More Cops Assassinated

[ShivaFan]

We need guns to protect ourselves from crazies as in the guy I am talking about in reply #60 http://www.religiousforums.com/threads/more-cops-assassinated.189178/page-3#post-4824835 above - Mr. Cosmos Setepenra and his melanin complex issue. He is the cop killer.

 

[Laika]

We need guns to protect ourselves from crazies as in the guy I am talking about in reply #60 above - Mr.
Cosmos Setepenra and his melanin complex issue. He is the cop killer.

Who is "we"? Given you object to cop killers having the right to bear arms, clearly it doesn't apply to the shooter? So who are the guns actually for if they aren't for US citizens to kill cops to defend their civil liberties?

 

[Debater Slayer]

Just a foreigner peeping in here.

I've noticed that most people who oppose Black Lives Matter have right-wing leanings or sympathize with the right-wing. Why is that? What's the connection? My hunch is that the left probably has it right (since I think the left is usually right on many issues, so I tend to trust its judgment far more than the right), but I admittedly don't know enough about the Black Lives Matter issue to reach a definitive conclusion for myself.

 

[Sees]

Just a foreigner peeping in here.

I've noticed that most people who oppose Black Lives Matter have right-wing leanings or sympathize with the right-wing. Why is that? What's the connection? My hunch is that the left probably has it right (since I think the left is usually right on many issues, so I tend to trust its judgment far more than the right), but I admittedly don't know enough about the Black Lives Matter issue to reach a definitive conclusion for myself.

The right/conservatives really are not into much of anything dealing with marginalization, victimization, etc. With this stuff people on the far left exaggerate and misrepresent some condition of inequality and the far right outright dismisses it - with most some place in between. BLM seems more polarizing than typical though.

 

[Underhill]

The media exacerbate the problem by highlighting only black deaths at the hands of cops.
In fact, more whites die this way. It's been claimed that the unjust deaths are disproportionately
higher among blacks, but this has been challenged by a couple recent studies.
One is actually a "working paper", so the results are limited & preliminary.
(The NYT seems to have jumped the gun.....so to speak.)
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/12/u...police-use-of-force-but-not-in-shootings.html
But this question notwithstanding, the news media are giving the utterly false impression that cops target blacks only.
This false picture creates far more racial resentment than would presenting blacks deaths as being part of a larger policing problem.
And BLM is whipping up this racial hatred, therefore bearing some responsibility for the nascent climate of war on cops.

I agree the media is inflaming things. But the problem isn't as simple as cops shooting people. That is the most obvious and most reported issue, but the incarceration rates and other racial disparities (which are very real) also play a role in the anger felt by black people.

None of this justifies killing cops. But downplaying the problems will not solve the anger problem in this country.

 

[Revoltingest]

I agree the media is inflaming things. But the problem isn't as simple as cops shooting people. That is the most obvious and most reported issue, but the incarceration rates and other racial disparities (which are very real) also play a role in the anger felt by black people.

None of this justifies killing cops. But downplaying the problems will not solve the anger problem in this country.

Dang it.
I completely agree.

 

[Debater Slayer]

The right/conservatives really are not into much of anything dealing with marginalization, victimization, etc. With this stuff people on the far left exaggerate and misrepresent some condition of inequality and the far right outright dismisses it - with most some place in between. BLM seems more polarizing than typical though.

"The War on Christmas"? "The gay agenda"? "Persecution of Christians" (in the U.S.)? "Attack on the freedom to have guns"?

It seems to me that many conservatives are masters at playing the martyr and embracing a persecution complex. Claims of marginalization, victimization, etc., certainly don't seem to be alien to them; it's just that, as far as I can see, many conservatives only welcome such claims when they have to do with their own perceived mistreatment, not someone else's. I don't see their criticizing Black Lives Matter as simply a matter of not being "big" on claims of marginalization, etc. Well, maybe they're not big on them when they have to do with someone else's rights. That much I could believe, based on what I've seen.

 

[Revoltingest]

Just a foreigner peeping in here.

I've noticed that most people who oppose Black Lives Matter have right-wing leanings or sympathize with the right-wing. Why is that? What's the connection? My hunch is that the left probably has it right (since I think the left is usually right on many issues, so I tend to trust its judgment far more than the right), but I admittedly don't know enough about the Black Lives Matter issue to reach a definitive conclusion for myself.

I noticed something similar....
People I agree with are generally right.
And people I disagree with are generally wrong.
It's a pattern.

 

[Debater Slayer]

I noticed something similar....
People I agree with are generally right.
And people I disagree with are generally wrong.
It's a pattern.

You probably wouldn't agree with them if you didn't think they were right, and the same goes for everyone else, so... that's just stating the obvious, isn't it?

 

[Revoltingest]

You probably wouldn't agree with them if you didn't think they were right, and the same goes for everyone else, so... that's just stating the obvious, isn't it?

Yup.

 

[Underhill]

Dang it.
I completely agree.

Son of a... what do I do now?

 

[Revoltingest]

Son of a... what do I do now?

Name calling?
Poopy head!

 

[Sees]

"The War on Christmas"? "The gay agenda"? "Persecution of Christians"? "Attack on the freedom to have guns"?

It seems to me that many conservatives are masters at playing the martyr and embracing a persecution complex. Claims of marginalization, victimization, etc., certainly don't seem to be alien to them; it's just that, as far as I can see, many conservatives only welcome such claims when they have to do with their own perceived mistreatment, not someone else's. I don't see their criticizing Black Lives Matter as simply a matter of not being "big" on claims of marginalization, etc. Well, maybe they're not big on them when they have to do with someone else's rights. That much I could believe, based on what I've seen.

There are definitely some who are into that sorta stuff, I think it is a much smaller margin. The passion for it isn't near the same. In the U.S. there are tons of folks who fit into the right/conservative category who aren't white Bible-thumpers - aka the prototypical religious right.

The majority of black folks I know who are out of poverty would qualify as right/conservative...and they are perhaps the most dismissive of BLM than any others I've talked to.

 

[Laika]

"The War on Christmas"? "The gay agenda"? "Persecution of Christians"? "Attack on the freedom to have guns"?

It seems to me that many conservatives are masters at playing the martyr and embracing a persecution complex. Claims of marginalization, victimization, etc., certainly don't seem to be alien to them; it's just that, as far as I can see, many conservatives only welcome such claims when they have to do with their own perceived mistreatment, not someone else's. I don't see their criticizing Black Lives Matter as simply a matter of not being "big" on claims of marginalization, etc. Well, maybe they're not big on them when they have to do with someone else's rights. That much I could believe, based on what I've seen.

It reflects differences in their understanding of equality. The right will say people are equal if they are equal before the law or have equal opportunity within a free market. Whereas the left is more prone to argue that people should have equal results and that the market is a highly discriminatory institution which protects and enforces racism as a cultural value.
The right would say "equality of outcome" is necessarily coercive because people are naturally unequal in terms of talents (and therefore the rewards will be unequal) and that "affirmative action" or positive discrimination is a reverse form of racism against whites by giving minorities an unfair advantage. the left meanwhile will say that these inequalities are the result of coercion and historic injustices which the right are perpetuating.

Both sides will claim victim good and persecution to a degree because of the ideologies (so it's best to look at the evidence and statitics and see what stacks up).

It's a ideological confrontation and the respective positions affects if you recognise a problem exists and what solutions you may be willing to use. It's part of the "Culture War" in the USA. My impression is that the evidence supports the view that a problem regarding race continues to exist but solutions are very difficult to find because of the effects of the polarisation makes it difficult to deal with the problem on top of the fact "racism" is a complicated, institutional and nebulous issue.

 

[Revoltingest]

There are definitely some who are into that sorta stuff, I think it is a much smaller margin. The passion for it isn't near the same. In the U.S. there are tons of folks who fit into the right/conservative category who aren't white Bible-thumpers - aka the prototypical religious right.

The majority of black folks I know who are out of poverty would qualify as right/conservative...and they are perhaps the most dismissive of BLM than any others I've talked to.

In the news......
http://www.mcclatchydc.com/news/crime/article89859017.html
Many black folk are pro-gun rights too.

 

[Underhill]

There are definitely some who are into that sorta stuff, I think it is a much smaller margin. The passion for it isn't near the same. In the U.S. there are tons of folks who fit into the right/conservative category who aren't white Bible-thumpers - aka the prototypical religious right.

The right is a wide spread group that ranges from bible-thumpers to slumlords and white trash living in trailers. (Have to get something started with someone, Revoltingest isn't cooperating.)

The majority of black folks I know who are out of poverty would qualify as right/conservative...and they are perhaps the most dismissive of BLM than any others I've talked to.

That's not really surprising. I imagine for one in that position you wouldn't want to rock the boat.

 

[Underhill]

In the news......
http://www.mcclatchydc.com/news/crime/article89859017.html
Many black folk are pro-gun rights too.

This just in, many anti gun leftist are pro gun too...

It's all in the definitions.

 

[Revoltingest]

This just in, many anti gun leftist are pro gun too...

It's all in the definitions.

"Anti gun leftist are pro gun too"
????

 

[jonathan180iq]

Do you guys ever feel like the idolization of police officers (and people in the military) blinds us to some of the ills that very obviously exist in their respective cultures?

 

[Revoltingest]

Do you guys ever feel like the idolization police officers (and people in the military) blinds us to some of the ills that very obviously exist in their respective cultures?

Yup.