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More Guns Do Not Stop More Crimes, Evidence Shows

Revoltingest

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
leibowde84 said:
No. Trump has gone in so deep on this one, constantly bragging about how he is going to IN FACT build a physical wall, if he went back on this one, he would look stupid even to his followers.
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I don't think is as dumb & inflexible as do you.
I'll enjoy your picture of a $100 bill.....loser-to-be!

Note to mods:
The last sentence is in the spirit of friendship...& gambling.
 
metis

metis

aged ecumenical anthropologist
Trump has said a lot of things about "the wall" and they haven't been entirely consistent. But then, he never is.
 
Thief

Thief

Rogue Theologian
leibowde84 said:
Ok, and I am saying, putting more guns in schools will mean many more "immediate threats". Any gains from having "good", "trained" teachers with guns will be outweighed by the increase in threats by simply having more guns in a crowded school with thousands of kids.
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can't fight armed intruders with pencils
 
Shadow Wolf

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
Thief said:
can't fight armed intruders with pencils
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What's an armed teacher going to do upon the event armed and trained professionals suddenly appear upon the armed teacher, armed teacher has a gun, and panics from the sight of the SWAT team with much bigger guns pointed straight at the armed teacher? Are we wanting to expect our teachers now to put their lives in peril if they get scared? And lets be realistic, it will do nothing to prevent school shootings, fail to address why we have them, and working to maybe prevent a few more deaths and injuries at best. And the shooters may potentially learn who is carrying, and could plan accordingly. And don't forget these are teachers facing a day they never thought would happen to them going to hunt down someone who made the decision to kill some time ago. The outcome is not favorable for the potential would be "good guy with a gun." That won't be the case in all shootings, and some will by happenstance be trained or have faced favorable circumstances in such closed in spaces, but school isn't shoot-em up flick. At best, arming teachers will save a few lives. It's a tiny-dot band-aid for deep and wide wound that requires stitches.
 
Thief

Thief

Rogue Theologian
Shadow Wolf said:
What's an armed teacher going to do upon the event armed and trained professionals suddenly appear upon the armed teacher, armed teacher has a gun, and panics from the sight of the SWAT team with much bigger guns pointed straight at the armed teacher? Are we wanting to expect our teachers now to put their lives in peril if they get scared? And lets be realistic, it will do nothing to prevent school shootings, fail to address why we have them, and working to maybe prevent a few more deaths and injuries at best. And the shooters may potentially learn who is carrying, and could plan accordingly. And don't forget these are teachers facing a day they never thought would happen to them going to hunt down someone who made the decision to kill some time ago. The outcome is not favorable for the potential would be "good guy with a gun." That won't be the case in all shootings, and some will by happenstance be trained or have faced favorable circumstances in such closed in spaces, but school isn't shoot-em up flick. At best, arming teachers will save a few lives. It's a tiny-dot band-aid for deep and wide wound that requires stitches.
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yeah yeah.....and scenario has already been played
some guy wrestled a gun from someone intruding upon a church

the police arrived.....and shot the good guy

might have played different if the good guy was concealed and carry

and saving a FEW lives is a serious consideration
 
Shadow Wolf

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
Thief said:
and saving a FEW lives is a serious consideration
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Except, in this case, it does nothing to actually address the problem of school shootings. Arming teachers is nothing more than a "see, we did something" that will do nothing and we'll still be having debates over gun laws every time a school shooting that catches nation news attention happens. It works about as well as a diabetic who gives up soda but starts drinking Kool Aid. Sure, it's less sugar, but it's still hardly optimal or ideal and not really a solution at all.
 
Thief

Thief

Rogue Theologian
Shadow Wolf said:
Except, in this case, it does nothing to actually address the problem of school shootings. Arming teachers is nothing more than a "see, we did something" that will do nothing and we'll still be having debates over gun laws every time a school shooting that catches nation news attention happens. It works about as well as a diabetic who gives up soda but starts drinking Kool Aid. Sure, it's less sugar, but it's still hardly optimal or ideal and not really a solution at all.
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shallow comparison

you don't stand ground against a firearm
unless you can shoot back

your stance continues to be......let's be fish in a barrel
 
Curious George

Curious George

Veteran Member
Thief said:
yeah yeah.....and scenario has already been played
some guy wrestled a gun from someone intruding upon a church

the police arrived.....and shot the good guy

might have played different if the good guy was concealed and carry

and saving a FEW lives is a serious consideration
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Do you mean to suggest it might have ended like the church shooting in Texas where Steven wiliford stopped a gunman?
 
Thief

Thief

Rogue Theologian
Curious George said:
Do you mean to suggest it might have ended like the church shooting in Texas where Steven wiliford stopped a gunman?
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not sure.....who can be

there is a law in Texas about firearm carry
it was prompted by a woman who lost her parents at a restaurant rampage

no one returned fire
people simply died

the new law opens the possibility of saving a few lives
 
leibowde84

leibowde84

Veteran Member
Revoltingest said:
I don't think is as dumb & inflexible as do you.
I'll enjoy your picture of a $100 bill.....loser-to-be!

Note to mods:
The last sentence is in the spirit of friendship...& gambling.
Click to expand...
Only time will tell, buddy. But, remember, you only win if no physical wall is built. I never said it had to run the entirety of the southern border, and neither did Trump.
 
Revoltingest

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
leibowde84 said:
Only time will tell, buddy. But, remember, you only win if no physical wall is built. I never said it had to run the entirety of the southern border, and neither did Trump.
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Hold on there.
I never said there'd be "no physical wall".
Only that the physical portion would be discontinuous,
& that it would be more than physical. Does this mean
we're agreeing more or less?
 
Thief

Thief

Rogue Theologian
leibowde84 said:
Emphasis should be on stopping them from getting high-powered rifles and stopping them from getting in the front door of schools. More guns in schools will mean more death if this happens again.
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and I believe in returning fire

give the bad guy something to think about....BEFORE he tries to be bad

he might get shot.....BEFORE he empties his rifle
 
SkepticThinker

SkepticThinker

Veteran Member
esmith said:
Why would it not be advisable to have trained school staff to have access to firearms? I would say your point would be workable if there was only one access to a school, and that access was protected physically and electronically. Response time of the authorities is in minutes, not instantly, and lives would be lost in the event of a armed intruder.
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All the schools around here have only one way in - the door closest to the office. You have to be buzzed in by school staff and then report directly to the office. All other doors are locked.

esmith said:
Your comment that handguns are not effective against a rifle is incorrect in many aspects, one of which is that a intruder does not know if they will be confronted with an armed person, hence they have to be more cautious in their approach. The other factor is that the idea of assaulting an area by oneself against the known fact that there are armed personnel probably will detour said attack. These shooters on the most part are cowards and are not willing to put their life in danger, unless they are willing to die, and we have seen that they flee or surrender when confronted.
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Actually, it seems like most of these shooters don't make it out alive, and probably don't intend to. At least half of them end up either killing themselves or getting taken out by police when it's all said and done.
 
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