I believe that the commandment about false testimony includes all that you rightfully affirm about integrity.
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Louisiana becomes first state to require that Ten Commandments be displayed in public classrooms
- Thread starter Evangelicalhumanist
- Start date
It doesn't say that.
To not say it speaks volumes about lack of integrity.
This doesn’t make sense as I read it.
I’m not sure the relevance here.
This doesn’t follow precedent.
Sounds argumentative.
The 10 - Commandments have more to do with history than your misapplication of the scripture.
You sound like your position is controlled and in the dark IMV
??? What makes the child “her own body”? Are you trying to change the subject?
Guitar's Cry
Disciple of Pan
But not just in Christian literature.
A common practice, which I use in the classroom, is to come up with group norms together, create a visual for them, and display them. These are general, and this practice is meant to be collaborative so that there is direct agreement through compromise and a sense of ownership.
The values tend to be around respect and responsibility, and this is accomplished without Christian literature since human groups generally have the same needs in order to function.
Specifically attributing these norms to Christianity in the classroom is blatant indoctrination.
Another example of this is in my Karate dojo we have seven precepts: Humility, Integrity, Perseverance, Compassion, Self Control, Discipline, and Courtesy. These are the core of our practice and are meant to extend beyond the dojo and into our everday life. We recite and meditate on them before and after every class. They are meant to develop character along with the martial arts we practice.
No Christian literature required.
Yes… it is horrible what happened to you. But I don’t think that translates into how you see it as being the correct way of seeing it. The word “honor” means to “give value”. If your father doesn’t have value - then does it really apply?When I was a schoolboy, several centuries ago, I was a ward of the Children's Aid. (Technicall, I was a ward of the crown, meaning that effectively the Queen was my guardian -- not that it did me much good.) I did not know my father -- not even his name -- and he had never seen my face, even as an infant, and my mother was long gone out of my life. Much later in life (in fact not until I was 70) did I learn all the facts, and discover my 16 half brothers and sisters (actually 18 - twins died shortly after being born). My father knocked my mother up and left, and then another girl, giving me a half-brother exactly 6 months younger than me. And then, 4 months before I was born, married a third girl who was already pregnant by him. My mother married a man shortly after I was born who horribly abused me, almost killing me twice, which she did little to stop.
May I just hint at what I might have thought about a "commandment" to honour my father and my mother?
I also did not believe in God. I would not have appreciated being informed "officially" (i.e. on the wall of the school dedicated to my education) that I was wrong, and that there was a God, and I was required to worship Him alone.
Oddly, the commandments do not say that my father shouldn't have left, nor my step-father shouldn't have abused me. God, for some reason, left those out, which rather suggests that they weren't issues for Him. Nothing in God's law against abandoning me, either.
You may think this trivial, and I could just "get over it," but all this happened by the time I was 8 years old in grade 3. You may have heard that these can be quite impressionable years.
Further, I live in one of the most multicultural cities, provinces and country in the world. I was surrounded by Muslims, Jews, Hindus, Protestants, Catholics, Buddhists etc. They were in my classrooms. They had as much right to be there as I did -- and as much right to be respected for who they were, and not to have (for them) "foreign" religious idiologies thrust upon them. School was for learning what a child needs to know -- religion was for home and church/temple/mosque/etc.
If you think I'm making an argument for the sake of it, you might ponder on the things that happened to me -- and why I feel very strongly about it.
In rearing our children, we “inform officially” many thing that the children may not like. But one thing for sure, as you said, your are not “required” to worship Him alone. You have the freedom to worship yourself if you so choose or make an idol and say “this is my god”.
My wife lived with an abusive alcoholic father whose voice made her sister pee in her underwear. He never said “I love you”. He left the mother of his 4 girls for a maid that was given to him as a payment for a debt. To make ends meet, she rented rooms. My wife, as a child, saw women dragged by the hair, murder, pimps kicking their pregnant girls to force an abortion. and so much more as she lived in the house filled with mice that scurried on kitchen countertops and in kitchen drawers.
Everyone has a choice of either living their lives under the shadow of their past or moving forward into a different life out from the shadow of their past. In my wife’s case, and mine, we chose to live in the light of Jesus and move forward (please review my signature as people may choose their options).
So.;; I’m not sure what happened to you changes the right to post the 10 commandments even as me being born in the States meant that i didn’t have to sing the Venezuelan national anthem when I lived there.
Argentbear
Well-Known Member
what history?
Common? Oh, yes, that they are. They are also woefully inadequate, because they are primitive and God-focused, if what you are looking for is pointers to how to really make the best out of the world as it is. In this thread, you have seen many, much better sets of such "guidelines," all philosophically much stronger than the 10 Commandments list of what not to do -- bereft of any positive advice except worship God, obey the Sabbath and honour your parents. How much better is "love others" than "don't kill or steal from them, or covet their stuff, or lie to them?" That list would have to be infintely longer to fully cover "love them."
@Revoltingest has made many suggestions as to what sort of advice would really help us live good lives if we learn them early enough and really live by them. Or how about this -- instead of the Ten Commandments, why not post "The Golden Rule Poster" in every class. And these have the additional advantage of being ecumenical and inclusive of non-religious traditions as well.
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From the beginning of the Republic, Christians have
fought to enslave blacks.
We needn't do everything that has long been done.
We've largely moved beyond slavery (although
Christians still favor conscription, ie, slavery-lite.)
Let's move beyond forcing your scripture down
the throats of non-believers. If we're to have
schools provide prescriptions & proscriptions
for good citizenship, then lets use something
better than the inadequate 10 Commandments,
which range from a few good ones to outright evil.
I had to stand beginning in grade school, but I was silent. The reference to gods in the Pledge and on the money let me know that America didn't have my back and I wasn't really one of them. That was "one nation, under God." Where does an atheist fit in in such a nation?
But I still loved America then, was otherwise proud of it. That faded over the decades, which made expatriation much more appealing. Today, I don't feel American anymore. I am. I was acculturated there for 55 years and I still have a passport, file taxes, and collect Social Security. But my heart's not with America anymore, at least not with all of it. I never visit any more.
Here's an opinion that also affected my disposition toward America, further evidence that only theists were good Americans: "No, I don't know that atheists should be considered as citizens, nor should they be considered as patriots. This is one nation under God."- American President George H. W. Bush
I'd bet this Louisianna statute is the result of Trump packing the court with theocrats (Christian nationalists). A statute like that now has a chance of being approved of by that court.
The Bud Light thing is also feels like a result of Trumpism, which emboldened bigots of all stripes. Likewise with Florida's "Don't say gay" and book banning.
obviously this is an attempt to derail and bring a different subject that has nothing to do with what we are talking about. One that doesn’t even refute what has been in law - 10 Commandments doesn’t say “enslave your neighbour"
nice try - no cigar
words
of historical value
I think you flatter yourself if you think words you posted an hour ago on RF forums are words "of historical value".
So, @Kenny, the First Commandment was cited in 26 cases, the Second in 24 cases. Do you know what convictions resulted? I mean, not following the First ought to mean that it was cited to put Hindus into jail for worshipping any of their gods, right? Or the Second could be cited for putting up a cross with a figurine of Jesus hanging on it, no?
If not those, what the hell was your point in posting that nonsense?
Pogo
Well-Known Member
As I responded last time somebody made this silly claim, do the same search for how many times Shakespeare has been quoted. That literature that deals with the human condition is used in a rhetorical context does not make it law so matter how many points it is printed in.