New age movement

[Father Heathen]

Oh come now...its not over until the fat lady sings. The prostitute riding the beast will come to her end. It doesnt work out well for her or her subjects.

There is always twenty 'buts' that can counter anything i say. I can also..'but' everything god wants too. BUT....even though god doesnt mind us questioning things...he does mind when we refuse to accept the answer. When we dont want the healing of god in our lives what is he suppose to do? Force us. He wont. God will not come to us on our terms.

When all we have had to rely on most of our lives is ourselves, letting go of ourselves and surrendering it into the hands of god is not easy. Everything else have dissapointed us. Why wouldnt god. And he will dissapoint as long as we try to do things on our terms.

I require something solid and substantial, but the "answers" given are nothing more than dismissive dodges. When it comes to the power and authority of gods, I expect results, not excuses.

Back to the topic:

Since god hasnt danced to the pipes of the world, they have decided to make themselves god. Smart move? Well i dont think so. It didnt work out for satan before...but he is stubborn and he's just not letting up. But this time he is dragging mankind with him.

We have become his test tube babies. He's way to greatness. He took a third of the angels with him when he fell from glory, and through humanity he might just get a host of subjects willing to fight against god. He might have lost the war once. But he thinks he can win it this time. With billions of people under his control. Billions who have surrendered their authority over to him. He thinks he has a good chance. Who will go down with him? Will he rush to your aid, when the mountains start falling. Will he rush to your aid when the whole sea turns into blood? Or will you have to be his slave.....with the nasty realisation that you were his pawn all along, and there is nothing in it for you other than death.

Satan knows what kind of world this was when it was first created. He is trying to make people believe that the same kind of eutopia is possible with his help. Or rather, right now hes making mankind believe that they can actually return to eden without god. And it doesnt have to realise, well because it never will. The nature of mankind without god is not keen on sharing. They will never completely reach the ideal of a world not run by economics. A world were there is peace and enough for everybody. But as long as he can make you think that you can achieve this goal, you'll be on his side. Of course when the son of god does appear with judgement, who will the world be fighting against? Against the one who has come to destroy this earth. The new earth aint going to be this one. The new earth will have no serpent seed, no beguiling influences. Filled with meek people who have no desire for power or glory.

When jesus returns. Satan would have made himself look like the saviour of the world, and jesus as the destroyer of this world. Who do you think man is going to fight against? When they have enlightened their senses with the fact that they are ONE with this world...that we are all one and connected, there will be a sense of unity. And especially when their common enemy becomes god, they will unite even more so.

I would not, could not, in a box.I could not, would not, with a fox.I will not eat them with a mouse.I will not eat them in a house.I will not eat them here or there.I will not eat them anywhere.I do not eat green eggs and ham.I do not like them, Sam-I-am.

What makes you think I would find the uninspired and uninteresting mythology surrounding a cheap Krishna imitation to be remotely credible or relevant? Why not spice up the story by tossing in Thor or Superman for good measure?

The new age movement is key to gathering satans army together. People who see a vision of peace and tranquility, of hope and generosity, where they can be who they want to be without any moral interference from others. And what will happen? Jesus will pitch up. And humanity will try to kill him, once again.

History has a funny way of repeating itself.

Heneni

Do you even do any sort of research on the stuff you incoherently ramble on about? We've already established the following once before, so pay attention - "New age" isn't one single belief or religion so it cannot be a centralized "movement"; it's just a collection of hokey, benign and obscure practices and superstitions that could never inspire any massive and organized social influence. If any religions pose a threat to the world, it's the powerful and influential ones like yours that meddle in politics and governments.

 

[methylatedghosts]

Thanks for the chuckle this morning, Heneni and Father Heathen!!!


As for the actual thread topic....

Here are a few of their beliefs:

1. Believe in the impersonal god/force who is one with the universe

2. Deny the reality of sin, evil and judgement

Denying something gives it power, and grants it's existence, doesn't it?

4. Deal with the anxiety and responsibility of your godhood by resorting to fantasy and mystical experience.

Depends entirely on who you talk to. The "fantasy and mystical experience" can come first...
Besides - if you're one with GOD why would you be anxious? that doesn't make sense to me.

5. Eventually encounter and submit control of your life to spirit guides and alien beings

This one is rather extreme, and is barely representative of your average "New-Ager"

How do these concepts contradict/support the message of jesus christ?

Almost anything will contradict and/or support it if you want it to badly enough - all it requires is a clever play with words.

Why do these concepts appeal to so many people?

Many reasons, including
Process of meditation and simply thinking about life, reality etc etc can lead one to these conclusions.
A recognition that the belief that there's only one single true way to do things, to live life, is close-minded and rather limited can lead one to branching out and exploring other beliefs including some that you've listed here, and more.

What are the dangers if any of accepting these concepts?

There are no dangers to accepting any concepts whatsoever. It's what is DONE WITH THEM that is dangerous. Concepts and ideas aren't inherently dangerous. But once you put an action to an idea, and you don't have the best intentions, you can harm people. Jonestown is a wonderful example of this.

 

[Heneni]

If any religions pose a threat to the world, it's the powerful and influential ones like yours that meddle in politics and governments.

Well the new world order seeks to transform politics as well. This encompasses the political agenda of how we view governments and laws to bring us into unity as global citizens instead of separate countries. World trade and commerce will unite us as global citizens for the 21st century.

Robert Muller former Asst. Sect. General of the UN said “The United Nations is much more than a political organization, it is a paradigm, the expression of a deep, evolutionary change which in the long run will transform the world for the best. 'No one can stop evolution ... A new world is being born in the UN.Political unification goes hand in hand with spiritual unification.

 

[Heneni]

Individual followers of New Age philosophies are at various stages of experimentation and different levels of its teachings. They may not belong to a particular group but are picking up what they like from what they read or hear. In the new age movement, truth is relative to the individual so they are not unanimous in their opinions, ask two New Ager's a question and you will probably get a different answer from each. The only absolute in the New Age is that there are no absolutes.

 

[Father Heathen]

Well the new world order seeks to transform politics as well. This encompasses the political agenda of how we view governments and laws to bring us into unity as global citizens instead of separate countries. World trade and commerce will unite us as global citizens for the 21st century.

Robert Muller former Asst. Sect. General of the UN said “The United Nations is much more than a political organization, it is a paradigm, the expression of a deep, evolutionary change which in the long run will transform the world for the best. 'No one can stop evolution ... A new world is being born in the UN.Political unification goes hand in hand with spiritual unification.

So tell us who the masterminds behind this vast conspiracy are; is it the Jews, the communists, the homosexuals, the Freemasons or the Illuminati? But seriously, don't you think it's slightly irrational and unrealistic to assume that every single thing you disagree with are all secretly aligned and allied together, sharing a same, single agenda in one unified, monolithic movement? How convenient.

 

[Father Heathen]

Individual followers of New Age philosophies are at various stages of experimentation and different levels of its teachings. They may not belong to a particular group but are picking up what they like from what they read or hear. In the new age movement, truth is relative to the individual so they are not unanimous in their opinions, ask two New Ager's a question and you will probably get a different answer from each. The only absolute in the New Age is that there are no absolutes.

Like I said, it's a collection of different beliefs and practices. What if I grouped all of the abrahamic religions together; Judaism, Christianity, Islam, Bahaism, etc. Would the fact that there are lots of differences and disagreements between them mean that no absolutes exist in abrahamic faiths? Of course not. You're being intellectually dishonest by misrepresenting and demonizing silly but innocent new age stuff as some sinister boogyman as a part of your nutty conspiracy theory delusions.
Also, the irony is that your own religion is guilty of almost everything you've accuse the new age "movement" of.

 

[Heneni]

I would imagine you would have no interest in any religion, being an atheist and all. But thanks for replying in the general religious debates section. ., You sure atheism isnt a religion then?

 

[Father Heathen]

I would imagine you would have no interest in any religion, being an atheist and all. But thanks for replying in the general religious debates section. ., You sure atheism isnt a religion then?

I have an objective, analytical interest in religion, especially considering it's a rather large aspect of society and culture, and impacts everyone whether they partake in it or not. It's a relevant issue that I have every right to address. It also has considerable historical significance. I also have an interest in honesty, accuracy and reality. Why would you object to me debating in the debates section? Perhaps you shouldn't share your beliefs openly if you feel that they cannot stand up to scrutiny and critique. If you want to sell your religion, try back it up with something solid, substantial and credible like facts and evidence.

 

[Heneni]

Alice Bailey had this to say about education in her book:

'Education in the new world'

1. The children of the future will serve One World (Planetary) Government and live in a one World culture.

2. Patriotism to one's country must be abolished and all national barriers destroyed in order to build a New One World Order.

3. Children will accept that Eastern mystical religion is to be married to Christianity of the West to forge a new, unified social and religious order of "universal Truths."

4. Teenagers and youth will rebel and revolt against their parents and against authority to help usher in the New Age World Order

5. Youth and all of humanity must accept that the time will inevitably come when grown-ups who refuse to become part of the new age will have to be killed. They are to be considered as lowly germs, an infection or blot on humanity that must be stamped out and eradicated

6. The traditional family unit is not desirable for the Aquarian, or New Age. Children belong to the government, to the world and the community--the human group--not to their parents. A new kind of family unit must inevitably come into existence

7. Young people must be taught to believe in reincarnation and karma (the Law of Rebirth) rather than the resurrection and judgment teachings of the Bible. This belief must guide behavior, especially the sexual conduct

8. Absurd and immature notions of "sin" and "guilt" must not be imparted to children by parents, teachers, pastors and other adults. A more permissive and worldly attitude must be adopted.

9. Children are to be taught that all religions--Christianity, Witchcraft, Hinduism, Buddhism, Islam, Judaism, Paganism, etc.-- are equally worthwhile and that it doesn't matter in which God one believes

10. The new generation of the youth must recognize that Jesus did not come to save or convert anyone; because no one is lost

11. Christian doctrines, such as that of heaven, hell, and judgment, must be discarded and the theology of the Old Testament must be repudiated

12. A New Age World Religion must be established without Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior. The Christian Church is dead and must be replaced

13. The coming New Age World Religion will emphasize the unity of all religions while rejecting Jesus Christ's profound Biblical statement, "I am the way the truth and the life."

About alice bailey:

Alice Bailey - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

So with the new age religion, the new world oder in politics, and the new world education philosophy im thinking that this movement has its feet in more than one area of our lives.

How much of the new world religion has already found itself into our school systems?

 

[Father Heathen]

Alice Bailey had this to say about education in her book:

'Education in the new world'

1. The children of the future will serve One World (Planetary) Government and live in a one World culture.

2. Patriotism to one's country must be abolished and all national barriers destroyed in order to build a New One World Order.

3. Children will accept that Eastern mystical religion is to be married to Christianity of the West to forge a new, unified social and religious order of "universal Truths."

4. Teenagers and youth will rebel and revolt against their parents and against authority to help usher in the New Age World Order

5. Youth and all of humanity must accept that the time will inevitably come when grown-ups who refuse to become part of the new age will have to be killed. They are to be considered as lowly germs, an infection or blot on humanity that must be stamped out and eradicated

6. The traditional family unit is not desirable for the Aquarian, or New Age. Children belong to the government, to the world and the community--the human group--not to their parents. A new kind of family unit must inevitably come into existence

7. Young people must be taught to believe in reincarnation and karma (the Law of Rebirth) rather than the resurrection and judgment teachings of the Bible. This belief must guide behavior, especially the sexual conduct

8. Absurd and immature notions of "sin" and "guilt" must not be imparted to children by parents, teachers, pastors and other adults. A more permissive and worldly attitude must be adopted.

9. Children are to be taught that all religions--Christianity, Witchcraft, Hinduism, Buddhism, Islam, Judaism, Paganism, etc.-- are equally worthwhile and that it doesn't matter in which God one believes

10. The new generation of the youth must recognize that Jesus did not come to save or convert anyone; because no one is lost

11. Christian doctrines, such as that of heaven, hell, and judgment, must be discarded and the theology of the Old Testament must be repudiated

12. A New Age World Religion must be established without Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior. The Christian Church is dead and must be replaced

13. The coming New Age World Religion will emphasize the unity of all religions while rejecting Jesus Christ's profound Biblical statement, "I am the way the truth and the life."

About alice bailey:

Alice Bailey - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

So with the new age religion, the new world oder in politics, and the new world education philosophy im thinking that this movement has its feet in more than one area of our lives.

How much of the new world religion has already found itself into our school systems?

Sounds like some pretty ridiculous and unrealistic rubbish to me. None of that is remotely feasible, on top of being blatantly contradictory. Sounds like the paranoid fantasies of mentally unstable fundamentalists with persecution complexes that have isolated themselves from the outside world. We're not living in a damn cartoon here. Just drink your cool aid and be done with it.

Even if a one world government was possible, by that point it would've progressed and advanced well beyond the need to employ religion as a social tool (especially the ones you've cited considering they would clearly go against such a government agenda, not that you actually know anything about the religions you're trying to demonize). And it wouldn't concern itself with Christianity or any other religion. Trust me, there wouldn't be any vast conspiracy singling out Christians. You're not as special as you like to think you are, wanting so bad to be martyrs.

 

[Dirty Penguin]

The new age movement have gained quite a lot acceptance among many people.

Here are a few of their beliefs:

1. Believe in the impersonal god/force who is one with the universe

2. Deny the reality of sin, evil and judgement

3. Believe that 'salvation' occurs when you become conscious of your deity and aware of your oneness with the God/force

4. Deal with the anxiety and responsibility of your godhood by resorting to fantasy and mystical experience.

5. Eventually encounter and submit control of your life to spirit guides and alien beings

6. Anticipate fullfillment in this life and in future lives through reincarnation.

How do these concepts contradict/support the message of jesus christ?
Why do these concepts appeal to so many people?
What are the dangers if any of accepting these concepts?

Cult/Religion....The line is blurry. Take your pick. Both fantasies are acceptable and even interchangeable and can co-exist......

 

[Heneni]

Sounds like some pretty ridiculous and unrealistic rubbish to me. None of that is remotely feasible, on top of being blatantly contradictory. Sounds like the paranoid fantasies of mentally unstable fundamentalists with persecution complexes that have isolated themselves from the outside world. We're not living in a damn cartoon here. Just drink your cool aid and be done with it.

Well apart from the last bit of verbal indigestion you added to your post later...lets see if it this whole education concept is not feasible.

River Song Waldorf School - Frequently Asked Questions

From this school which is part of the fastest growing educational movement...there is this question...

What is anthroposophy?
The term 'anthroposophy' comes from the Greek 'anthropos-sophia' or 'human wisdom'. Steiner expanded an exacting scientific method by which one could do research for her/himself into the spiritual worlds. The investigation, known also as Spiritual Science is an obvious complement to the Natural Sciences we have come to accept. Through study and practiced observation, one awakens to his/her own inner nature and the spiritual realities of outer nature and the cosmos. The awareness of those relationships brings a greater reverence for all of life.

Clearly this educational system is based on new age ideas. And its very feasible for the people sending their kids to schools where the Waldorf system is used.

 

[Father Heathen]

Well apart from the last bit of verbal indigestion you added to your post later...lets see if it this whole education concept is not feasible.

River Song Waldorf School - Frequently Asked Questions

From this school which is part of the fastest growing educational movement...there is this question...



Clearly this educational system is based on new age ideas. And its very feasible for the people sending their kids to schools where the Waldorf system is used.

So there are a small handfuls of kooky new age schools. So what? There are also kooky Christian, Jewish and Muslim schools. What's the difference? If parents wanting a particular kind of education for their kids is wrong, then we'll have to dispose of all other religious schools as well, including Christian (which I think does more damage to the minds of children than a new age school could ever hope to do). It boils down to freedom of choice. Anyway, I fail to see what any of this has to do with some magical government sprouting up and forcing people to enroll their kids. Tyranny and oppression is completely incompatible with the majority of new age and eastern religions anyway (you would've known that if you actually studied them), so it just doesn't make any sense.

FYI, I've edited and expanded on a few previous posts in the thread if you missed it.

 

[Troublemane]

So tell us who the masterminds behind this vast conspiracy are; is it the Jews, the communists, the homosexuals, the Freemasons or the Illuminati? But seriously, don't you think it's slightly irrational and unrealistic to assume that every single thing you disagree with are all secretly aligned and allied together, sharing a same, single agenda in one unified, monolithic movement? How convenient.

Oddly enough, the fundies create a conspiracy by unilaterally attacking the homosexuals, the communists, the freemasons, etc. When you marginalize people they tend to band together against you.

..if not by acting in concert, then collectively, their accumulated actions may seem to be conspired. When in actuality its merely a response to being attacked.

 

[Heneni]

Benjamin Creme who is supposedly in contact with the ascended masters. (Who is basically the driving force behind the new world order), has a magazine that has gained quite some popularity.

One major aspect of Creme's mission was the formation of Share International Foundation and the publication of it's monthly self-titled magazine. Each issue contains a brief synopsis of the emergence of Maitreya on the first two pages and then a brief message that has been trance-channeled through Benjamin Creme from an Ascended Master known simply as "The Master" on page three. The spiritual thrust of SI is clearly obvious in each issue that is published. Despite this fact, or perhaps because of it, SI has a long list of prominent, well respected international diplomats, religious leaders and political figures who have had articles published in this magazine. They include articles written by former UN leader Boutros Boutros-Ghali; present leader Kofi Annan; former President of Ireland Mary Robinson; Gro Harlem Brundtland who is director-general of the World Health Organization and former Prime Minister of Norway; the Dalai Lama; and recently even Britain's Crown Prince Charles. Even though the average man on the street would most likely dissolve into hysterical laughter upon being presented with the beliefs of Creme and Share International, it is easily shown that this magazine is well-respected and taken seriously by many influential members of the Global Elite. In fact, Share International Foundation is accredited as an official non-governmental organization (NGO) by the United Nations, and the magazine, as stated on the inside cover of each issue, is published by SI "...in association with the Department of Public Information at the United Nations."

 

[Troublemane]

...yeah, but benjamin creme is a common charlatain. if "new age" is going to be the label given to any fake, con man or stage magician with something to sell, lets include the televangelists who bilk old ladies out of their social security, tithing them to death while they have fleets of limos.

 

[Father Heathen]

Benjamin Creme who is supposedly in contact with the ascended masters. (Who is basically the driving force behind the new world order), has a magazine that has gained quite some popularity.

You give kooks and cons more credit then they deserve. And you never answered my question as to who the masterminds behind this "new world order" are. The Elders of Zion? Freemasons? Hulk Hogan?

Seriously, though. How can you cough up this absurd and insulting drivel and expect anyone to take it seriously?

 

[Riverwolf]

Alice Bailey had this to say about education in her book:

'Education in the new world'

1. The children of the future will serve One World (Planetary) Government and live in a one World culture.

Nothing wrong with that.

2. Patriotism to one's country must be abolished and all national barriers destroyed in order to build a New One World Order.

HURRAY!!!! :trampo::clap2:

3. Children will accept that Eastern mystical religion is to be married to Christianity of the West to forge a new, unified social and religious order of "universal Truths."

Again, I think that's a good thing.

4. Teenagers and youth will rebel and revolt against their parents and against authority to help usher in the New Age World Order

Isn't that already happening?

5. Youth and all of humanity must accept that the time will inevitably come when grown-ups who refuse to become part of the new age will have to be killed. They are to be considered as lowly germs, an infection or blot on humanity that must be stamped out and eradicated

Don't see how that's possible. The New Age movement is so open that they don't care what others believe. I don't think that will happen.

6. The traditional family unit is not desirable for the Aquarian, or New Age. Children belong to the government, to the world and the community--the human group--not to their parents. A new kind of family unit must inevitably come into existence

Don't see that one anytime soon, either.

7. Young people must be taught to believe in reincarnation and karma (the Law of Rebirth) rather than the resurrection and judgment teachings of the Bible. This belief must guide behavior, especially the sexual conduct

In New Age, there is no "must be taught"; if someone believes in resurrection and judgment, that's okay.

8. Absurd and immature notions of "sin" and "guilt" must not be imparted to children by parents, teachers, pastors and other adults. A more permissive and worldly attitude must be adopted.

That, however, is a problem, but not for the same reasons. This is a problem because of the lack of discipline.

9. Children are to be taught that all religions--Christianity, Witchcraft, Hinduism, Buddhism, Islam, Judaism, Paganism, etc.-- are equally worthwhile and that it doesn't matter in which God one believes

What's wrong with that?

10. The new generation of the youth must recognize that Jesus did not come to save or convert anyone; because no one is lost

According to gospels recently unearthed, he didn't.

11. Christian doctrines, such as that of heaven, hell, and judgment, must be discarded and the theology of the Old Testament must be repudiated

Again, this is not true. New Age people are very open to the Bible and God.

12. A New Age World Religion must be established without Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior. The Christian Church is dead and must be replaced

Doesn't this contradict #9?

13. The coming New Age World Religion will emphasize the unity of all religions while rejecting Jesus Christ's profound Biblical statement, "I am the way the truth and the life."

Except it's possible that those are the words of John, not Jesus. After all, if that statement is very important, why does it not appear in the Synoptic Gospels? Not to mention the Gospel of John almost didn't make it into the canon.

 

[Heneni]

I dont know william (father heathen)...how do expect me to take you seriously. If you think the new world order is some fly by the seat of your pants organisation, your in denial. I cant help you with that.


I dont care how wacko benjamin creme is. His magazine is wacko enough to be endorsed by the UN.

I dont care that the Waldorf system is not in every school. Its in schools.

I dont care that the new age religion has not taken over the world. It will try.

Now i hope to talk to you some more. But if your going to continue to be in denial about the movement spare me the trouble of having to answer Ok?

Heneni

 

[Father Heathen]

I dont know william (father heathen)...how do expect me to take you seriously. If you think the new world order is some fly by the seat of your pants organisation, your in denial. I cant help you with that.

I don't think it's an organization at all, actually. I think it's just some silly urban myth boogyman. Who are it's leaders and members? Where is the evidence? People who fancy themselves as some sort of divine superheros needed a supervillain to complete the fantasy, so they pulled the whole thing out of their ***.

I dont care how wacko benjamin creme is. His magazine is wacko enough to be endorsed by the UN.

I very much doubt it. Perhaps you could cite a source showing the U.N.s official endorcement? Btw, I googled Benjamin Creme and it just came up with a bunch of anti-Semitic conspiracy theory sites, but nothing remotely credible.

I dont care that the Waldorf system is not in every school. Its in schools.

So what? So is Christianity (which is far more dangerous, anyway.)

I dont care that the new age religion has not taken over the world. It will try.

But it's not a singular, homogenous new age religion. Something with no centralization or organization can't "try" to do anything, especially not anything that would go against its very nature. It's obvious you know abolutely nothing about new age and eastern religions, so you need to cease your slander.

Now i hope to talk to you some more. But if your going to continue to be in denial about the movement spare me the trouble of having to answer Ok?

What you call "denial" I call rational skepticism. I'm the kind of guy who demands solid evidence, which you've failed to provide. It's your kind of mentality that lead to the Jim Jones massacre.