Men and women. Friends or foes?

[Estro Felino]

And does this mean you think marital infidelity isn't a big deal?

I don't.
But my culture unfortunately does think that.
I am admitting my culture is very sexist and chauvinistic, and I would never take it as an example. Never.
But maybe...in the US, it's excessively the opposite. Too harsh on men, whenever they make mistakes.
Just that.
A middle way is the solution.

 

[Estro Felino]

I will suggest the American males to visit Europe to meet some girls.
You just need to be nice

 

[SomeRandom]

I guess I have the right to understand.
It's something that traumatized me...in the nineties, when I heard of Clinton and Lewinski.
It's an unresolved issue.
Clinton treated as a criminal just because he had an extra-marital affair with a younger woman.

Is that because he was a straight man?

It’s because he was famous lol
That’s pretty much the only reason why people cared.

Here was the President of the United States. A supposed leader of the free world, seemingly abandoning “family values” that the US claims to champion.
It’s the same reason why whenever a football player gets caught having even consensual sex with someone else, society at large seemingly wants to weigh in on such a “scandal.”
Hell they might even lose their contract or get involved in some stupid trumped up charge. Depending on the scenario. It’s happened here plenty of times.
And we’re far more”European” than American, all things considered.
Well we were
Either way. If the player didn’t have the broader fame and the apparent need to be a spokesperson for something that everyone watched, no one would care if they slept with a 1000 women. Even if they were married.
Well the spouse may care but no one else would

Same with Clinton. But he had the added detriment of politics. His opponents, who may have had affairs of their own, who knows. Had easy ammunition they could exploit and appeal to people’s emotions. If he were just some rando, he could have had as many affairs as he wanted without.

 

[Estro Felino]

It’s because he was famous lol
That’s pretty much the only reason why people cared.

Here was the President of the United States. A supposed leader of the free world, seemingly abandoning “family values” that the US claims to champion.
It’s the same reason why whenever a football player gets caught having even consensual sex with someone else, society at large seemingly wants to weigh in on such a “scandal.”
If they didn’t have the broader fame and the apparent need to be a spokesperson for something that everyone watched, no one would care if they slept with a 1000 women. Even if they were married.
Well the spouse may care but no one else would

But the American people did care.
In fact they forced him to confess what he had done with her...in detail.
That's how we know...something honestly I would have done without.

But what I understood is that the American people enjoy crucifying the white heterosexual male.
Because if it had dealt with a female politician having an affair with a male intern...well...it would have been accepted.

 

[SomeRandom]

But the American people did care.
In fact they forced him to confess what he had done with her...in detail.
That's how we know...something honestly I would have done without.

But what I understood is that the American people enjoy crucifying the white heterosexual male.
Because if it had dealt with a female politician having an affair with a male intern...well...it would have been accepted.

They forced him to confess because his political opponents (who may have had affairs of their own, who knows) emotionally manipulated them into a fury. Welcome to politics, my friend lol

Do you seriously believe that is some American only thing? It was nothing but propaganda and PR manipulation. That’s happened with even the British Royal Family over the years. I well remember the scandals involving Diana and people still hate on Megan. That doesn’t mean the British people demonise heterosexual people. It just means that tabloids are good at stirring up stupid emotional responses in people. It’s kind of their job, really.

 

[Stevicus]

I will suggest the American males to visit Europe to meet some girls.
You just need to be nice

A lot of American men do that. I've come across websites and forums which favor the idea of men going overseas to find love and romance. There is a certain sub-set of American men who have complained about American women, although I don't know how numerous they are. That's also part of the "manosphere" and various movements supporting men's rights. But again, I don't know how widespread it actually is, since the internet can sometimes make things seem skewed and exaggerated.

 

[Estro Felino]

A lot of American men do that. I've come across websites and forums which favor the idea of men going overseas to find love and romance. There is a certain sub-set of American men who have complained about American women, although I don't know how numerous they are. That's also part of the "manosphere" and various movements supporting men's rights. But again, I don't know how widespread it actually is, since the internet can sometimes make things seem skewed and exaggerated.

I didn't mean to generalize of course because I do know that so many American women are great partners and wives.
I just wanted to explain that perhaps some women in the US are unaware victims of a "media manipulation" that makes them distrust the male gender.
I guess my video showed that in Europe, that's not the case.

 

[Estro Felino]

They forced him to confess because his political opponents (who may have had affairs of their own, who knows) emotionally manipulated them into a fury. Welcome to politics, my friend lol

Do you seriously believe that is some American only thing? It was nothing but propaganda and PR manipulation. That’s happened with even the British Royal Family over the years. I well remember the scandals involving Diana and people still hate on Megan. That doesn’t mean the British people demonise heterosexual people. It just means that tabloids are good at stirring up stupid emotional responses in people. It’s kind of their job, really.

Actually Diana's story shows that in Europe nobody has ever really blamed the Prince of Wales (now Charles III) for having a mistress, also because he was a victim of an arranged marriage.
Nobody has ever blamed Diana either...though...because she was a victim as well.

 

[Father Heathen]

Lying under oath about something private and irrelevant is no big deal.

It's like someone lied about eating pizza the day before.

You don't think deceiving and betraying someone you love doesn't reflect negatively on ones moral character? Isn't adultery considered a sin? I thought you said you were a Christian?

 

[Father Heathen]

I didn't mean to generalize of course because I do know that so many American women are great partners and wives.
I just wanted to explain that perhaps some women in the US are unaware victims of a "media manipulation" that makes them distrust the male gender.
I guess my video showed that in Europe, that's not the case.

Given the actual statistics regarding sexual assault/abuse/harassment, "media manipulation" (which doesn't make any sense to begin with) wouldn't be necessary.

 

[Father Heathen]

Trash source, thus invalid and irrelevant.

 

[Father Heathen]

Is catcalling "sexual harassment"?

Obviously, by it's very definition.

 

[Estro Felino]

Obviously, by it's very definition.

If I have understood correctly, catcalling is yelling at women how beautiful they are.
And leaving.
Harassment implies a physical contact. Right?

 

[Estro Felino]

Given the actual statistics regarding sexual assault/abuse/harassment, "media manipulation" (which doesn't make any sense to begin with) wouldn't be necessary.

Non sequitur, I guess.
The fact that some men are bad, it doesn't mean the entire male gender is to be mistrusted.

Same thing as for women. The fact that some women may be mean, it doesn't mean all women are mean.

 

[Stevicus]

I didn't mean to generalize of course because I do know that so many American women are great partners and wives.
I just wanted to explain that perhaps some women in the US are unaware victims of a "media manipulation" that makes them distrust the male gender.
I guess my video showed that in Europe, that's not the case.

I think the public/internet debate on the issue can sometimes get heated. Some people may have gotten too heavily jaded by the culture and have become more cynical. I started to recognize it in myself back in the 1990s, although I eventually realized that most of the problems I saw were not so much due to "men" or "women" or anyone's inherent identity. It has to do with an underlying root culture of greed, capitalism, and social Darwinism - which we were starting to move away from in the 60s and 70s. But with the rise of Reagan, that trend reversed almost immediately, and America doubled down on the "greed is good" mantra.

As for media manipulation, there's always going to be some of that, although that also comes through in deciding what issues are important enough to talk about, and which are of lesser significance and can be ignored.

 

[Father Heathen]

I guess I have the right to understand.

I don't believe you have a sincere desire to understand anything, considering that you continuously ignore everyone's explanations. Probably because learning something would require you to abandon your bizarre worldview.

 

[Father Heathen]

Non sequitur, I guess.

Don't be hard on yourself. Just do better next time.

The fact that some men are bad, it doesn't mean the entire male gender is to be mistrusted.

Nobody is saying that, but there is nothing wrong with being cautious and responsible in a world of real risks.

Same thing as for women. The fact that some women may be mean, it doesn't mean all women are mean.

Again, nobody is saying that.

As someone who identifies as a woman, you should be answering these questions, not asking them.

 

[Estro Felino]

I think the public/internet debate on the issue can sometimes get heated. Some people may have gotten too heavily jaded by the culture and have become more cynical. I started to recognize it in myself back in the 1990s, although I eventually realized that most of the problems I saw were not so much due to "men" or "women" or anyone's inherent identity. It has to do with an underlying root culture of greed, capitalism, and social Darwinism - which we were starting to move away from in the 60s and 70s.

Of course. That's for sure.
I may suspect this woman is doing this not because of glamour and style, but probably because she identifies with a way of thinking that makes her feel comfortable and feminine.

 

[Estro Felino]

As someone who identifies as a woman, you should be answering these questions, not asking them.

I have been telling my experience.
I have never had troubles with men. The men I have met were all courteous gentlemen.
I have never felt hatred or mistrust towards the male gender.

I was raised in a matriarchal family. None of my relatives have ever experienced something that might make mistrust men.

 

[Father Heathen]

If I have understood correctly, catcalling is yelling at women how beautiful they are.
And leaving.
Harassment implies a physical contact. Right?

Harassment can be unsolicited and unwelcomed sexual comments and advances. Most women consider it creepy, uncomfortable, disrespectful, etc.

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