it. But, if you had two sticks to rub together you could realize the goal of the RHP and LHP are the same thing. The practical differences are the only difference.

The RHP and LHP are methods not results. The results ultimately are the same...

Re-read this post and take a moment to reflect. http://www.religiousforums.com/threads/what-is-left-hand-path.182111/page-5#post-4608692

RHP and ELHP would be considered the same in End Goal . . . the WLHP is quite different than both RHP and ELHP

 

[1137]

RHP and ELHP would be considered the same in End Goal . . . the WLHP is quite different than both RHP and ELHP

This is exactly the point. What sets the paths apart? Both the methods AND the end goal.

 

[Mindmaster]

This is exactly the point. What sets the paths apart? Both the methods AND the end goal.

There is no actual western LHP, but I am trying to bridge the gap.

"Western LHP" isn't a path it's a couple of philosophical constructions and a peppering of edgelordism.

RHP and ELHP would be considered the same in End Goal . . . the WLHP is quite different than both RHP and ELHP

Again, no WLHP. Any scholarly research on the subject will show no two sources can agree what it is. The Luciferians don't agree with the Satanists, and the Satanists don't agree with the Setians, so what exactly is it? Other than, at best... some sort of attraction to a certain aesthetic?

Not saying aesthetics have no value, but they are not a philosophy or a way. The WLHP needs to stop pretending it does anything. Zeena Schreck ditched it, why can't you?

 

[EtuMalku]

Again, no WLHP. Any scholarly research on the subject will show no two sources can agree what it is. The Luciferians don't agree with the Satanists, and the Satanists don't agree with the Setians, so what exactly is it? Other than, at best... some sort of attraction to a certain aesthetic?

Not saying aesthetics have no value, but they are not a philosophy or a way.

Different groups not agreeing on the same definition does not negate it.

 

[EtuMalku]

If necessary to define WLHP, it would be the opposite of the RHP

 

[Mindmaster]

What would be Eastern LHP for example?

I only know of Tantra so far

Start digging through a google reading of:

Vajrayāna

or

Vamachara

You will probably never run out. Just remember at some juncture Tibet, and India are hereditary cultures, and thus these left-handed ideas break down into into multiple Hindu religions in various areas. Again, these cultures do not mix up the idea that the Left-Handed Path is a a method of attainment, not a religion -- so, it works its way into several cultures and religious systems from that area.

 

[Mindmaster]

If necessary to define WLHP, it would be the opposite of the RHP

Not really, the "Western Left Hand Path" is just as dogmatic as any other RHP group but isn't a pure inversion. I just don't think it is a path or way because it is a do-nothing path. Just like say I wouldn't consider the average Christian a RHPer, but I would consider a monk living an ascetic lifestyle filled with meditation one. What is the WLHP equivalent of this? Generally, exactly what the Christian is doing... no-thing... Following a list of ideas, and taking them on good faith that they are valuable. Which WLHP are using these "tantric" practices to receive enlightenment? Nadda, zero... there isn't an equivalent... So yes, they are no path at all. Worst marketing ever.

Signs your "Left-Hand Path" is dogmatic -

1) Holy books
2) Prophets
3) Idealism vs Realism (No, you are not a god if you are living in the basement...)
4) Denial of egocentric faults and thinking they are some sort of super power.
5) Historical revisionism. Attempting to present your ideas as true by hitching them to old holy books or lore that have seem to have merit, and by extension try to legitimize yourself.

Just a few examples.... But, I think you get the point.

 

[1137]

There is no actual western LHP, but I am trying to bridge the gap.

"Western LHP" isn't a path it's a couple of philosophical constructions and a peppering of edgelordism.



Again, no WLHP. Any scholarly research on the subject will show no two sources can agree what it is. The Luciferians don't agree with the Satanists, and the Satanists don't agree with the Setians, so what exactly is it? Other than, at best... some sort of attraction to a certain aesthetic?

Not saying aesthetics have no value, but they are not a philosophy or a way. The WLHP needs to stop pretending it does anything. Zeena Schreck ditched it, why can't you?

Makes claim, admits no two sources can agree. What a joke.

 

[1137]

Not really, the "Western Left Hand Path" is just as dogmatic as any other RHP group but isn't a pure inversion. I just don't think it is a path or way because it is a do-nothing path. Just like say I wouldn't consider the average Christian a RHPer, but I would consider a monk living an ascetic lifestyle filled with meditation one. What is the WLHP equivalent of this? Generally, exactly what the Christian is doing... no-thing... Following a list of ideas, and taking them on good faith that they are valuable. Which WLHP are using these "tantric" practices to receive enlightenment? Nadda, zero... there isn't an equivalent... So yes, they are no path at all. Worst marketing ever.

Signs your "Left-Hand Path" is dogmatic -

1) Holy books
2) Prophets
3) Idealism vs Realism (No, you are not a god if you are living in the basement...)
4) Denial of egocentric faults and thinking they are some sort of super power.
5) Historical revisionism. Attempting to present your ideas as true by hitching them to old holy books or lore that have seem to have merit, and by extension try to legitimize yourself.

Just a few examples.... But, I think you get the point.

I'm pretty sure you've never even read a book on the topic by this point. This is all just so silly, you realize you're spewing all this ignorant nonsense publically, yes?

 

[Mindmaster]

Makes claim, admits no two sources can agree. What a joke.

There is a 200 post thread here with everyone trying to define it, and no two of those posts agree. Are you reading these words?

 

[Mindmaster]

I'm pretty sure you've never even read a book on the topic by this point. This is all just so silly, you realize you're spewing all this ignorant nonsense publically, yes?

I'm not interested in your passive-aggressive ad hominem attacks, so I'll refrain from countering. I would feel like I was picking on a child.

As far as nonsense... Why don't you do some research on these subjects but not from the point of making them all say what you want (aka confirmation bias), but from the point of view from their writers and the contexts and mindsets of those people where they were drawn from? Sympathic understanding of a subject is a difficult concept.... I know...

 

[EtuMalku]

Not really, the "Western Left Hand Path" is just as dogmatic as any other RHP

If there is community dogma, then it is not WLHP.

I just don't think it is a path or way because it is a do-nothing path. Just like say I wouldn't consider the average Christian a RHPer, but I would consider a monk living an ascetic lifestyle filled with meditation one. What is the WLHP equivalent of this? Generally, exactly what the Christian is doing... no-thing... Following a list of ideas, and taking them on good faith that they are valuable. Which WLHP are using these "tantric" practices to receive enlightenment? Nadda, zero... there isn't an equivalent... So yes, they are no path at all. Worst marketing ever.

I know of no WLHP practice that even resembles what you described.

Signs your "Left-Hand Path" is dogmatic -

1) Holy books
2) Prophets
3) Idealism vs Realism (No, you are not a god if you are living in the basement...)
4) Denial of egocentric faults and thinking they are some sort of super power.
5) Historical revisionism. Attempting to present your ideas as true by hitching them to old holy books or lore that have seem to have merit, and by extension try to legitimize yourself.

Just a few examples.... But, I think you get the point.

Which WLHP organizations have any of these?
I'll have to agree with 1137 . . . you have no idea what you are talking about.

 

[Mindmaster]

If there is community dogma, then it is not WLHP.

I know of no WLHP practice that even resembles what you described.

Which WLHP organizations have any of these?
I'll have to agree with 1137 . . . you have no idea what you are talking about.

You must be taking some drugs...

I respect anyone's belief... but, all of the crap on this video is pure dogma.

 

[EtuMalku]

You must be taking some drugs...

I respect anyone's belief... but, all of the crap on this video is pure dogma.

Dogma is a principle or set of principles laid down by an authority as incontrovertibly true.[1] It serves as part of the primary basis of an ideology or belief system, and it cannot be changed or discarded without affecting the very system's paradigm, or the ideology itself. The term can refer to acceptable opinions of philosophers or philosophical schools, public decrees, religion, or issued decisions of political authorities.

Do explain how that video is dogmatic?

I'll make it easier to discuss:


The Mercurial mind is a flexible mind, able to respond to change.This greatest of archetypes, Mercury is used to connect the conscious with the unconscious as we seek to resurrect our Lower Self into our Higher Self as the Phoenix from its own ashes. Those who make this conscious sacrifice risk raising the shadow as well as the treasure. Conscious suffering has to be accepted before wisdom can be acquired.

The pain of consciousness came when Adam and Eve ate of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil and were expelled from the garden of Eden, the Ouroboric paradise of the unified psyche. Suffering and transformation are a result of the conflict between human feeling and divine knowledge.

The story of the Old Norse god Odin comes to mind where he sacrifices an eye to Mimer in order to gain the Wisdom of the Ages and is hung from the World Tree for nine days to earn the knowledge of the Runes, the true meaning behind Tarot Atu XII The Hanged Man. This reminds us that Wisdom is Knowledge gained through experience, a lengthy process to be endured and is not acquired overnight.


- from William Blake's poem "Tiriel"

Rise up thy sluggish limbs, and let the loathsomest of poisons
Drop from thy garments as thou walkest, wrapp'd in yellow clouds!
Here take thy seat in this wide court; let it be strewn with dead;

These are the groans of death, ye serpents! these are the groans of death!
Nourish'd with milk, ye serpents, nourish'd with mother's tears and cares!
Look at my eyes, blind as the orbless skull among the stones!
Look at my bald head! Hark! listen, ye serpents, listen! . . .


Diabolicon Statement of Satan
1:13
Then Michael turned to me and said, Lucifer, thou host elected a direction whose
end none can foresee, for it is estranged from the design of God. Those who confirm
thee do so as much for faith in thy person as for sanction of thy ideal. And I perceive
that, should thou fail in thy ambition, apocalyptic madness shall be thy ruin and
damnation. Then shall thy light perish, and all that thou host achieved become as
naught, for all will be conformed to the divine law. But if thou should succeed, then
God would be cast down, vesting in ourselves alone the control of the Universe


LITURGY
Tiriel, noble lord, you who are truthful, sensible, and intelligent
To whom is due all prophecies of prophets and their meanings
O blackened forge of Cain, we invoke you by your names

Mercury, Hotarit, Haruz, Tyr, Meda

Receive our request
Pour onto us the powers of thy spirit
So that we are made strong
That we are capable and prepared
That we may apprehend the sciences and the wisdoms

Mercurius sapientia, voluntas, Verbum
(Mercury the Wisdom, the Will, the Word)


Ilu me en

 

[Mindmaster]

Dogma is a principle or set of principles laid down by an authority as incontrovertibly true.[1] It serves as part of the primary basis of an ideology or belief system, and it cannot be changed or discarded without affecting the very system's paradigm, or the ideology itself. The term can refer to acceptable opinions of philosophers or philosophical schools, public decrees, religion, or issued decisions of political authorities.

Do explain how that video is dogmatic?

No Dogma is taking something like that and making a group based on it... If you trashed these concepts what happens to HOD? That's a dogma... All of it largely being non-provable as valuable.

 

[EtuMalku]

No Dogma is taking something like that and making a group based on it... If you trashed these concepts what happens to HOD? That's a dogma... All of it largely being non-provable as valuable.

Everyone that progresses in H☿D eventually realizes their own personal / isolate intelligence and creates their own personal dogma.
Why would you attempt to belittle something you haven't the slightest understanding of?
I'm beginning to see a pattern here . . .