Muslims ONLY: The last Prophet was not the last of MESSENGERS

[tariqkhwaja]

Maro, Tashan, Nehustan (who should not be posting in a Muslim Only thread), Einstein, and not4me ... and especially .lava:

We are discussing here whether Messengers are last, Prophets are last, both are last, or neither. Pertaining to that discussion I have presented evidence. Please provide your take on the evidence presented and not on the people who present the evidence.

Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) said knowledge is the lost property of a believer. Wherever he should find it he should take it. So if someone presents to you an argument regardless of whether that someone is Atheist, Qadiani, Lahori (yes I suspect), Sunni, ****e, Christian, Muslim, or anyone else, take the argument not the person presenting it.

The presenter and presentation don't matter. What matters is the content of what is being presented.

So reply to the arguments please. Don't digress to who I am. We can do that on another thread.

 

[.lava]

Maro, Tashan, Nehustan (who should not be posting in a Muslim Only thread), Einstein, and not4me ... and especially .lava:

We are discussing here whether Messengers are last, Prophets are last, both are last, or neither. Pertaining to that discussion I have presented evidence. Please provide your take on the evidence presented and not on the people who present the evidence.

Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) said knowledge is the lost property of a believer. Wherever he should find it he should take it. So if someone presents to you an argument regardless of whether that someone is Atheist, Qadiani, Lahori (yes I suspect), Sunni, ****e, Christian, Muslim, or anyone else, take the argument not the person presenting it.

The presenter and presentation don't matter. What matters is the content of what is being presented.

So reply to the arguments please. Don't digress to who I am. We can do that on another thread.

i am sorry i did not reply yet. i am planing to i do not have problem with who you are or what you believe. so, don't worry.

i hope i would reply soon.


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[Nehustan]

Nehustan (who should not be posting in a Muslim Only thread)

And why is that? I reverted to Islam in 1993, not the best Muslim granted, but look who's making takfir now, there's an irony.

 

[As3ad]

Muhammad (PBUH) was the last prophet. Anyone who preaches the message of Islam just as the Prophet (PBUH) did is ok and might be considered a messenger but anyone who adds and removes things from it is an impostor. That's what I think.

 

[TashaN]

Nehustan (who should not be posting in a Muslim Only thread)

Why are you accusing him of being a non-muslim? who are you to decide who is muslim and who is not?

Please provide your take on the evidence presented and not on the people who present the evidence.

If a liar or an ignorant presented the evidence that i would have no interest to listen. If Prophet Mohammed wasn't a great honest man, no body would have listened to him.

His nick name was "the honest, and the trust worthy", that was Mohammed, peace be upon him. I don't know anyone in arabia who deserved such a nick name through history.

 

[TashaN]

And why is that? I reverted to Islam in 1993, not the best Muslim granted, but look who's making takfir now, there's an irony.

A British Muslim man came to visit my university here in Malaysia and has delivered a speech. I was there when he was delivering his speech and i wanted to ask him a question, and when i mentioned the word "revert", he somehow got upset and said that revert in English might imply to change from something good to something bad, and he prefered to use "embraced Islam", than "reverted to Islam". His name is Idris Tawfiq and he was a Roman Catholic priest. What do you think of what he said to me?
Idris Tawfiq - Bio details

 

[.lava]

And why is that? I reverted to Islam in 1993, not the best Muslim granted, but look who's making takfir now, there's an irony.

you have all the rights to post here as you wish. Muslim, non-Muslim or atheist could write & post under this subject, because religion and its knowledge for human beings. all human beings, not just for Muslims like yourself. don't worry, please.


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[.lava]

when i mentioned the word "revert", he somehow got upset and said that revert in English might imply to change from something good to something bad, and he prefered to use "embraced Islam", than "reverted to Islam". http://www.idristawfiq.com/3-1bio.html

i did not know that. yet i still do not mind how one could revert to Islam if he did not embrace it? i am not expert on English language though.


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[Nehustan]

A British Muslim man came to visit my university here in Malaysia and has delivered a speech. I was there when he was delivering his speech and i wanted to ask him a question, and when i mentioned the word "revert", he somehow got upset and said that revert in English might imply to change from something good to something bad, and he prefered to use "embraced Islam", than "reverted to Islam". His name is Idris Tawfiq and he was a Roman Catholic priest. What do you think of what he said to me?
Idris Tawfiq - Bio details

He has a point, people can use the word that way, i.e. his manners had improved but then he reverted to his old ways. However it doesn't only have that one meaning...

 

[tariqkhwaja]

And why is that? I reverted to Islam in 1993, not the best Muslim granted, but look who's making takfir now, there's an irony.

Oh you did? Sorry my bad.

I was fooled by the Avatar ... I thought you were Christian (what with the cross and all). If you claim to be Muslim you are Muslim. Bottom line.

 

[kai]

ah see! Tariq you should never judge a book by its cover !

 

[maro]

I was fooled by the Avatar ... I thought you were Christian (what with the cross and all).

ah see! Tariq you should never judge a book by its cover !

i guess it's not a cross . may be it's the pharaonic key of life....

 

[Nehustan]

Oh you did? Sorry my bad.

I was fooled by the Avatar ... I thought you were Christian (what with the cross and all). If you claim to be Muslim you are Muslim. Bottom line.

I like to call my path to Islam, 'The Path of the Templar' so my ideological slant on what Islam means encompasses the previous revelations. It, therefore, includes a fair amount of Hebrew (what some would call Judaic) and loosely speaking 'Christian' beliefs, especially in regard to ontology, symbolism, mysticism, and cosmology. As Jacques de Molay et al. are reported to have exlaimed 'Ya Allah'.

 

[Nehustan]

i guess it's not a cross . may be it's the pharaonic key of life....

The ankh and/or symbol for venus is a very interesting one. However, the cross is called a 'Tau shaped cross' and the reference is to Musa who raised a brass snake on a pole, to cure the tribes of Israel from their bites delivered by fiery serpents during their time in the wilderness.

 

[maro]

but muslims don't believe in the crucification ,Nehustan . don't you think that the cross is a symbol for something that clearly goes against what the quran teaches ?

 

[Nehustan]

but muslims don't believe in the crucification ,Nehustan . don't you think that the cross is a symbol for something that clearly goes against what the quran teaches ?

As to crucifictions, thousands of them happened. Depends who you think was crucified at Golgotha; I don't think Isa was. Also, the Christians don't have a monopoly on the cross as a symbol you know...

 

[tariqkhwaja]

So then no one has counter to my arguments? That has been the case till now.

Specifically posts 21 and 23 contain those arguments. What does everyone think?

 

[Nehustan]

So then no one has counter to my arguments? That has been the case till now.

Specifically posts 21 and 23 contain those arguments. What does everyone think?

I did reply, you just ignored me. Until such time as a revelation or guidance comparable to Muhammad is presented (which I'm 'not going to hold my breath for'...or did I say that?) then I see know reason to believe there is any message to still come.

The only proviso I made to that statement was that science would reveal what was previously unknown about the universe.

 

[TashaN]

You guys still debating this topic?

It's so clear like a sun.
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[FONT=Verdana,arial]Prophet Muhammad`s (PBUH) Farewell Sermon
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".. O People, no prophet or apostle will come after me and no new faith will be born. Reason well, therefore, O People, and understand words which I convey to you. I leave behind me two things, the QURAN and my example, the SUNNAH and if you follow these you will never go astray.

All those who listen to me shall pass on my words to others and those to others again; and may the last ones understand my words better than those who listen to me directly. Be my witness, O Allah, that I have conveyed your message to your people".

IslamiCity.com - Prophet Muhammad`s (PBUH) Farewell Sermon

 

[tariqkhwaja]

See argument counters are not meant to be other arguments. You are supposed to try and weaken or refute the argument I presented. Fine, I will answer yours then.