My son has joined islam

[McBell]

... don't you think people should not be harassed because of their religious beliefs?

that depends entirely on what those religious beliefs are.

Edit:
I take that back.
I hav eno problems with anything that people want to believe.
It is how they treat me and mine that I may take exception to.

 

[Badran]

that depends entirely on what those religious beliefs are.

Edit:
I take that back.
I hav eno problems with anything that people want to believe.
It is how they treat me and mine that I may take exception to.

I agree.

I was aiming more to mean that people shouldn't be harassed based on their choice of a religion, especially religions that holds different types of schools under it. If someone has a problem with certain things attached with Islam, there is nothing wrong with that. But to simply oppose Islam and muslims as a whole, is a different story.

 

[Breathe]

If he jumps from religion to religion because of girls, then the chances are that he will get tired of Islam, too, when he is no longer interested in the girl.

You should try to learn more about Islam, and his beliefs. Perhaps you should go to the mosque yourself and see what kind of Islam they teach there. Make sure he's not getting involved with the wrong crowd. Generally American Islam seems to be rather more liberal and moderate. Can't say the same for the mosque that's not so far away from me, though..

If he claims he is serious, then be indifferent to him: chances are he will either stay because he truly is, or leave because he is no longer getting any attention from you. Don't just read Islam sites. Read the Quran.

Wake him up for fajr (morning prayer), send him to go pray at the appropriate times, refuse to feed him during Ramadan (coming up, you know). If he doesn't like it because it's just a fad, chances are he won't stay. Don't let him eat any candies with gelatine (as it includes pork) in it.

If he doesn't stay, it's because it was a fad. It'll be more obvious when he's not allowed to eat many of his favourite candies, and is starving whether or not he's most likely to stick with it.

If he truly does stick with it, you'll have to accept it even though you may not find it palatable. If he leaves it, I suggest you get him to learn about the various religions, including your own. I would also suggest you get him to a shrink, still: he sounds like he has peer-acceptance issues and wants to fit in, and yet still wants to be his naïve, rebellious teenage self (didn't we all? ) at the same time.


Hope this helps.

 

[Badran]

I have since denied him the privilege to see his brother or sister until he gets out of this religion. It is very difficult to do and I may soften my stance, but for now this stands. I gave him the choice between islam and his family and asked if he thought it was worth it. He said he wasn't leaving islam, but that he still wanted to see his family. I told him he would have to decide and live with his decision. Though he never said he wanted to lose the privilege of being with his family, he refused to get out of islam. So i told him it sounded like he made his decision.

I have asked him if i am now the infidel. If i am the enemy. He said no. If holy war were declared, I asked, and he were ordered to kill me would he try? He said no.

That said, I know a lot of people who are muslim who are perfectly wonderful. From my dentist to people I attended school with to close friends of my Mother.

So don't you think you're being a little harsh, especially based on what he has told you so far, and based on your knowledge that being a muslim isn't necessarily a bad thing? I mean to put this choice to a 17 year old merely for exhibiting confusion and making rash decisions, may be you should take a different approach instead of this pressure you're putting on him.

 

[Tathagata]

Islam includes the books of Moses(Torah) in their teachings. So they share the Old Testament.

The New Testament is more equivalent to the Quuran.

Not really. Islam considers the previous texts to be corrupted and untrustworthy. The Quran is supposed to be the perfect revelation.

I am also not raising a child in the seventh century. I am concerned with what is happening now.

Nothing you said refuted my points. Even if Islam did follow the books of the Bible, that doesn't change the fact that you are criticizing Islam for being violent when your very own holy book is more violent than the religion you are criticizing.

So, can you honestly be disturbed by the supposed murders of Muhommed when your God committed global genocide and commanded that infants be "dashed to pieces" and heretical women be "ripped up"?


.

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

Shredmeister..
I can't understand why you are so worked up about this.
The little history you have given us as to the religious dalliances of your son, give no reason to suppose this will end very differently.

How ever I would be concerned if he fell in with a militant group. But no more so than if he were to become a member of the KKK.

Religion is one thing Terrorism and law breaking is another.

He sounds very immature for his age.

Your own attitude give me some real concerns, I am not saying you are a control freak, but you are passing close.

Let your son live his own life, and perhaps the outcome will end better than you think. In any event what you are attempting now will turn him against you and Christianity. and it could become permanent.

 

[The Khan]

To be fair, any person would be concerned if their offspring became part of a religion and culture which is completely alien to them.

 

[MacKinnon]

I am not at all okay with this.

He is 17 and did this behind his mother's back(we divorced years ago) and didn;t bother discussing it with me first.

Is this the problem, that he didn't discuss it with you first? If your son came and told you, what would you have said?

Why am i so outraged? Well........he has pretended to be many things in his teen years. More than what is normal. This is the latest example of him being something he is not.

If he is not serious about this latest search for a religion that seems to fit him, then it will pass. It may also pass if it is a serious attempt, and he finds later that it is not for him.

I have since denied him the privilege to see his brother or sister until he gets out of this religion. It is very difficult to do and I may soften my stance, but for now this stands. I gave him the choice between islam and his family and asked if he thought it was worth it. He said he wasn't leaving islam, but that he still wanted to see his family. I told him he would have to decide and live with his decision. Though he never said he wanted to lose the privilege of being with his family, he refused to get out of islam. So i told him it sounded like he made his decision.

Perhaps not the most assertive way to approach your son about your concerns. You're only hurting your family and your self this way.

I am mainly doing this to buy time while i figure out what I need to do.

At this point I would suggest apologising to your son and your family for how you have handled your concerns so far, and then making an effort to have a more open dialogue with your son. You don't have to like the choices he makes. But you are not acting in your best interest or your family's if you are being confrontational and judgemental about the decisions he makes.

I have been researching islam from all sides. Much of what I have learned is disturbing. Like the 9 year old wife, Aisha, situation. Muhammad was in his 50s. Gross. He was also murderous. He tortured. If people did not convert to islam allegedly muhammad's interpretation of allah's wishes was to kill those people.

And if people didn't convert to Christianity in the past they may have expected the same treatment. Another thing to remember is Muhammad is not Islam, neither are his actions.

That said, I know a lot of people who are muslim who are perfectly wonderful. From my dentist to people I attended school with to close friends of my Mother. however, they were born into the faith and didn't suddenly sign up because they thought a certain muslim girl was cute, and NOT after making large-scale threats against a number of people.

If your son is dishonest about his reasons and convictions, this will become clear very quickly. Shutting him out in the meantime is not going to resolve that issue. It's at least good you acknowledge that not everyone you have come across who is muslim exhibits the scary things you have learned about the religion. Whether they were born into it or not shouldn't matter.

I know I will likely be persecuted by some for this. But please bear in mind that i am not happy with his decision and that my reaction is temporary until I figure things out. That is why I am here. I know that I am opening myself to being judged and scorned. However, i do not know anyone here and I have only been researching this religion for a few weeks. I have no doubt that there are many here who can communicate with me in a helpful manner.

I would like some advice from fair-minded individuals on the matter. Especially if any of you have experienced something similar.

It is to your credit that you accept that you did not know how to handle the situation and have been making some attempts to research the religion. But this has to be done objectively. And it may be more constructive for you to be doing this with your son, rather than without him.

 

[Tarheeler]

As many here have said, I think you should talk to your son's Imam and see what your son has been exposed to.

Islam is no different than any other religion; it has its good examples and its bad examples. Keep in mind that Islam, just like Christianity, has different sects and schools of thought - all Muslims do not share the exact same ideas and beliefs. Those responsible for 911 are not examples of mainstream Islam; just as the KKK and abortion clinic bombers are not examples of mainstream Christianity.

Your kid might very well be going through a phase that will quickly wear off. But he could also be going through a very real spiritual search whose effects will last him a lifetime. You owe it to him, as his father, to learn about what he is going through and what is pulling him in this direction. If it is a phase, and he is like most children, your current reaction will probably only drive him farther away from you. If it is not a phase, then you are alienating your son, who is soon to be an adult, and creating a division that could last a lifetime.

You seem to be an intelligent guy who cares for his kid. Do the research, talk to the Imam and members of your son's mosque, and do some thinking about your perception of Islam vs. your son's perception of Islam. Then work with your son, instead of against him, to help him make an informed and heartfelt decision.

 

[Twig pentagram]

Perhaps re-reading what i wrote would clarify the matter for you.

I have issues with any religion or sect strongly associated with acts of violence. There are branches of Christianity that are just off the charts WHACKOS when it comes to matters such as these(eg abortion clinic shootings in the name of God). I disapprove of islam much the same as I disapprove of the Westboro baptist folks.

And please remember, I AM his father. He is a minor.

You're son is 17 years old, and you talk as if he is 10. Secondly your issues of violence are not with islam, they are with some muslims. Last but not least my response is not basically "you're bad, what's your problem". My response is a seventeen year old human being should be able to pick his own religion.

 

[Storm]

To the OP, has it ever occured to you that your reaction might be the reason he didn't want to tell you? You've cut him off from his siblings, for God's sake! How is this any better than a Biblethumper disowning their queer offspring?

 

[Storm]

This situation sounds quite serious. Normally I wouldn't say this, but you need to crack down on your son. One of my uncles did the same thing when a cousin tried to convert to Roman Catholicism. For example if he plans to fast during Ramadan say that he must eat with the family or he doesn't eat at all. It's your house you set the rules.

Seriously? You do realize that deliberately starving your children constitutes child abuse, right?

But after all this is America and people do have the right to choose what religion.

Yeah, we do. Even if it's unpopular. It's not grounds for psychiatric evaluation or justification for abusive coersion. It's a Constitutional right.

Please, if you're going to **** all over it, don't pay it lip service at the same time.

Wow.

If there is a friend's list here, I'm adding you.

THAT'S your reaction to the person telling you to abuse your child?!? Excuse me, I need to vomit.

 

[Kathryn]

Wow, lots of good advice on this thread, from many different perspectives. I haven't read thru all of them - there were so many - so I may repeat some points. Bear with me.

I am the mother of five - ages 28,26,24,22 and 17. So I have a bit of experience raising teenagers!

I think it's normal for kids to try out different philosophies and religious concepts - especially if they are intelligent and spiritually or philosophically inclined.

I raised my kids in a very multi-cultural environment, with a lot of emphasis on personal expression, independent thinking, respect for other cultures, and most importantly of all (in my opinion) respect for truth from ANY source. I taught them that though the bible is true - it is not ALL truth. We are a Christian family, but I allowed them to question, study, explore, etc without fear of rejection or ridicule.

That being said, I never hold back my OWN opinion on whatever it is they're delving into - in other words, I kept my apologetics skills honed. But I never - NEVER - ridiculed them for challenging the faith and values they were raised with.

I want them to form their own faith and value system and know it is theirs - OWN IT. Only then can their faith be strong enough to sustain them during difficult times.

But as I said, we are a Christian home and we go to church, don't take God's name in vain, observe Lent and Advent and other Holy Days, and that's the way it is in our house. You live in our house - you respect our faith. You are a minor - you go to church, including Midnight services on Christmas Eve! Funny how the kids always griped and caterwauled about that - but now they are nostalgic about it...

When my oldest daughter was 17, she dated a Muslim guy for awhile. She knew my position on that. But I also knew that irrefutable truth about teenage love - the more you oppose it, the more they embrace it (and each other!). So rather than make some big stinking deal out of it, I let it run it's course, though it was difficult since I personally do not encourage inter-faith marriages. Of course, I didn't expect her to get married at 17 - but you never know...And besides that, I always said "don't date someone you wouldn't marry." And I still think that's good advice!

Anyway - here's my point. I think you should go talk with the imam and learn what you can about your son's version and concept of Islam. Besides going straight to the source for information (always a good idea) this will show the imam that you, as his father, are going to be monitoring this situation. This is called accountability, and the imam surely knows that he is accountable to the parents of the kids in his congregation.

I would continue to learn all I could about the pros and cons of Islam. I'd engage my son in conversations at every chance about it - show him your interest, challenge his knowledge and his commitment, and DON'T ARGUE with him. Apologetics and arguing are not the same thing. Know how and why your faith differs from his new faith. And - show respect for common truths.

Teens are notorious for trying to shock their parents, and for rejecting their parents' ideas. He may be quite dismayed to realize that you agree with him on many of the teachings of Islam - that's UNCOOL!

Oh man, I could have some fun with this one. Learn the disciplines of Islam and then tell your son that you expect him to live his faith. Make him accountable when it comes to the laws and precepts of Islam. But at the same time, he lives in your house. The practice of Christianity is the modus operandum in your house. I would still make him come to church (if that's what you do), and continue to celebrate Christian holidays with the family.

Man, if he can keep all that up, my hat's off to him. That much religious activity ought to keep him out of a lot of trouble!

There's a lot of common ground between Christianity and Islam and if I were you I'd focus on that - you're not compromising your values, or ridiculing his that way.

I have a feeling this foray into Islam will run it's course with him. But if not - there's really nothing you can do about it. He's a young man - he has to make his own way.

Meanwhile, if you see signs of radicalism or violence with him, you must intercede. My experience has been that converts to ANY religious faith are more extreme and often more dedicated than those born into that faith.

By the way, four of my five children are now practicing and faith filled Christians. I have one "heathen" and he still professes Christianity - he's just sort of hypocritical about it right now. But he's young...

Peace be with you and good luck. Keep us posted!

 

[Father Heathen]

I think the love for and well being of your own child should become well before your particular perception of an invisible sky daddy. Both the heart and the brain should tell you that.

 

[Ordeet]

Seriously? You do realize that deliberately starving your children constitutes child abuse, right?

He won't be starving his child. If I would have said he can't eat at all for converting it would be different, but the kid has every right to eat meals with his family, just like everybody else in the OP's house. If he refuses and wants exceptions, the kid is responsible for starving HIMSELF. He's 17, which is old enough to have that kind of common sense.

Look, if the kid wants to go on some self-imposed hunger strike for one month because he thinks some magic sky fairy told him to, there are more serious issues than the kid getting enough to eat.

 

[Alceste]

Your son is not child. He's 17 - I was living on my own at that age. Imposing arbitrary and emotionally abusive punishments on him such as isolating him from his siblings and threatening to commit him to psychiatric care for simply refusing to bend to your will is, imo, deeply neurotic behavior. I would recommend you seek therapy for yourself and don't worry about your son, especially as his mother does not share your concerns. I would point out that cleaning up your own psychological back yard and trying to become a more nurturing and supportive father is not only the best thing for your son, but also the best thing for you.

You have a short window of opportunity left to build a foundation for the relationship you will have with each other as adults, which is coming very soon. If you don't lighten up PDQ, he's not going to want to see much of you as an adult and you will not earn his enduring respect. The more extreme your efforts to bash your son into the shape you would prefer, the more you will alienate the rest of your family - the mother, the son, the siblings - from yourself. You are creating "teams" - and from what you have said so far, nobody in your family is on your team but you.

Your son's exploration of different philosophies and identities is pretty normal for a teenager. To the extent that it seems more dramatic than other kids his age, I would question whether this might be due at least in part to your own controlling, judgmental behavior and the instability of his family background.

 

[Storm]

He won't be starving his child. If I would have said he can't eat at all for converting it would be different, but the kid has every right to eat meals with his family, just like everybody else in the OP's house. If he refuses and wants exceptions, the kid is responsible for starving HIMSELF. He's 17, which is old enough to have that kind of common sense.

Look, if the kid wants to go on some self-imposed hunger strike for one month because he thinks some magic sky fairy told him to, there are more serious issues than the kid getting enough to eat.

"I'll only abuse you if you _______"

"What do you say to a woman with two black eyes?
Nothing you haven't already told her twice."

Yeah, every abuser on the face of the planet uses that excuse. I didn't have to go hungry at my mother's house, either; I could have eaten all the drugged food I wanted. And if I hadn't kicked my child-raping stepfather in the balls, Mommy Dearest wouldn't have used a broomstick.

It's ALWAYS the victim's fault.

 

[Evandr]

I had problem years ago with my son trying to be something I knew he wasn't. During a loud and heated argument I suddenly realized something, he was who I raised him to be and he was not going to be something else.

I suddenly became very calm and said "this is at an end" He was a bit taken back and demanded to know what I meant.

I said that people everywhere are trying to change who and what they are, some spending small fortunes on professional help and drugs but to no avail, change has to come from the greatest depths of the heart and it takes time, a long time, for a change to truly become who we are. With that I smiled at him and said "you will become who I raised you to be and there is nothing you can do about it so I am not worried." From that point on I treated him with the upmost respect, honoring his decisions and I could not be prouder of him, a law enforcement officer, a family man and an honorable priesthood holder with whom I had the privilege of participating as he blessed his first son and my first grandchild with a name and a blessing.

Your son is not a Muslim and it is unlikely that he will ever truly be Muslim even though he goes through the motions. I think that it is most likely that he is feeding off of your reaction, getting the attention he craves and that his real problem is being masked by his demeanor.

If I were you I would not react badly and simply tell your son that you love him no matter what and that you have confidence that, in the end, he will do what is right and then let it go.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

To the OP, has it ever occured to you that your reaction might be the reason he didn't want to tell you? You've cut him off from his siblings, for God's sake! How is this any better than a Biblethumper disowning their queer offspring?

This. Yes. Thank you. :clap

 

[Alceste]

I was also wondering if you've considered the other things your son could have gotten involved with in his exploration of various subcultures. Perhaps you should simply be grateful that your son is into religion and girls instead of cocaine and street racing.