Mother mary without sin?

[Starlight]

Do you really believe that Mary was a virgin?

I really believe Mary was a virgin. It is a miracle from God

 

[Starlight]

Another Bible contradiction.

That would make Jesus a blemished figure as the Bible states all have sinned.

Ortodox and catholics believe Mary was without sin. They also believe that belief is in the Bible

 

[Starlight]

It's not a sin to make out with the Roman army's football team, and when she got pregnant she thought it was no one's business so she made up a little lie involving God, not a biggy, but things got out of hand from there and now we have a religion and all the bloodshed that followed from that. I don't think she did it intentionally, I mean, how could she have known?

No mother Mary did not lie. She really was a virgin. A miracle from God

 

[Starlight]

I do not believe that Mary was without sin, nor do I believe Jesus was either.

Why do you believe that?

 

[Starlight]

The basic essential of Christianity is summed up here per Jesus' own words:
Matt 22:
34i When the Pharisees heard that he had silenced the Sadducees, they gathered together,
35and one of them [a scholar of the law]* tested him by asking,
36“Teacher,* which commandment in the law is the greatest?”
37j He said to him,* “You shall love the Lord, your God, with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.
38This is the greatest and the first commandment.
39 The second is like it:* You shall love your neighbor as yourself.
40 The whole law and the prophets depend on these two commandments.”

I agree with that

 

[YoursTrue]

Jesus practiced second temple Judaism. He is simply quoting from the Torah. "Your" God refers to the God of Israel, since originally this was Moses talking to all of Israel.

You can say what you want or what you think or have been taught. If I remember correctly, you believe much of the Bible is mythical, right?

 

[YoursTrue]

Jesus practiced second temple Judaism. He is simply quoting from the Torah. "Your" God refers to the God of Israel, since originally this was Moses talking to all of Israel.

You can say what you want or what you think or have been taught. If I remember correctly, you believe much of the Bible is mythical, right? Along with some others here who claim to be part of a religion that bases its beliefs on the Torah and/or what they call the "New" Testament.

 

[Brian2]

Ortodox and catholics believe Mary was without sin. They also believe that belief is in the Bible

Yes I think they say that because God was pleased with Mary (according to Gabriel) that she was without sin.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

You can say what you want or what you think or have been taught.

I try to give reasons and evidences for why I say what I say, so that it isn't "just" my opinion. For example, I said, ""Your" God refers to the God of Israel, since originally this was Moses talking to all of Israel." That's giving the REASON for my point, not just saying what I want or what I've been taught. When you reply to me, you need to address the arguments that I've made, not just dismiss my point as if I have not made an argument for it.

If I remember correctly, you believe much of the Bible is mythical, right?

I've said the Bible is MANY different genres, and that it is important to try to discern what genre you are reading in order to best understand it. For example, the story of Adam and Eve would be a creation myth. The story of Israel coming out of the Babylonian captivity back into the Land is history. The Psalms contain songs. Leviticus is a legal document. Proverbs contains wise sayings. You get the idea. You would not want to i.e. read in Psalms that the rivers clap their hands, and assume that this is scientific research paper that concludes rivers have literal hands that they clap. Understanding that Psalms are songs helps you determine that rivers clapping their hands is figurative.

 

[YoursTrue]

I try to give reasons and evidences for why I say what I say, so that it isn't "just" my opinion. For example, I said, ""Your" God refers to the God of Israel, since originally this was Moses talking to all of Israel." That's giving the REASON for my point, not just saying what I want or what I've been taught. When you reply to me, you need to address the arguments that I've made, not just dismiss my point as if I have not made an argument for it.

I've said the Bible is MANY different genres, and that it is important to try to discern what genre you are reading in order to best understand it. For example, the story of Adam and Eve would be a creation myth. The story of Israel coming out of the Babylonian captivity back into the Land is history. The Psalms contain songs. Leviticus is a legal document. Proverbs contains wise sayings. You get the idea. You would not want to i.e. read in Psalms that the rivers clap their hands, and assume that this is scientific research paper that concludes rivers have literal hands that they clap. Understanding that Psalms are songs helps you determine that rivers clapping their hands is figurative.

As you've said, two Jews, three opinions. Right? How about the oral law, what evidence is there about that?

 

[YoursTrue]

I agree with that

Yet the religious leaders decided to put Jesus to death, right?

 

[YoursTrue]

I try to give reasons and evidences for why I say what I say, so that it isn't "just" my opinion. For example, I said, ""Your" God refers to the God of Israel, since originally this was Moses talking to all of Israel." That's giving the REASON for my point, not just saying what I want or what I've been taught. When you reply to me, you need to address the arguments that I've made, not just dismiss my point as if I have not made an argument for it.

I've said the Bible is MANY different genres, and that it is important to try to discern what genre you are reading in order to best understand it. For example, the story of Adam and Eve would be a creation myth. The story of Israel coming out of the Babylonian captivity back into the Land is history. The Psalms contain songs. Leviticus is a legal document. Proverbs contains wise sayings. You get the idea. You would not want to i.e. read in Psalms that the rivers clap their hands, and assume that this is scientific research paper that concludes rivers have literal hands that they clap. Understanding that Psalms are songs helps you determine that rivers clapping their hands is figurative.

I am not saying I understood how God created the heavens and the earth. What I do know is that it says God's holy spirit or active force was working. I am saying, however, that as I kept examining the theory of evolution I find essential holes in the theory. Which literally renders it, in my opinion, null and void in its essence because there simply is no explanation.
I do not contend against the Bible. Even evolutionists propose that it is possible, but of course they're not sure (how can they be) that life may have begun on the earth from something that dropped on the earth from the sky. They don't know.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

As you've said, two Jews, three opinions. Right? How about the oral law, what evidence is there about that?

All forms of Judaism acknowledge Oral Torah, which today means the Talmud. They may ascribe to it different levels of authority, but in every case it is treated as valuable Jewish teaching. In general, Orthodox Judaism considers Halakha to be unchangeable and obligatory. Conservative Judaism considers Halakha to be changeable, and obligatory. And Reform Judaism considers Halakah to be changeable and voluntary. So an Orthodox Jew will most likely not eat pork, and most Reform Jews will eat pork, but both will say that pork is not kosher.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

I am saying, however, that as I kept examining the theory of evolution I find essential holes in the theory.

No offense, it is fine with me that you are a creationist, but quite honestly I think this is only possible because you have decided in advance of teh evidence that Gen 1 is historical, and emotionally cannot allow yourself to entertain the possibility that this is a mistake. You are allowing your religious beliefs to taint your objectivity. There are of course things in the TOE that are theoretical, such as to what degree natural selection drives evolution. But the fact that life has evolved is pretty much a proven then. There is more evidence for evolution than for gravity.

Even evolutionists propose that it is possible, but of course they're not sure (how can they be) that life may have begun on the earth from something that dropped on the earth from the sky. They don't know.

There are no evolutionists that think Gen 1 is historical. A religious text is never scientific evidence.

Whether the first life on earth came from a meteor, or developed via some sort of chemical evolution, we do not know. But understand that IF life came from a meteor, it only pushes the same question back a step -- where did the life on the meteor come from? IOW, it is not really an answer to the question, the question being how did life come from non-life.

 

[YoursTrue]

No offense, it is fine with me that you are a creationist, but quite honestly I think this is only possible because you have decided in advance of teh evidence that Gen 1 is historical, and emotionally cannot allow yourself to entertain the possibility that this is a mistake. You are allowing your religious beliefs to taint your objectivity. There are of course things in the TOE that are theoretical, such as to what degree natural selection drives evolution. But the fact that life has evolved is pretty much a proven then. There is more evidence for evolution than for gravity.

There are no evolutionists that think Gen 1 is historical. A religious text is never scientific evidence.

Whether the first life on earth came from a meteor, or developed via some sort of chemical evolution, we do not know. But understand that IF life came from a meteor, it only pushes the same question back a step -- where did the life on the meteor come from? IOW, it is not really an answer to the question, the question being how did life come from non-life.

First of all, I don't know what you mean by calling me a creationist. Would you say you are an evolutionist, by the way?
Secondly, off the subject here on this thread, I would like to say how terrible the wars going on now are. And yes, I believe God will stop wars, and resolve the problems, and as Maimonides also believed, bring back the dead. I'm sure you know who Maimonides is.

 

[YoursTrue]

All forms of Judaism acknowledge Oral Torah, which today means the Talmud.

J am aware of that.

They may ascribe to it different levels of authority, but in every case it is treated as valuable Jewish teaching. In general, Orthodox Judaism considers Halakha to be unchangeable and obligatory. Conservative Judaism considers Halakha to be changeable, and obligatory. And Reform Judaism considers Halakah to be changeable and voluntary. So an Orthodox Jew will most likely not eat pork, and most Reform Jews will eat pork, but both will say that pork is not kosher.

But although Judaism acknowledges Oral Torah, how about you? In other words, do you think Moses really existed and delivered the Oral Torah? What evidence is there that it was delivered by Moses? Got any?

 

[IndigoChild5559]

First of all, I don't know what you mean by calling me a creationist.

Meaning you believe Genesis 1 to be historical rather than a myth.

Would you say you are an evolutionist, by the way?

I certainly accept the TOE. But I do not claim to be a scientist or expert. I have a solid grounding in basic science, but am really not anything special. If you wish, you can read my post about the Basics of Evolution here: Evolution: the basics

Secondly, off the subject here on this thread, I would like to say how terrible the wars going on now are. And yes, I believe God will stop wars, and resolve the problems, and as Maimonides also believed, bring back the dead. I'm sure you know who Maimonides is.

Thank you for caring.

War is horrifying but is sometimes necessary. When barbarians ride over the hill to take your land, kill you, rape your wife, and enslave your kids, the only moral response is to fight back.

We had an incident on Oct 7 where Hamas terrorists invaded Israel and targeted civilians, including children -- we know this because we have recovered their written plans which included maps pointing out schools and youth centers to target. They cooked babies in ovens, tore fetuses out of wombs, cabled mothers together with their kids and set them on fire, beheaded people... There is nothing in the world that can justify this. It is absolutely unthinkable that Hamas be allowed to survive this.

Unfortunately, no matter how hard Israel tries to avoid civilian casualties, Hamas has placed its munitions and headquarters among civilians, such as hospitals and schools. IOW there is no way Israel can do what is necessary and still avoid all civilian casualties. All Israel can do is minimize the civilian deaths as much as possible, and that is what we see happening.

 

[YoursTrue]

No offense, it is fine with me that you are a creationist, but quite honestly I think this is only possible because you have decided in advance of teh evidence that Gen 1 is historical, and emotionally cannot allow yourself to entertain the possibility that this is a mistake. You are allowing your religious beliefs to taint your objectivity. There are of course things in the TOE that are theoretical, such as to what degree natural selection drives evolution. But the fact that life has evolved is pretty much a proven then. There is more evidence for evolution than for gravity.

There are no evolutionists that think Gen 1 is historical. A religious text is never scientific evidence.

Whether the first life on earth came from a meteor, or developed via some sort of chemical evolution, we do not know. But understand that IF life came from a meteor, it only pushes the same question back a step -- where did the life on the meteor come from? IOW, it is not really an answer to the question, the question being how did life come from non-life.

I didn't decide in advance that I would not believe in the theory of evolution. But when I looked more closely at the theory I realized there are parts that simply cannot be reconciled by physics, science, or biolochemical forces, including the construction of genes and dna. Does this mean that I don't think genetics play a part in forming an organism? Or that God personally designs every organism? No. I believe He started the process and can get involved when He wants to. For instance, I am sure He does not make deformities, but they happen. Because of genetics and situation., including outside of the womb influences that could be passed on, as we know some illnesses are hereditary.
There was a time when humans were not around. And history and science were not developed or recorded before humans started to.
I am not sure what you mean by creationist so it can be helpful to define exactly what we mean sometimes. If possible.

 

[IndigoChild5559]

I am not sure what you mean by creationist

I've actually said to you several times that a creationist is someone who believes Genesis 1 is history rather than a creation myth.

 

[YoursTrue]

Meaning you believe Genesis 1 to be historical rather than a myth.

I certainly accept the TOE. But I do not claim to be a scientist or expert. I have a solid grounding in basic science, but am really not anything special. If you wish, you can read my post about the Basics of Evolution here: Evolution: the basics

Thank you for caring.

War is horrifying but is sometimes necessary. When barbarians ride over the hill to take your land, kill you, rape your wife, and enslave your kids, the only moral response is to fight back.

We had an incident on Oct 7 where Hamas terrorists invaded Israel and targeted civilians, including children -- we know this because we have recovered their written plans which included maps pointing out schools and youth centers to target. They cooked babies in ovens, tore fetuses out of wombs, cabled mothers together with their kids and set them on fire, beheaded people... There is nothing in the world that can justify this. It is absolutely unthinkable that Hamas be allowed to survive this.

Unfortunately, no matter how hard Israel tries to avoid civilian casualties, Hamas has placed its munitions and headquarters among civilians, such as hospitals and schools. IOW there is no way Israel can do what is necessary and still avoid all civilian casualties. All Israel can do is minimize the civilian deaths as much as possible, and that is what we see happening.

I have faith that what the Bible, which you and many others believe is mythical, says -- that God will stop wars and there will be peace and life to be enjoyed forever on this earth. Whether someone believes it or not, the Bible essentially says this and I am thankful He transmitted His thoughts to His servants. Written down so we can read it today.