eudaimonia
Fellowship of Reason
Sunstone said:
Heaven is already an adolescent fantasy (where, for instance, one doesn't have to work), so why not go with it?
eudaimonia,
Mark
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Muslims: 72 Virgins in Paradise?
- Thread starter Djamila
- Start date
Heaven is already an adolescent fantasy (where, for instance, one doesn't have to work), so why not go with it?
eudaimonia,
Mark
Hmmm...we can say this is the personal opinion of your male firends but actually this has nothing to do with Heaven, you can say that those virgins of Heaven have no job except pleasing heaven dwellers, iam sure they know their job properly!!!!I think the caveat might be the "virgin" part. I don't know of too many men who are in a huge hurry to have sex with a virgin. Usually if a woman is a virgin it scares the crap out of the guy because they know sex is not going to be fun for awhile. Sorry, just what I've heard from many male friends.
God prepared for the righteous person very beautiful women created for this person specifically, he is the first to touch them, no one touched them before him, they are created for only one reason; to please this person, just him.
Some repliers said: "72 virgins??:areyoucra it will be like hell", actually i find such kind of comments is vey odd and iam wondering; why will it be like hell? what can happen to muddy the life there? will they fight, jangle, complain or something? why will it be like hell if there are no jealousy, no envy, no hatred, no grudge, no complaining, no aging, no death, no pain, no disease, no urination......every thing is perfect??!! Only love, peace, beauty, enjoyment and absolute happiness will be there; there will be no sorrow, no pain not even for a femto second!
If their number was 2, 3, 72, 1000 or even billions it won't matter because what i know that in any case heaven dwellers will get absolute pleasure but logically if the number is to be increased, there will be more pleasure.
eudaimonia
Fellowship of Reason
Buttercup said:
I suspect the laundry.
Sorry to disappoint you guys...................
From:- http://www.straightdope.com/columns/011214.html
The difficulty in determining what the Koran has to say about virgins and such is establishing what the Koran says, period. Translators vary widely in their rendering of the spare and often opaque text. For example, we find the following passage in a Web-based version of Islam's holy book (www.unn.ac.uk/societies/islamic/index.htm): "Verily, for the Muttaqun [righteous], there will be a success (paradise); gardens and grapeyards; and young full-breasted (mature) maidens of equal age; and a full cup (of wine)" (An-Naba 78:31-34). Whoa, one thinks--the Kingdom of Heaven meets the Playboy Advisor! However, most other English translations, both on-line and in print, replace "full-breasted maidens" with some tame construction such as "companions." Inquiring further, we find that the Arabic word at issue is WakawaAAiba, which appears nowhere else in the Koran. The French, less prudish in these matters, usually render it as something like des belles aux seins arrondis, "beautiful women with round breasts," so I think it's pretty clear what the Prophet, or at least his stenographers, had in mind.
Nothing in the Koran specifically states that the faithful are allotted 72 virgins apiece. For this elaboration we turn to the hadith, traditional sayings traced with varying degrees of credibility to Muhammad. Hadith number 2,562 in the collection known as the Sunan al-Tirmidhi says, "The least [reward] for the people of Heaven is 80,000 servants and 72 wives, over which stands a dome of pearls, aquamarine and ruby."
A little hype from the marketing department, you may say. Fine. Let's return to the Koran, Islam's font of religious authority. Even if we leave out the racy detail and make allowances for metaphor, we're obliged to admit that Islamic heaven is a pretty rockin' place, with an emphasis on sensual pleasures. The provision of virgins in indeterminate quantities is alluded to at numerous points, and you know they're not just there to fluff the pillows. (In fairness to the Prophet, the physical quality usually attributed to the houris, as they're called, is "wide lovely eyes.") The food, service, ambience., etc, are great. You're allowed to enjoy things the Koran explicitly denies you on earth, such as alcohol, and you won't even get sick. ("Wine . . . delicious to those who drink it . . . will neither dull their senses nor they will become drunk.") Granted, the whole thing is skewed toward the male idea of a good time, a defect by no means confined to Islam. Were Muhammad to found a religion today, I'm confident that each female arrival in heaven would be assigned a comely stud who would provide fabulous sex and in addition hang the curtain rods the first time he was asked. Granted, also, the emphasis on virgins is a little weird. (Think back on the first nights you've been party to. Was this your idea of great sex?) Still, you have to admit, heaven as Party Central sure beats the Christian idea of angels with harps.
I rather like these questions that arise from the prospect................
from http://www.factsofisrael.com/blog/archives/000079.html
1) What if the bomber wants girls with more experience?
2) What if one virgin is no good in bed? Does she get replaced or is he stuck with 71?
3) If he's gay, does he get male virgins?
4) What if he's celibate? What does he get?
5) What if he hasn't reached puberty yet? Does he get 72 Xboxes till he comes of age?
6) If he's bi, does he get 36 of each?
7) If he blows himself up while building the bomb, does he still get credit?
8) What do you call a relationship with 72 women, a menage-a-soixante-deux?
9) Are they like 72 wives or 1 wife and 71 concubines?
10) What if he's ugly or smells bad and the virgins don't want anything to do with him?
11) Is there viagra in paradise? Ya know, just in case?
12) Is there an age of consent?
13) When they're deflowered, do they get replaced by new virgins or are they "born again"?
14) Do they become his common-law wives eventually?
15) If he has a tryst with a 73rd virgin, do the others consider it cheating?
16) Do the virgins have a union? If so, can they strike if they're not satisfied?
17) Is there a temp agency that replaces virgins if they call in sick?
18) What if the bomber's into animals? Does he get accommodated?
19) Why 72? Is 71 too few? Is 73 too many?
20) If it was a female bomber, how do the male virgins prove their virginity?
21) What happens when paradise runs out of virgins?
22) Can a bomber make reservations on specific virgins before he blows himself up?
23) If there are no virgins available, is he put on a waiting list?
24) If he's a catholic priest, does he get 72 little boys?
25) Would you call a female bomber a bombshell?
26) Would you call a child bomber a bombino?
27) Is it not 73 out of respect for Barry Bond's home run record?
28) If the bomber previously dated one of the virgins, does it get awkward?
29) Do they have a bomb squad in paradise just in case one of the charges didn't go off?
30) Did they start using female bombers because they ran out of virgins for the guys?
31) If she's a lesbian, do they "convert" the virgins, or will straight girls suffice her?
32) Does a hermaphrodite bomber get hermaphrodite virgins?
33) If so, are there 72 available?
34) If they run out of virgins, do they get inflatable dolls till they find more?
35) If a bomber finds an infidel in paradise, can he blow him up and get 72 more virgins?
36) Could the Koran have had a typo and it actually provided just one 72 year old virgin?
37) Is Muslim hell being one of the 72 virgins?
38) Instead of 72 guys, would a female bomber settle for 1 man who does dishes and garbage?
39) Do the bombers go broke on Valentine's Day?
40) If he's monogamous, does he pick one of the 72 or does he get a supermodel?
41) What if he doesn't like either gender? Does he just klutz around in paradise?
42) Eternity is long, and eventually he'll grow bored of his 72 women. What happens then?
43) How does he pick the 72 to begin with? Lottery? Beauty pageant? Police lineup?
44) Is he allowed to covet his neighbor's virgins?
45) Do the virgins have agents and/or contracts?
46) If so, can a virgin request to be traded or put on waivers if she's unhappy?
47) What should he say if one of the virgins asks "Does this Burka make me look fat?"
48) If he gives the wrong answer, is he uh, screwed?
49) How is anyone expected to handle a catfight amongst 72 women?
50) Did the 9/11 hijackers who didn't know they were going to die get 72 virgins too?
51) Are scouts employed to find virgin talent?
52) Do the virgins ever retire, or do they remain virgins forever?
53) If they retire, what kind of pension plan do they get?
54) Wouldn't it be interesting if they're virgins because they're ugly?
55) So is it 72 Muslim girls or like 1 virgin from every culture?
56) Wouldn't it be sweet if Lorena Bobbit got hired as one of the virgins?
57) What does Gloria Steinem have to say about all this?
58) When he gets home, does he have to say "How was your day?" to all 72 virgins?
59) Do they have counseling for sexual addiction in paradise?
60) If the virgins start hogging the remote, is he in hell?
61) They must take up an entire theater when they go to the movies, huh?
62) Are there restaurants in paradise that can accommodate a reservation for 73?
63) If a virgin suffers from multiple personalities, is she considered two virgins?
64) Does he get all the virgins at once, or do they have an installment plan?
65) Is the bomber entitled to subsitutes, exchanges, or refunds?
66) What if all the king's horses and all the king's men can't put the bomber together again?
67) Is "not tonight, dear, I have a headache" a valid excuse in paradise?
68) Do the virgins come with a warranty?
69) If so, does paradise replace defective parts and provide on-site service?
70) What do you call a lifetime warranty if you're dead?
71) Do siamese twin bombers get 144 virgins?
72) Who gets to clean up all those nasty sheets?:cover:
From:- http://www.straightdope.com/columns/011214.html
The difficulty in determining what the Koran has to say about virgins and such is establishing what the Koran says, period. Translators vary widely in their rendering of the spare and often opaque text. For example, we find the following passage in a Web-based version of Islam's holy book (www.unn.ac.uk/societies/islamic/index.htm): "Verily, for the Muttaqun [righteous], there will be a success (paradise); gardens and grapeyards; and young full-breasted (mature) maidens of equal age; and a full cup (of wine)" (An-Naba 78:31-34). Whoa, one thinks--the Kingdom of Heaven meets the Playboy Advisor! However, most other English translations, both on-line and in print, replace "full-breasted maidens" with some tame construction such as "companions." Inquiring further, we find that the Arabic word at issue is WakawaAAiba, which appears nowhere else in the Koran. The French, less prudish in these matters, usually render it as something like des belles aux seins arrondis, "beautiful women with round breasts," so I think it's pretty clear what the Prophet, or at least his stenographers, had in mind.
Nothing in the Koran specifically states that the faithful are allotted 72 virgins apiece. For this elaboration we turn to the hadith, traditional sayings traced with varying degrees of credibility to Muhammad. Hadith number 2,562 in the collection known as the Sunan al-Tirmidhi says, "The least [reward] for the people of Heaven is 80,000 servants and 72 wives, over which stands a dome of pearls, aquamarine and ruby."
A little hype from the marketing department, you may say. Fine. Let's return to the Koran, Islam's font of religious authority. Even if we leave out the racy detail and make allowances for metaphor, we're obliged to admit that Islamic heaven is a pretty rockin' place, with an emphasis on sensual pleasures. The provision of virgins in indeterminate quantities is alluded to at numerous points, and you know they're not just there to fluff the pillows. (In fairness to the Prophet, the physical quality usually attributed to the houris, as they're called, is "wide lovely eyes.") The food, service, ambience., etc, are great. You're allowed to enjoy things the Koran explicitly denies you on earth, such as alcohol, and you won't even get sick. ("Wine . . . delicious to those who drink it . . . will neither dull their senses nor they will become drunk.") Granted, the whole thing is skewed toward the male idea of a good time, a defect by no means confined to Islam. Were Muhammad to found a religion today, I'm confident that each female arrival in heaven would be assigned a comely stud who would provide fabulous sex and in addition hang the curtain rods the first time he was asked. Granted, also, the emphasis on virgins is a little weird. (Think back on the first nights you've been party to. Was this your idea of great sex?) Still, you have to admit, heaven as Party Central sure beats the Christian idea of angels with harps.
I rather like these questions that arise from the prospect................
from http://www.factsofisrael.com/blog/archives/000079.html
1) What if the bomber wants girls with more experience?
2) What if one virgin is no good in bed? Does she get replaced or is he stuck with 71?
3) If he's gay, does he get male virgins?
4) What if he's celibate? What does he get?
5) What if he hasn't reached puberty yet? Does he get 72 Xboxes till he comes of age?
6) If he's bi, does he get 36 of each?
7) If he blows himself up while building the bomb, does he still get credit?
8) What do you call a relationship with 72 women, a menage-a-soixante-deux?
9) Are they like 72 wives or 1 wife and 71 concubines?
10) What if he's ugly or smells bad and the virgins don't want anything to do with him?
11) Is there viagra in paradise? Ya know, just in case?
12) Is there an age of consent?
13) When they're deflowered, do they get replaced by new virgins or are they "born again"?
14) Do they become his common-law wives eventually?
15) If he has a tryst with a 73rd virgin, do the others consider it cheating?
16) Do the virgins have a union? If so, can they strike if they're not satisfied?
17) Is there a temp agency that replaces virgins if they call in sick?
18) What if the bomber's into animals? Does he get accommodated?
19) Why 72? Is 71 too few? Is 73 too many?
20) If it was a female bomber, how do the male virgins prove their virginity?
21) What happens when paradise runs out of virgins?
22) Can a bomber make reservations on specific virgins before he blows himself up?
23) If there are no virgins available, is he put on a waiting list?
24) If he's a catholic priest, does he get 72 little boys?
25) Would you call a female bomber a bombshell?
26) Would you call a child bomber a bombino?
27) Is it not 73 out of respect for Barry Bond's home run record?
28) If the bomber previously dated one of the virgins, does it get awkward?
29) Do they have a bomb squad in paradise just in case one of the charges didn't go off?
30) Did they start using female bombers because they ran out of virgins for the guys?
31) If she's a lesbian, do they "convert" the virgins, or will straight girls suffice her?
32) Does a hermaphrodite bomber get hermaphrodite virgins?
33) If so, are there 72 available?
34) If they run out of virgins, do they get inflatable dolls till they find more?
35) If a bomber finds an infidel in paradise, can he blow him up and get 72 more virgins?
36) Could the Koran have had a typo and it actually provided just one 72 year old virgin?
37) Is Muslim hell being one of the 72 virgins?
38) Instead of 72 guys, would a female bomber settle for 1 man who does dishes and garbage?
39) Do the bombers go broke on Valentine's Day?
40) If he's monogamous, does he pick one of the 72 or does he get a supermodel?
41) What if he doesn't like either gender? Does he just klutz around in paradise?
42) Eternity is long, and eventually he'll grow bored of his 72 women. What happens then?
43) How does he pick the 72 to begin with? Lottery? Beauty pageant? Police lineup?
44) Is he allowed to covet his neighbor's virgins?
45) Do the virgins have agents and/or contracts?
46) If so, can a virgin request to be traded or put on waivers if she's unhappy?
47) What should he say if one of the virgins asks "Does this Burka make me look fat?"
48) If he gives the wrong answer, is he uh, screwed?
49) How is anyone expected to handle a catfight amongst 72 women?
50) Did the 9/11 hijackers who didn't know they were going to die get 72 virgins too?
51) Are scouts employed to find virgin talent?
52) Do the virgins ever retire, or do they remain virgins forever?
53) If they retire, what kind of pension plan do they get?
54) Wouldn't it be interesting if they're virgins because they're ugly?
55) So is it 72 Muslim girls or like 1 virgin from every culture?
56) Wouldn't it be sweet if Lorena Bobbit got hired as one of the virgins?
57) What does Gloria Steinem have to say about all this?
58) When he gets home, does he have to say "How was your day?" to all 72 virgins?
59) Do they have counseling for sexual addiction in paradise?
60) If the virgins start hogging the remote, is he in hell?
61) They must take up an entire theater when they go to the movies, huh?
62) Are there restaurants in paradise that can accommodate a reservation for 73?
63) If a virgin suffers from multiple personalities, is she considered two virgins?
64) Does he get all the virgins at once, or do they have an installment plan?
65) Is the bomber entitled to subsitutes, exchanges, or refunds?
66) What if all the king's horses and all the king's men can't put the bomber together again?
67) Is "not tonight, dear, I have a headache" a valid excuse in paradise?
68) Do the virgins come with a warranty?
69) If so, does paradise replace defective parts and provide on-site service?
70) What do you call a lifetime warranty if you're dead?
71) Do siamese twin bombers get 144 virgins?
72) Who gets to clean up all those nasty sheets?:cover:
jacquie4000
Well-Known Member
Michel,
Hey your not letting me down...lol I researched this alot yesterday. Their is nothing in the Quran about 72 Virgins. And the hadith that you stated that has the mention of 72 virgins is said not to be one that is followed by most Muslims.
Hey your not letting me down...lol I researched this alot yesterday. Their is nothing in the Quran about 72 Virgins. And the hadith that you stated that has the mention of 72 virgins is said not to be one that is followed by most Muslims.
jacquie4000 said:
Well that's the point; there does seem to be conflicting thought.....
http://www.islamworld.net/heavenhell.htm
Most of Those Who Enter Hell Will be Women
Most of the sinners amongst the monotheists who enter Hell will be women, as
is reported in as-Saheehayn, via Ibn 'Abbaas: in the khutbah given during a
solar eclipse, the Prophet (saw) said, "I saw Hell and I saw that most of its
inhabitants were women".
al-Bukhaari and Muslim report from Abu Sa'eed al-Khudri that the Prophet
(saw) said, "O women give in charity, for I have seen that you form the
majority of the people of Hell." They asked, "Why is that so, O Messenger of
Allaah (saw)?" He said, "Because you curse too much and are ungrateful for
good treatment".
al-Bukhaari and Muslim report from Usaamah ibn Zayd that the Prophet (saw)
said "I stood at the gate of Hell, and saw that most of those who entered
were women".
Muslim reports from 'Imraan ibn Husayn (ra) that the Prophet (saw) said, "Few
of the inhabitants of paradise are women".
This does not contradict the fact that every man in Paradise will have more
than one wife. What is referred to by the women who will be the majority of
the inhabitants of Hell is women who are descendants of Aadam: the
inhabitants of Paradise will have many wives from among al-Hoor al-'Iyn.
"Women will be few among the inhabitants of Paradise because in most cases
they prefer the immediate pleasures of this life, as they are less wise and
unable to keep the Hereafter in mind. They are too weak to strive and
prepare themselves for it, and are more inclined towards this world. In
spite of all this, they are the strongest factor in this world that distracts
men from the Hereafter, because men are inclined to desire them and they are
not concerned with the Hereafter. They are quick to follow those who call
them to deviate from Islaam, and reluctant to follow those pious people who
cal them to the Hereafter, and righteous deeds". (al-Qurtubee, at-Tadhkirah,
1/369)
Um....no comment.
I'm not sure I could enjoy paradise if I had to spend it with 72 virgins who were "perfect" in every way. I think all that perfection would get boring. Besides, where are their personalities? Where are their dreams, wants, and needs? Where are their insights and opinions? Where are their talents and skills? Where are all the things that make a woman more interesting than her body alone makes her? Perfection is nice, but it can't compete with a real woman.
nutshell said:
Yes, forever. If it was only once, then why to bother calling them virgins? it's known that all women are virgins in origin before they start their first intercourse with a male.
beckysoup61 said:
Truthful husband and she will be much more beautiful than the "hour".
Bright-ness said:
Of course, it's physical real heaven, not just spiritual.
The name is wine, but it has nothing to do with this wine which we know in this life. Even if there was an apple for instance, it would be totally different in it's taste and content than this earthly one. I hope it's clear now.
For more information, please read this thread below, post # 52.
http://www.religiousforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=40521&page=2&highlight=Islamic+paradise
Sunstone said:
I agree with you, i was thinking the same thing, who are they, and how?
Where is their personality?
The fact is that, they are not from the children of Adam and Eve. They are not like us at all. We are made of dust at the beginning, they are made of a totally different matreial which is a famous kind of perfum (not perfum but it's a tree which generate a kind of perfum). God created them ONLY for this purpose which totally different than the purpose of living for us human beings (men and women).
eudaimonia
Fellowship of Reason
Sunstone said:
I totally agree with you, but just to nitpick, I'd say that if the virgins lack personality and self-determination, that is precisely a lack of perfection. A "perfect" woman would have these.
eudaimonia,
Mark
De Otro Lado
New Member
I'm curious why many of us seem to transpose the corpreal world into the Afterlife (Heaven, Paradise etc...)? It would seem to me that the necessity for the invidual genders to have passed in this life. In ALL my readings of the different religions and such, there is absolutely no mention of procreation in the Afterlife. So it would seem to me that the term "virgins" can mean either sex or may implicit some new androgynous creation that we cannot understand at this time. In response to the less women in Heaven comment, I'm curious as to how some of you feel about the Gospel of Thomas verse 114 Simon Peter said to Him, "Let Mary leave us, for women are not worthy of Life." Jesus said "I myself shall lead her in order to make her male, so that she too may become a living spirit resembling you males. For every woman that who will make herself male will enter the Kingdom of Heaven." Sounds like paradise for the ladies to me ;-)
Popeyesays
Well-Known Member
The Houri of Islam, the Hagia Sophia of the Byzantine Church (holy Wisdom as a concept not as a building), the Divine Maiden of Baha`u'llah's revelation all refer to the Holy Spirit in its most nurturing form. I doubt physical maidenhood has much to do with it.
Regards,
Scott
Regards,
Scott
Mujahid Mohammed
Well-Known Member
As many clothes, jewels, trinkets, money, servants, cocktails, cruises, parties, pretty much any thing her heart desires.jacquie4000 said:And what about the women? What do they get?
Leftovers.................
Mujahid Mohammed
Well-Known Member
It is in the hadith.Djamila said:
Mujahid Mohammed
Well-Known Member
There are more women then menmichel said:
Yes it does this is something we as muslims do not say for you have no way of proving that for if you did then you will say you are Allah. There are more women then there are women and there always have been for the most part. But it has been much much more recently.
That is his opininon other scholars say different.